building a rack

backlashs

hi i was just wondering what is the most used sizes of cam when climbing in Ireland any guidelines on building a basic rack would be great thansk

Tells

I found that I used sizes 1,2,3 when I first started climbing and as I progressed I felt I needed the half sizes 0.5, 1.5, 2.5 etc.. I'd say I use the 0.5, 1, 1.5 every time I go climbing!

If you're just starting out and being brought climbing, I would suggest getting a few screwgate karabiners, belay device, nut key and dyneema slings 120cm, 60cm x 2. This will allow you to set up anchors and belay without borrowing gear.

For single pitch climbing:
Obviously a helmet!
Harness
60m rope 9.5 - 10.5mm
Pair of prussics on a screw gate
Slings x 4-5
Screwgate karabiners x 5
Quickdraws x 6 various lengths
Nuts 1 - 13
Belay device - I use the Petzl reverso
Nut key
Cams - optional!

Hope this helps.

Sev

Firstly, if you want to save yourself a lot of money, find somebody who you'll climb with a lot and share the cost of a rack.

Myself and a friend started out with a single set of metolius nuts, 60m rope, 6 10cm sport quickdraws (they were cheap), 5 screw gates, 2 120cm nylon slings, 1 240 nylon sling and two or three 60cm dyneema slings with some spare carabiners, all of this was on sale one night for quite cheap in the great outdoors. This was enough to see us up some simple and short routes in dalkey, but it's definitely not enough.

Two or three weeks later we ordered a set of wild country nuts, 5 large hexes (5-9 rockcentrics on dyneema slings) and a few longer (15cm and 20cm and 30cm) quickdraws, and we disassembled most of our old 10cm sport quickdraws to use for racking carabiners. (10cm is a bit short for trad climbing outdoors, where extension is essential).

Soon after that then got a set of black diamond micro stoppers (we went for these over competing brands because they're quite a bit stronger than the others available) and a set of three DMM 4-CU cams, 1,2 and 3.

I'd recommend the DMM cams, they do the job, they're light and you get a good deal on a set of three. What's also nice about them is that they come with a doubled up dyneema sling, so if you rack each on its own carabiner, when you place them, you can immediately extend them and clip em. Whereas for example, the BD camelots have just a short nylon sling that isnt quite enough extension in my opinion, and it seems wasteful to clip a quickdraw onto it.

Later we doubled up on our cams by buying the half set of DMM cams, (0.5,1.5 and 2.5). We also got a tricam. Having 1 tricam of about size 3 is very useful for dalkey and other quarries where a borehole is often available for use as protection, cam's dont work so well in boreholes.

Our rack is basically complete now, we have all we need for long single pitch climbs and multipitch. Anything else we would want to add to that rack would be really just a luxury. For example, I'd considering getting some micro cams, like the wild country zeros, or an omega pacific link cam.

A few more tips.

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We don't have any small hexes. We only have large hexes, that cover the ranges that aren't covered by our nuts. They are our big crack protection. They're large and bulky, but they're certainly lighter than a cam of similar size would be. Hexes are tricky to place, and take some skill to place well, but are very good for setting up bomber belay anchors or just plopping them sloppily in a large crack as a desperation placement. They do however make fantastic clinky noises when you're walking, so everybody will know you're a serious climber.

I'd recommend buying two different sets of nuts. Different brands have different strengths. For example, black diamond stoppers and wild country rocks are very similar, and have a curved face that allows them to cam in horizontal placements.

http://www.cave-crag.co.uk/ProductImages/WIC_Rock-On-Wire-Set9-14.jpg

Metolius nuts on the other hand, have the curve running along a different axis, and on the whole are less curved and more tapered, and they wouldnt cam in a horizontal crack.

http://content.backcountry.com/images/items/medium/MET/MET0205/UCNDKBL.jpg

So having a set of metolius and wild country rocks is a nice combination because it allows you to select the right nut that most complements the shape of the crack. DMM wallnuts are different again, in a way I cant really explain.

