Lisbon Treaty, Yes and No: Please post media here

ButcherBoiz

It might be a good idea for people wondering about the debate over Lisbon, whether a Yes or a No voter, to post links to any media clips (RTE, BBC Youtube, etc.) here. As the voting day comes closer, then we can all peruse media for both sides of the case in one location.

I'll start it off by posting a couple of clips.

1. For the Yes side:

2. For the No side:

Please add any media (radio/TV/text) you find interesting. Hopefully there will be a balance to include both sides.

ei.sdraob

how is your post balanced?

you already managed to start several threads with points that have been extensively discussed and debunked


and also our videos are not balanced

one has 3 stars the other one has 5 stars

ButcherBoiz

Irish Congress of Trade Unions (2008): for a yes Note.

Some 2008 clips (including Mary Lou McDonald in the Euro Parliament): for a no vote/respecting first vote:

FutureTaoiseach

ButcherBoiz

ei.sdraob wrote: »

how is your post balanced?

you already managed to start several threads with points that have been extensively discussed and debunked


and also our videos are not balanced

one has 3 stars the other one has 5 stars

Thanks for posting... if you're unhappy, please post your own video links.

ei.sdraob

ButcherBoiz wrote: »

Thanks for posting... if you're unhappy, please post your own video links.

you second post is unbalanced too

YES video is 1min long

NO video is 10mins long (and it includes mental torture in the form of listening to Lou)

Martin 2

As regards the first post, the No video is from the Bruges group, a predominately British group of Eurosceptics... in fact, as far as I know, the good people of Bruges (a very beautiful and historical city in Belgium) are at pains to distance their town from any association with the views of this group... and did they actually have a picture of Margaret Thatcher on the front of the podium, hardly likely to go down well with the nationalist No vote.

As for FutureTaoiseach's post (#4), the music in the background sounded like something from the Omen. The piece on Eamonn De Valera is entertaining, but it should be remembered that De Valera's isolationism and failed economic policies were one of the reasons that led us to join the EEC (later EU). Sean Lemass when ushering in an end to De Valera's economic era said "what use is independence if it doesn't improve the lives of our people"*

*I heard this quote on a recent RTE documentary but I can't find a print source for it... help appreciated.

ButcherBoiz

Thanks for your comments. I don't think there should be any set criteria for vids posted. Every source can be examined. The point is the content of the videos, i.e. the arguments. At the end of the day we can poke fun at just about any political group or person, but it should be the points made (or not made) that count?

If you find that article please post it, or any vids or audio or anything you find that you think is worth a listen.

Martin 2

ButcherBoiz wrote: »

Thanks for your comments. I don't think there should be any set criteria for vids posted. Every source can be examined. The point is the content of the videos, i.e. the arguments. At the end of the day we can poke fun at just about any political group or person, but it should be the points made (or not made) that count?

If you find that article please post it, or any vids or audio or anything you find that you think is worth a listen.

Fair enough.

simplistic

Legal guarantees? what guarantees? Giving the Irish worthless guarantees, the treaty "will not need to be renegotiated".

ei.sdraob

simplistic wrote: »

Legal guarantees? what guarantees? Giving the Irish worthless guarantees, the treaty "will not need to be renegotiated".

considering that the guarantees were not needed in first place since the issues raised by the people had nothing to do with Lisbon

see???

PopeBuckfastXVI

ei.sdraob wrote: »

considering that the guarantees were not needed in first place since the issues raised by the people had nothing to do with Lisbon

see???

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

BlitzKrieg

I always find it fascinating that a number of people describe me as *a sheep and I follow whatever I am told by the media* because I am in favour of a yes vote...

yet they are the same that use the media to prove their points...


you know dont bother discussing the actual treaty instead put a video of someone else saying the treaty is bad...


*sigh*

but hey lets get a few up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCUF5t1kRlI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8oUyFS556s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzfngEzmiSs

ButcherBoiz

Going forward... it might be best to stick to vids specifically about the Lisbon Treaty I and II. General background or historical information is interesting and relevant but there is just so much of it out there, and it might dilute the issue.

Also, comments on all the videos is a bit ambitious for one thread. There are several discussion threads already. The simple idea here is to put together in one place what different forum members consider to be the best videos, radio clips or articles.

Thanks again, and well done to anyone who contributes here or elsewhere and is taking an active interest in the debate... all to often people (perhaps understandably) don't seem to have the enthusiasm to engage in matters that effect wider society.

ButcherBoiz

BlitzKrieg

FutureTaoiseach wrote: »

hmmm

Am I the only one grinning because in that video good old DeValera was talking about the Council Of Europe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_europe)

NOT the European Union (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Council).

Considering that a core aspect of the European Union is a series of institutions to facilitate cooperation...*Organs for co-operation* if you want to take old Dev's words.



Also you automatically loose respect for any video which uses the Micheal Collins film as a representation of the *Irish* struggle.

procure11

this is hillarious...but true


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3vEOSkk5AM

ButcherBoiz

Why not post your own vids, radio clips or articles here so everyone is represented? That's the purpose of the thread --to get the best media into one place for people to go through it. Also, if you like a video, maybe hit the thumbs up button, and if you disagree with a video, don't click the thanks button. There are several discussion threads already. But thanks for the comments.

Judith122

Judith122

procure11 wrote: »

this is hillarious...but true


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3vEOSkk5AM

what is he like!

Scofflaw

Hmm. Where exactly is the discussion here?

moderately,
Scofflaw

worldrepublic

worldrepublic

Scofflaw

OK, well, this has gone exactly as one might expect. A stream of videos with no discussion or even an attempt at explaining the contents. The existence of many of these events is beyond doubt - the eurosceptics did indeed pull the green jersey stunt - but what is there to debate in them.

The new posters can either read and stick to the forum rules, or they will find themselves out on their ears.

moderately,
Scofflaw