A bike that climbs like a monkey on crack

WhyFronts?

.....as the old saying goes.

I want one.

Any recommendations?

I have completed La Marmotte and Etape a few times in recent years and I'm looking to step up from my Roubaix. Anybody have any suggestions as to what road bikes are tailor-made for the hills? I'm not really too interested in the flats (although it'd be nice to do them reasonably quickly too). Price wise I'm willing to splurge if needs be

All feedback gratefully received!

Lumen

This.

Seriously, what's the budget? Or is this really "fantasy climbing bike" time?

WhyFronts?

Well I wouldn't go above €4,000

But if there are fantasy bikes out there that cost more, I'm happy to look at the pictures

ROK ON

If you have completed those sportifs a few times you are obviously handy enough on the bike.
Why not spend the money on a coach or coaching aid (powertap?).
Also have a look on weight weenies and try to put an ultralight weight bike together from scratch.

blorg

@WhyFronts?- are you already as light as you possibly can be? Bear in mind that sometimes with the ultra light stuff there are tradeoffs with durability, stiffness, and aerodynamics.

WhyFronts?

Did Marmotte a few weeks ago and I was about as light as possible. Give it another couple of months though........

scottreynolds

Me, I'd buy in order.....

-Conalgo - EPS or something like that. I've always wanted a Conalgo and the pros still think they are awesome.
-Cervelo - R3 cool bike. Cool team
-Scott Addict R2 (I have a Scott Addict and I love it).
-A Ti Bike... Its supposed to be good for long sportives.

..... if I could justify it.

I'm planning to do the Marmotte and eTape next year but who knows.

scottreynolds

WhyFronts? wrote: »

Did Marmotte a few weeks ago and I was about as light as possible. Give it another couple of months though........

What? You cut off you non-level fingers for additional weight loss. AWESOME.

I enjoy peoples responses here ... they are almost saying they have spent to much.

Lumen

For a built bike, something like a Cervelo R3 Chorus will come in on budget, almost. But I'd lose the Zipps and go with SRAM Force.

The difficult part is the wheels, with weight/cost/durability tradeoffs.

Personally, on a €4k budget I'd go for something like:

Bianchi HOC 928 Carbon SL 2009 frameset, €2400.
SRAM Force groupset, €900.
HED Ardennes wheels, €750.

...and scavenge the finishing kit until you can afford to upgrade.

Don't worry about the bodyweight, if you spend that much you won't be able to afford food.

scottreynolds

This is a fantasy bike -- http://www.slanecycles.com/productdetail.aspx?id=3146&subid=273&catid=66

Factory 5.9kg but you can't afford it sorry.

Lumen

scottreynolds wrote: »

Factory 5.9kg but you can't afford it sorry.

Yeah, the high-end US stuff is incredibly expensive. I'd love a Canondale Super Six, but ISTR they're something like £6k+ for a complete bike.

There's a new very light Specialized S-Works Tarmac SL3 coming soon, 5.95kg without pedals, but again crazy money.

One of the problems with high-end framesets (IMO) is the fashion for integrated seatmasts, which are no lighter, kill resale, and create transportation issues.

Alternatively, since you do foreign sportives, you could get a nicely specced S&S-coupled custom Ti Enigma for that money.

alfalad

Pinarello are pretty awesome, not sure which one would come in at budget though! This the prince with fulcrum zero's in the images of beauty that is stunning!

scottreynolds

Lumen wrote: »

Yeah, the high-end US stuff is incredibly expensive.

It's SWISS .... Stay EURO

blorg

Lumen wrote: »

The difficult part is the wheels, with weight/cost/durability tradeoffs.

If you are happy to live on the edge and have a good helmet, Mavic R-SYS are actually lovely climbing wheels... Very light for clinchers and very very stiff too. They lose big time with the aerodynamics... and the whole exploding thing.

