Dole reduction for 18-20 and 21-25 year olds..

'Allo, allo, allo.


I posted this in the Bord Snippage thread a few pages back, but on one ever replied, so I thought I'd just throw it in it's own thread in the hope of someone having some info on it. Here's a copy/paste:


"I hope the reduction to €150 for 20-25 year olds only applies to new claimants. Although it would personally affect me, I tink it's a little ridiculous to take someone who is trying to get by on €200 to be reduced to €150. It's bad enough if you are just starting with the €150, but to be used to €200 and be reduced, i imagine the €50 will be sorely missed.



I have a question though, remember they changed it so that under 20's dole was cut to €100? They said that only affected new claimants. During the change-over, a 19 year old girl was on a FAS course with me. When she finished the course and signed back on the dole, would she have been reduced to €150 or would she be back on €204? I never seen her since the course so I don't know how she got on.

I guess what I'm asking is, does "new claimaint" mean an entirely unique claim altogether, or does it affect people returning to the dole?


Thing is, I have the opportunity to get in a FAS course at the end of August, and although I really, genuinely want to do the course and learn about the subject at hand, but I don't want to cost myself €50 per week for every week thereafter for trying to better my knowledge.


anyone got any insight there at all?"




I mean... I'm not exactly living like Hogan at the moment, so the €50, as minimal as it may be, will have a fair bit of affect on me.



Thanks to anyone able to offer any help.

Xiney

It is likely to be only for new claimants if they bring it in at all.

The reduction to people under 20 was only for new claimants back when they brought that in.

Hey Xiney,

Thanks for the reply, but I guess what I'm asking is, if I sign off the dole and then sign back on (when the course ends) am I considered a new claimant? or do I fall into a different (returning claim) kinda category?


Really don't want to screw myself by doing a course, you know.

Fol20

Why are you even thinking that way..i dont like it the some just freeload like this,when their next plan should be to get a job,not to go back on the dole..People who are thought in fas should have "dole" payments reduced as well...their being paid to be thought new skills:rolleyes:.

I think everyone in society has to take a hit,so why cant dole payments take a hit as well..Im a student working on min wage,and i think min wage is too high and should be cut as well to accommodate for the added pressures small business are having at the moment. .Ireland is still living in the good times when in fact we are in one of the worst recessions.

Sorry for venting,just i know of at least 2 people who are just completely abusing the system and are getting by easier than me,even though im working,and going to college,while their not doing anything except going out having a good time 4 or 5 times a week

Con1991

Fol20 wrote: »

Why are you even thinking that way..i dont like it the some just freeload like this,when their next plan should be to get a job,not to go back on the dole..People who are thought in fas should have "dole" payments reduced as well...their being paid to be thought new skills:rolleyes:.

I think everyone in society has to take a hit,so why cant dole payments take a hit as well..Im a student working on min wage,and i think min wage is too high and should be cut as well to accommodate for the added pressures small business are having at the moment. .Ireland is still living in the good times when in fact we are in one of the worst recessions.

Sorry for venting,just i know of at least 2 people who are just completely abusing the system and are getting by easier than me,even though im working,and going to college,while their not doing anything except going out having a good time 4 or 5 times a week

Sorry,but you can't possibly expect the FAS allowances to be cut as well:mad:.I am due to begin a Career Planning course on Aug 24th and I know there is still going to be no work once it is finished.People like you drag this country down and hold the less fortunate back.

stevoslice

Con1991 wrote: »

Sorry,but you can't possibly expect the FAS allowances to be cut as well:mad:.I am due to begin a Career Planning course on Aug 24th and I know there is still going to be no work once it is finished.People like you drag this country down and hold the less fortunate back.

thats right, people who struggle through 4 years of college, while having to work evenings and weekends, coming out with probably the same, if not less than the dole are the ones dragging this country down and holding the less fortunate back, nothing to do with silly little bankers / greedy developers / stupid corrupt politicians

fol20, unfortunately there are many, many people who are more than happy to be on the dole and get their €200 quid a week for drinking/partying, some people may not like to hear it but it is the truth. The jobseekers allowance in the north is only £50 per week.

oh and kkv, i'm sure you could ring fas and they would inform you of the way this goes about. i personally would weigh up the options for doing / not doing the course, e.g., will it make you more employable, is a €50 drop for a few weeks outweighed by a job that may come by because of the course. tough choices, but i'm sure you'll make the right one...:D

Con1991

Yes,exactly.The dole is MUCH less in The North and the UK in general.I think it's £64.30 in the UK and around £57 in the North.But you made a very valid point in that,with the current economic downturn,salaries are getting lower for even highly skilled positions.I have seen vacancies for Mechanics and Plumbers that barely meet the minimum wage,or slightly higher.And that is with 4 years training under your belt.And I have also seen vacancies for skilled office personel such as legal secretaries and payroll clerks that are the same.Maybe between 10,000 and 15,000 annually.Now,since when,WHEN can that be classified as a resonable wage of any kind?The courses FAS offer in terms of specific skills training vary in length and value,but most of them lead to work which will keep you on minimum wage or slightly higher for the rest of your life

eightyfish

Fol20 wrote: »

Why are you even thinking that way..i dont like it the some just freeload like this,when their next plan should be to get a job,not to go back on the dole.