I'd recommend having about 10 quickdraws of varying lengths (15cm-30cm). Although they don't all need to be store bought quickdraws on dogbones. It's nice to have maybe two quickdraws that are simply two carabiners on 60cm dyneema slings, racked so theyre 20cm length by default. This is then a very versatile quickdraw, that can be 20cm in length, 30cm in length, or 60cm in length in special situations where a lot of extension is necessary. Also, if at some point in your climb you require a sling to maybe sling a chockstone or loop around a spike, then you can cannibalize your quickdraw.

Also, if you have any aspirations to climb in the alps. Then I'd recommend you buy the lightest quickdraws and rope(s) you can afford. It may seem silly that people would pay more to buy quickdraws that are 30% lighter or smaller, it doesn't help much for just normal trad climbing on crags in Ireland. But if you have to lug gear 5 kilometers up a steep snow slope at high altitude, minimising weight is crucial.

It's also nice to have one or two very large screw gates. When you're setting up a belay anchor, you'll often tie clove hitches at your rope loop, and its nice to have a large screw gate that you can fit many clove hitches on.

A pair of prusik's are good to have too. I make them from 1.5m of 6mm cord (you can buy this in the great outdoors for like 2 euro a metre), when they're tied with a double fisherman they're just about the length of a 60cm sling and you can rack em around your shoulders. You'll rarely use them but they can be used for backing up an abseil, ascending a rope, and rescue purposes. If you run out of slings you can also use them as gear, to extend placements, thread a chockstone, loop around a spike. Also, if you need to retreat and leave gear behind, it might as well be a prusik that only cost 2e. I also clip the entire rack onto a prusik loop for storage and transport.

Also, to buy this stuff, I'd recommend ordering from www.jackson-sports.com. They're prices are fairly good and they deliver free and very promptly to Ireland. www.needle-sports.com is another worth alternative, there's also www.theoutdoorshop.com and www.bananafingers.co.uk

To answer your question about the most used cam size. That's a tricky one. The best way I can think to find out, is to inspect my cam rack and see which one has the most wear and tear. This is hardly a fool proof test and I can't do this for you now, because I don't have the rack with me.

My thinking (as a physicist) would be that since mountains and natural features are rife with power laws and scale invariance, then we would expect as a general rule that small cracks are more abundant than large cracks. This would lead me to believe that it is the smallest gear that we use most often, small nuts and small cams. Of course, on the other hand, small gear is not as strong or reliable as large gear. A large cam has a larger margin for error and a more reliable contact with the rock. You would not place a micro in a tiny crack when your 6 metres above your last gear, when there's a perfectly bomber large tapering crack for a number 8 wild country rock, or a big undercut for a size 3 cam. Likewise if there's a spot to place a size 0.5 cam, and a spot to place a size 3.0 cam, and you're in a tricky spot, logic dictates that you would go with the larger, safer cam.

So with these two opposing forces in mind, I'd hazard a guess that my size 1.0 DMM cam is probably my most used.

backlashs

thanks very much for that had no idea wat to look of so but no i do

Alun

Well, you learn something new every day ... when I saw the thread title I thought the poster had got lost and should have posted in the Woodworking forum (You can tell I'm not a climber!)

Sev

This is a useful reference :

http://www.psychovertical.com/?rockrackgear

Another useful piece of information : Wild country cam sizes are the same as DMM sizes, that is to say, a wild country size 1 friend is exactly the same size as a size 1 DMM 4CU. I think the same goes for clog cams too. But the BD Camelots have a different sizing system, e.g. a size 2 BD camelot is like a size 3 DMM 4CU

Theres more info on sizes here :
http://www.needlesports.com/acatalog/Mail_Order_Friends___Cams_24.html

Cookie_Monster

Alun wrote: »

Well, you learn something new every day ... when I saw the thread title I thought the poster had got lost and should have posted in the Woodworking forum (You can tell I'm not a climber!)

I thought twas going to be something about keeping kayaks secured somewhere:D

Esel

My post from a more recent thread.