dealing with debt collectors

blackrovers

Hi i'm wondering about dealing with an issue i have.

I have a debt collecting crowd after me for an oustanding bill of less then 200euros. This bill came about cause someone in the (company) entered my bank details into their system wrong on three occasions thus locking themselves out of the direct debit i had set up with my credit card. Now there was always money in the account to pay for my bills so i don't really have a debt problem, if you know what i mean. I couldn't use my card as i was locked out due to the companies mistake. I rang them to ask them whats going on that someone locked me out of my account. It was denied by them and said everything was grand on their system.

I rang them a while later when i saw there was still no sign of them taking money out of my account plus i wanted to get to the bottom of the issue. Was told everything was grand on their system no problems to which i informed them that they might have trouble getting money out of my account as the bank had locked them out due to 3 forced attempts to enter my credit card. They informed me that they could see from the system that no such thing had happened.

So every month my bill would be outstanding, i ignored it because i tried to resolve it earlier. Than i received a call from the company to inform me my account was overdue, i asked them about why someone tried to take money out of my account with false details. Was told no such thing happened that the bank messed up. Rang the bank again was told not their problem then the company said oh ya the details were changed when i rang up!! I wouldn't have any need to change them because they haven't changed since i got my card. I informed them i would not be paying until i got an answer as to why someone did this.

It was past on to a debt collector who threatened taking me to court it never happened, then it was pasted on to another debt collecting crowd. Their threatening legal action and that i will have to pay for their legal fees. They also rang my place of work and left their details with the secretary as i wasn't their at the time, which i'm not too pleased about at all.

Now that the story is told.
I'm wondering what is the likely event of them taking me to court? And also should i get a solictor on to it and if so is it worth due to the amount of the outstanding fee, if so what charges should i expect from a solictor, do i get charged per visit, letter written to the company or what?

Sorry for all the questions but i would like any advice or info anyone has to offer.

P.S I also sent a letter to the company asking for all information on me in written and data form under the data protection act etc and i was told it would take 40days even though the debt collectors are threatening legal action in the mean time.

GerardKeating

blackrovers wrote: »

Hi i'm wondering about dealing with an issue i have.

I have a debt collecting crowd after me for an oustanding bill of less then 200euros. This bill came about cause someone in the (company) entered my bank details into their system wrong on three occasions thus locking themselves out of the direct debit i had set up with my credit card. Now there was always money in the account to pay for my bills so i don't really have a debt problem, if you know what i mean. I couldn't use my card as i was locked out due to the companies mistake. I rang them to ask them whats going on that someone locked me out of my account. It was denied by them and said everything was grand on their system.

I rang them a while later when i saw there was still no sign of them taking money out of my account plus i wanted to get to the bottom of the issue. Was told everything was grand on their system no problems to which i informed them that they might have trouble getting money out of my account as the bank had locked them out due to 3 forced attempts to enter my credit card. They informed me that they could see from the system that no such thing had happened.

So every month my bill would be outstanding, i ignored it because i tried to resolve it earlier. Than i received a call from the company to inform me my account was overdue, i asked them about why someone tried to take money out of my account with false details. Was told no such thing happened that the bank messed up. Rang the bank again was told not their problem then the company said oh ya the details were changed when i rang up!! I wouldn't have any need to change them because they haven't changed since i got my card. I informed them i would not be paying until i got an answer as to why someone did this.

It was past on to a debt collector who threatened taking me to court it never happened, then it was pasted on to another debt collecting crowd. Their threatening legal action and that i will have to pay for their legal fees. They also rang my place of work and left their details with the secretary as i wasn't their at the time, which i'm not too pleased about at all.

Now that the story is told.
I'm wondering what is the likely event of them taking me to court? And also should i get a solictor on to it and if so is it worth due to the amount of the outstanding fee, if so what charges should i expect from a solictor, do i get charged per visit, letter written to the company or what?

Sorry for all the questions but i would like any advice or info anyone has to offer.

P.S I also sent a letter to the company asking for all information on me in written and data form under the data protection act etc and i was told it would take 40days even though the debt collectors are threatening legal action in the mean time.

For the amount of money owed, is it worth the bother of evening finding out what happend.

Send them a cheque for the outstanding amout and a bill for your time in pursuing the matter, and followng this up every 30 days when they do not pay.