I guess the thing about upgrading is, I would not be thinking ONLY about lightweight, it is not the only variable to consider going into a bike. When upgrading myself I had the choice between a frameset at 1138g or 890g in my size, the latter one of the lightest frames available- I went for the 250g heavier one because it was stiffer.

At the high end you basically are looking at 1kg in weight between the crazy light (6kg) and "normal" (7kg) bike weights... Wikipedia reckons 1kg gains you between 69 and 107m over an hour long climb on a 7% gradient depending on rider weight (maybe Lumen would have some more accurate view on that)... doesn't seem like a lot, especially if you are not racing... Most of the pros don't actually ride anything close to the 6.2kg UCI limit, worth bearing in mind.

Lumen

blorg wrote: »

Most of the pros don't actually ride anything close to the 6.2kg UCI limit, worth bearing in mind.

This is true. The most important thing about an expensive bike is that it must look good. Performance is necessary but not sufficient. If you feel good, you'll go fast.

I'd start with your choice of groupset, wheels and finishing kit, and work out what you have left for the frameset. Then buy a pretty, lightish frameset with a good warranty (this is critical).

The Bianchi Mono-Q might be worth a look.

edit: I just noticed that Competitive Cyclist appear to have stopped selling the R-SYS wheels.

lukester

blorg wrote: »

If you are happy to live on the edge and have a good helmet, Mavic R-SYS are actually lovely climbing wheels... Very light for clinchers and very very stiff too. They lose big time with the aerodynamics... and the whole exploding thing.

Tangential, but relevant...lots of folks here (blorg at least?) seem keen on Open Pros laced to Ultegra/DA hubs, but weightwise they don't seem particularly light- I'm guessing durability is part of the attraction.

New wheels are my next justifiable/realistic upgrade (the rest is just bike porn for now) so what real-world wheels would y'all spec for this fantasy climbing bike?

kennyb3

read the reviews on that first bike lumen put up, i dont want to threadjack but what exact effext does stiffness have. its referred to a bit in the comments underneath the bike

rottenhat

lukester wrote: »

Tangential, but relevant...lots of folks here (blorg at least?) seem keen on Open Pros laced to Ultegra/DA hubs, but weightwise they don't seem particularly light- I'm guessing durability is part of the attraction.

Durability, ease of repair, and price (with Ultegra anyway).

Lumen

lukester wrote: »

New wheels are my next justifiable/realistic upgrade (the rest is just bike porn for now) so what real-world wheels would y'all spec for this fantasy climbing bike?

For training: Hed Ardennes clincher, 1360g. Maybe the Stallion build for extra robustness. Same weight as the R-Sys, without the "diminutive frenchman" factor.

For racing: Mavic Cosmic Carbone Ultimate tubulars, 1188g (and lots of weight reduction 'cos of the tubs).

This is just "bike porn" choices, since I have ridden neither.

lukester

rottenhat wrote: »

Durability, ease of repair, and price (with Ultegra anyway).

So they're hardly an upgrade from bog-basic Shimano WH-R 550s then?

rottenhat

lukester wrote: »

So they're hardly an upgrade from bog-basic Shimano WH-R 550s then?

I couldn't really comment, never having used the Shimano wheels, but the Open Pro is an excellent clincher rim and Ultegra is one step off Shimano's top flight so if the wheels are built well, they're far from bog-standard.

blorg

I have Open Pros on Ultegra hubs on my touring bike, e.g. for loaded touring with panniers. They are 1,800g actual weight on my scales (note this could =1,760g "claimed" manufacturer weight) which is actually under the weight of many entry-level "race" wheels like Aksiums.

Great lightweight touring wheels but I would not generally suggest them for a road bike, certainly not for someone looking for lightweight wheels. They would certainly make a good training wheelset at that pricepoint.

@lukester- they would be much better wheels than WH-R550s, actually lighter, stronger, smoother rolling and more servicable. Basically Ultegra vs Tiagra level.