Agree completely. I know a few people under 30 who were on the dole through the "boom years" and are still on it now. Hopping on and off FAS courses to keep the govt. happy. These people are in the pub 3 times a week. Also getting rent allowance. (I'm not saying that is you, OP)

It's not difficult to live on €150 p.w. with rent allowance. I lived on that for a year doing a "work experience" job while paying full rent. Admittedly it's difficult to get a job now, and I have sympathy for anyone who genuinely can't, but that should be first priority for everybody.

Con1991

eightyfish wrote: »

Agree completely. I know a few people under 30 who were on the dole through the "boom years" and are still on it now. Hopping on and off FAS courses to keep the govt. happy. These people are in the pub 3 times a week. Also getting rent allowance. (I'm not saying that is you, OP)

It's not difficult to live on €150 p.w. with rent allowance. I lived on that for a year doing a "work experience" job while paying full rent. Admittedly it's difficult to get a job now, and I have sympathy for anyone who genuinely can't, but that should be first priority for everybody.

You reckon?Often,people spend €150 on a haircut!!!I'm just trying to put it into perspective.Now this is just me,but if you have a family, a wife and kids,no less than a certain amount(usually 35,000 combined)will do to live in a comfortable manner.And the rent allowance is not permanent,it is temporary.the cost of living in Ireland is what makes the dole higher than other countries,otherwise the government would have cut the rate years ago.

eightyfish

Con1991 wrote: »

You reckon?Often,people spend €150 on a haircut!!!

I don't understand your point. You live on what you have. If you can spend €150 on a haircut, then fine.

Con1991 wrote: »

I'm just trying to put it into perspective.Now this is just me,but if you have a family, a wife and kids,no less than a certain amount(usually 35,000 combined)will do to live in a comfortable manner.

Oh, yes. I'm not talking about families. I'm talking about single young people (<30) on the dole "permanently" through the good times. Though, with a family you can also claim child benefit along with dole and rent allowance.

Con1991

What I meant was,it isn't all that easy to survive on €150 a week.But even if people are living off the dole,they still have to prove that they are looking for work.And they are also just stupid,because they could be earning much more if they got off their lazy asses and did something.

eightyfish

Con1991 wrote: »

What I meant was,it isn't all that easy to survive on €150 a week.

I know, I did it, though not by claiming the dole. It's not meant to be easy. It's meant to be cash to tide you over until you find a job.

Xiney

Deleted User wrote: »

Hey Xiney,

Thanks for the reply, but I guess what I'm asking is, if I sign off the dole and then sign back on (when the course ends) am I considered a new claimant? or do I fall into a different (returning claim) kinda category?


Really don't want to screw myself by doing a course, you know.

I believe it's a returning claim, but make sure you confirm this on your own.

Xiney

eightyfish and Fol20 infracted for breaching the forum charter.

Please have a read of it before posting again.


Ta

Xiney

eightyfish

Xiney wrote: »

eightyfish and Fol20 infracted for breaching the forum charter. Please have a read of it before posting again.

Point taken, apologies, should have read the charter.

Well this fairly went tits-up for me :pac:



To clarify, there's not a doubt in my mind that I'll be on the dole when the FAS course ends. There's not a doubt in my mind that I'll be on the dole for at least another 6 or 7 months. I've tried looking for work, left, right and center. As someone with a piss-poor formal education and no real in-depth experience in any one particular thing, I'm not exactly the most employable person in the world.


Part of this is because I am 21 and have absolutely no idea what I want to do with my life, and therefore generally spend it drifting from job to job with little or no interest in anything that goes on around me.


I'm fed up of that, and not having a lot of cash, I'm using FAS to learn as much as I can about stuff I may like in order to try and do something with my future. I don't care if people think I'm a scrounging, mooching bastard, I'm going to do what I feel is best for me at the end of the day. Currently I feel the best thing for me is to not lose out on €50 per week coming up to Christmas.


I went a little over the top a while back (during the "boom" as people like to call it) and spent a ton of money I didn't have. The credit union were my best friends. If my dole is reduced to €150 per week, then I have €60 per month to live on (approximately). I don't drink, smoke or really do anything these days. The most expensive thing I do is go to the gym, but I've only even started doing that last week. If my dole is cut I won't be able to even do that as much.


In short: I would rather skip a FAS course and remain in my current living condition, than get a low-rated FETAC certificate and live on €60 per month.

cee_jay

Deleted User wrote: »

I have a question though, remember they changed it so that under 20's dole was cut to €100? They said that only affected new claimants. During the change-over, a 19 year old girl was on a FAS course with me. When she finished the course and signed back on the dole, would she have been reduced to €150 or would she be back on €204? I never seen her since the course so I don't know how she got on.

I guess what I'm asking is, does "new claimaint" mean an entirely unique claim altogether, or does it affect people returning to the dole?