Also send the debt collector a record of the payment to the company (pay company directly, not via debt collector)..

blackrovers

why would i send them a bill in pursuing this matter i would only be wasting my time with this plus whats to gain from this only to prolong it. Sure they would ignore it just the same way as they have my request for the truth in regards to altering my financial details. Do i not have the right to the truth as to why my personal details were altered without my consent. If you discovered that some company did this to you and locked you out of the use of your credit card would you not want to seek why only to be told when you do ask that you altered it yourself, i'm sure you wouldn't take to kindly to that? Do i have any right in even gaining this info. Plus do i not have to sign a form or something for a company to change my financial details. I feel i'm wasting my time and that these big companies seem to be forcing the consumer into payment even though there's no accountable for what they have done. Don't know if even they are allowed to take so long in giving out the information i asked for under the data protection act etc thought it had to be within 21 days?

eyeswideopen111

Hello,

Recently I have learned a great deal about the financial system which was quite shocking.

Did you know our country is operating in a state of bankruptcy? And all Euro notes are borrowed into existence with interest already applied? The Euro notes in circulation are not backed by anythin of value - like original paper notes - e.g £1 STG equaled one pound sterling silver and could be excahnged at any bank for the value.
The notes we use today are not backed by anything of value and are in fact 'debit notes' or IOU's/Promises to pay. Therefore how can you pay a debt with a debt?

Please take the time to read this article by Arthur Christian:

Credit Cards; No Need To Pay - You Already Have!
Why don’t credit card balances have to be paid and how have we already paid?
Well there is one simple reason, yet for you to truly believe it and get your head around to the idea, you will have to do a little research yourself and then start looking at the financial system of this world very, very differently. But if you are already in controversy with banks, building societies or any credit card corporations, which is causing you great stress, then there is a quick and lasting fix that will deal with these deceivers.
It works, and will give you plenty of time to then research how and why it works as it does. There will be pointers towards the areas of where to research, and then the rest of your journey is yours! The credit card corporation will obviously black-list you for your decision to not let them commit fraud and deception on you anymore, but that is the price!
Now their simple yet brilliantly executed trick (con) is in the name, ‘Credit’ card! You (well your signature or tick in a box on a pc screen and maybe a signature a few days later possibly, but not always) are a co-creator of credit with the credit card corporation.
There was NEVER a debt incurred by anyone or anything. Don’t believe it? Then write to the CEO of the credit card corporation and ask for the validation of where a debt was incurred. You will not get one because a debt/loss doesn’t, and never did exist! That alone will get the fraudsters off your back as you now have proof that they have, and continue to commit fraud!
If you want to know why the corrupt banks operate like this, simply investigate a thing called Fractional Reserve Banking, and you will soon discover why the world is in the trouble it is right now!
Now remember that when you get a phone call from the crooked corporation/s, do not give them your name or D/O/B. Inform them (politely) that you would be more than happy to assist them, and they should contact you by letter using recorded post and put any claim they believe they have against you on paper and signed by the corporations Chief Executive Officer (CEO). By the way, this won’t happen, as the CEO knows they are already committing a crime against public policy and would be committing commercial suicide if they even thought about it for more than half a second!
If they keep troubling you by phone with various threats…oh they do make us laugh bless them; simply write to the CEO using Recorded Post with something very similar to the example below in black bold:
Oh, and if you are worried about threats of Bailiffs, visit a great site that shows you how to deal with them very effectively, peacefully and lawfully. Bailiffs commit fraud, it's just you probably are not aware of that yet!