My road wheels are DT Swiss RR1450s (1,450g) and Mavic R-SYS (1,355g). The DT wheels are great, pretty light but very traditional, all standard components and fully rebuildable.

Tubular is a big way to drop weight but to be honest I would be wary, I just wouldn't trust myself to glue the tyres on properly. If I had a team mechanic doing it that would be the way to go.

rottenhat

blorg wrote: »

My road wheels are DT Swiss RR1450s (1,450g) and Mavic R-SYS (1,355g). The DT wheels are great, pretty light but very traditional, all standard components and fully rebuildable.

These are the ones you were recommending me a couple of weeks ago? Duly noted.

Lumen

rottenhat wrote: »

These are the ones you were recommending me a couple of weeks ago? Duly noted.

The only problem with the RR1450s are that they don't come in black, AFAIK, which can pose aesthetic issues on some bikes.

ryan_sherlock

Build one up yourself.

Step 1 - get the frame/fork (I recently got a Specialized Tarmac SL2 and love it)
Step 2 - drive train from Slane Cycles (SRAM Red of course)
Step 3 - Finishing Kit - Lots of KCNC bits from Clee Cycles. Very light, very durable and reasonably priced.
Step 4 - Super-light tubs for race day (I have Zipp 404s as there are not many big hills in races here, but starbike have a nice selection of properly light ones) and a decent set of 'normal' 1.5kg clinchers for everyday use...

One or two other bits and bobs and you'll have a dream bike for much less than 'stock' dream bikes.

rottenhat

Lumen wrote: »

The only problem with the RR1450s are that they don't come in black, AFAIK, which can pose aesthetic issues on some bikes.

This does not pose a problem for Team Retrogrouch.

lukester

Interesting. The HEDs get rave reviews, but are not very wallet friendly.

The DT Swiss look good, a bit cheaper than the HEDs, but no black is a no no

Would not consider tubulars for the real world. Besides Monsieur Kelly opined that clinchers are not far behind tubs these days- Vittoria Open Corsa Evo CX with Latex tubes are supposedly smoove like butter, albeit not as light.

ryan_sherlock wrote: »

Build one up yourself.

Step 1 - get the frame/fork (I recently got a Specialized Tarmac SL2 and love it)

Any particular reason you opted for that frame?

blorg

The 'classic' RR1450s (that I have) are 'silver grey' with black spokes. The component list is 240s hub, 28 aerolite spokes and RR1.1 rims - all of these are available in black if you wanted to get a custom build, might well even come in cheaper.

Lumen

blorg wrote: »

...all of these are available in black if you wanted to get a custom build, might well even come in cheaper.

So you're saying black rims are for poor people?

Chips Lovell

I know a guy who commutes on tubs and races on clinchers

Lumen

el tonto wrote: »

I know a guy who commutes on tubs and races on clinchers

I was recently reading about "everyday tubs". Apparently if you get a hole that the squirty stuff can't fix, you can just put on a spare tub without the glue to get you home - the pressure holds it on. Or call a cab.

Obviously carrying a can of squirty stuff and a spare tub somewhat diminishes the weight saving.

edit: obviously this research will be useful when I'm commuting with aerobars on the Cosmic Carbone Ultimates.

blorg

el tonto wrote: »

I know a guy who commutes on tubs and races on clinchers

Is this "guy" in the vein of "I have this friend with an embarassing problem..."

Chips Lovell

Lumen wrote: »

I was recently reading about "everyday tubs". Apparently if you get a hole that the squirty stuff can't fix, you can just put on a spare tub without the glue to get you home - the pressure holds it on. Or call a cab.

Pretty much any tub can be put on glueless and ridden home, provided you take it easy on the corners. They aren't too much of a pain to deal with, the biggest hassle is actually carrying a spare tub.

blorg wrote: »

Is this "guy" in the vein of "I have this friend with an embarassing problem..."

Nope, not me. He's in our club though, so you may have met him at some stage.