To answer your original question, if you are signing on for Jobseeker's Benefit/Allowance, and then go do a FAS course, when you sign back on you will be back on the 204.30 p/w.
There are a few situations where you get the full rate when you are under 20 - from [url]www.welfare.ie:[/url]
However, the reduced personal and qualified adult rate of Jobseeker’s Allowance for claimants under 20 years of age will not apply in the following cases:

Claimants with dependent children
Claimants with a qualified adult and dependent children
People transferring to Jobseeker’s Allowance immediately after finishing their entitlement to Jobseeker’s Benefit
People transferring from Disability Allowance to Jobseeker’s Allowance
Where an existing Jobseeker’s Allowance claimant gets a job and stops claiming the allowance but loses that job an ends up back on Jobseeker’s Allowance within 12 months
People aged 18 and 19 participating in a Youthreach course for young early school leavers or a full-time course in a Senior Traveller Training Centre
Claimants who qualify for the Back to Education Allowance full-time second level course or post Leaving Cert course
People aged 18 to 19 participating in a full-time FAS training course.
When a person on reduced Jobseeker’s Allowance reaches the age of 20, if they still qualify, they will be entitled to the full adult rate.

Carol, I could kiss you! (assuming you're female :pac: ) Thanks a lot for fishing out that information. Never even thought to check that website (forgot it existed, to be honest).


Cheers!

Elessar

What is this reduction to €150?! I never heard this. When is it coming into effect, and will it affect people already receiving the full amount in JSB?!

It was suggested by the Bord Snip crowd. We're not sure of the specifics or if it will be implemented or not, but the only thing we have to go on is the previous reduction that came in during hte year for under 20s. It didn't affect anyone already on the dole. Just new claimants.

Fol20

Con1991 wrote: »

What I meant was,it isn't all that easy to survive on €150 a week.But even if people are living off the dole,they still have to prove that they are looking for work.And they are also just stupid,because they could be earning much more if they got off their lazy asses and did something.

I remember one guy that came into work looking for a job.I just said to him to leave a cv and we will get back to you.Nope he couldnt do that because all he had on him was a dole form with loads of signatures saying theres no jobs available in x & y shop.All he wanted was a siggy:rolleyes:

Fol20

Fol20 wrote: »

I remember one guy that came into work looking for a job.I just said to him to leave a cv and we will get back to you.Nope he couldnt do that because all he had on him was a dole form with loads of signatures saying theres no jobs available in x & y shop.All he wanted was a siggy:rolleyes:

Were you hiring at the time?

If not, I fail to see the issue?...

muboop1

KKV... 150 a week is pleanty to live on.
If you are paying rent, apply for that benefit.

I agree its not ideal, and i understand why you wouldn't want to live on 50 less a week. But if you don't go out etc... what do you spend your money on?

Fol20

Deleted User wrote: »

Were you hiring at the time?

If not, I fail to see the issue?...

Basically he had no interest in getting a job,usually if your looking for a job you would bring a cv..all he wanted was a extra sig on the list so he could get the dole or whatever..

jimoc

I would have written on the form 'Jobs Available but applicant just wanted us to sign his form' then hand it back

But I'm evil

Fol20

Fol20 wrote: »

Basically he had no interest in getting a job,usually if your looking for a job you would bring a cv..all he wanted was a extra sig on the list so he could get the dole or whatever..

I can see your point, and you can usually tell the difference between those willing to look for work and those who will avoid it at all costs. Even if i know the chances of getting a job are slim to none, i'll still throw on a pair of shoes, slacks and a long sleeved shirt to pretend im making the effort.



The thing is, although Im lucky enough to have never had to do the whole signature thing, It would be so awfully embarrassing to go into stores with that, that i dont think anyone would be a CV anyway, as they'd just want in and out the door as quickly as possible.
That's how i'd be anyway.


I do agree with you for the most part though.

muboop1 wrote: »

KKV... 150 a week is pleanty to live on.
If you are paying rent, apply for that benefit.

I agree its not ideal, and i understand why you wouldn't want to live on 50 less a week. But if you don't go out etc... what do you spend your money on?

I have debt I'm trying to clear. Nothing too monstrous though. Not a house or anything, but I estimate that I'm about 6 or 7 grand in the red and I'd like to clear that. I live at home, so i cant claim any benefit i dont believe, but I obviously still give my dad a fair few € a week. He's not working either, but he's still human and i know he appreciates the extra few € per week.

I currently have only one pair of wearable shoes, and they're on their way to the bin soon, too, as the soles are going pretty poor on them (although thankfully I tend to wear actual shoes most of the time and not runners, so i can still clean them up and they look clean/presentable in the event of interviews or anything).

I also have my net connection, which is about €50 per month, but I could probably never get rid of that. Its pretty much all i do at home, and it pays for itself really, what with all the freely accessible entertainment and so forth on here.


It's just difficult, but i agree, it is do-able. I know that Ireland has all the prospects of a Toilet Duck, but the attitude everyone in the country seems to have is, as Del-boy once said, "Pull the ladder up Jack, and sod the rest", so I'm not going to be any different. You have to look out for yourself, cos no one else will, and jobs don't seem to be anywhere to be seen.

Thank god for FAS is all i can say. A shoddy service at times, I'm told, but they've yet to do me wrong!