You will soon start waking up to who you really are. This is to assist you whilst you're waking up and becoming confident with the realisation that no man or woman has power over you, as you have no power of them! All are, and is, equal under whatever label you use to mean Source/Being/Divine...
****************************************
CEO (WHATEVER) BANK
Full Address of their Head Office
Date:
Sent Recorded Post
NOTICE REGARDING ACCOUNT # (whatever the number is)
Dear Sir or Madam:
I would be happy to settle any financial obligation I might lawfully owe as soon as I have received the following documents from you.
1. Validation of the actual debt (the actual accounting).
2. Verification of your claim against me (a sworn affidavit or a hand signed invoice)
3. A copy of the contract signed by both parties and therefore binding both parties.
I hereby give you fourteen (14) days to reply to this notice with a notice sent using recorded post, and signed by the CEO under their full commercial liability and penalties of perjury, assuring and promising me that all of the replies and details given to the above requests are true and without deception, fraud or mischief.
Yours truly,
By: ____________________(agent)_Date: ____________****************************************
In the world of commerce get used to autographing and using (agent) in brackets after your autograph. This is because you are an agent for NAME in ALL CAPITALS, and the NAME is NOT you!
Now the banks cannot validate/prove the debt because they never sustained a loss and a debt never existed. They cannot verify any claim against you because you are not the NAME they are billing. They cannot produce a copy of the contract because one doesn’t exist; all that exists is an unenforceable unilateral contract, or what the banks refer to as ‘your contract with us’ and this is not a valid bilateral agreement, since the four requirements of a lawful, binding contract were not met on the credit card application. These are as follows:
1. Full disclosure (we are not told that we are creating the credit with our signature).
2. Equal consideration (they bring nothing to the table, hence they have nothing to lose).
3. Lawful terms and conditions (they are based upon fraud).
4. Signatures of the Parties/Meeting of the Minds (corporations cannot sign because they have no right, or mind, to contract as they are legal fictions).
Oh, and always be polite and loving. Remember that the vast majority are not aware of this and so resist becoming righteous. Help others by allowing them, not restricting or trying to control them. You will soon see how much easier that is when you realise the corrupt law makers haven't ever had any true power over you.
This also helps you stay in honour, which you will start to discover is a massive thing in Admiralty/Commercial redemption.
Credit cards are based upon fraud and are win/win for the banks and lose/lose for everyone else. It is one of the slickest cons on the planet!
And an interesting spiritual slant:
So don’t worry and stay calm; after a little bit of watching and reading you will have some of the bigger dots joined up and be able to see straight through the massive deception, and your power will come flooding back…the very equal power that the Creator had always intended us to have, and the power His Son assured for us if all we would do is open our eyes, believe and accept. The Bible talks of sin and commerce talks of debt. Debt and sin are both one of the same, and all natural born human beings had their debts/sins prepaid when the Son of the Creator died on the cross to take care of all past, present and future sins/debts.
And once you see through the deception you will also come to believe the concept, and once you believe and accept the concept and the symbolism of the crucifixion/for-give/prepay/bonds/insurance/debt/sin, you will soon see how symbolic the books in the Bible truly are! This is not about any specific religion, yet remember the Bible is the root of Law in the UK, USA, CANADA, NZ, AUSTRALIA and on and on, and the concepts of both Common Law and Admiralty/Merchant/Commercial Law, herald from the Bible.
For many, many years the UK, USA, CANADA and most other countries have been bankrupt, and operating in commerce using Law of Merchant Law/Admiralty Law. This is done by the use of insurance policies/bonds. Your NAME already has unlimited liability insurance in the shape of your Birth Certificate (Bond/insurance policy), and your National Insurance policy. You are the sole beneficiary of your NAME/Corporation’s Bond, yet you just didn’t know it. It can be reclaimed but first arm yourself with the knowledge, as a little information can be a dangerous thing!
Admiralty law is adversarial, which means the opposition doesn’t have to tell you what they are doing, yet it is unlawful to use fraud and mischief in contracts. Once you start to discover what has happened here, you will never see the world in the same way again!
Some incredible areas of research and information can be found below. Do not be put off if the researchers and presentations are based in the UNITED STATES (oh look, a corporation), CANADA (and another one), or anywhere else; the principles are almost identical everywhere where Common Law and Admiralty Law exist, and that means the UNITED KINGDOM (just another corporation).
Remember that the FEDERAL RESERVE BANK, BANK OF CANADA are privately owned corporations that are based on the model formed in 1694 by THE BANK OF ENGLAND (The Rothschild family - Red-Shield). Oh and guess what the INTERNATIONAL MONETARY FUND is? How about THE WORLD BANK?

For more info go to www.getoutofdebtfree.org, www.winstonshroutsolutionsincommerce.com, www.freemanireland.ning.com and www.tpuc.org

People have been doing this with success. I hope this helps.

nuac

Wasn't it George Bernard Shaw who apologised to a correspondent for writing a long letter because he had not had the time to write a short one.

Could I urge the above two posters to keep it short - easier to read.

eyeswideopen111

Yeh if you want to learn something worth learning....it can't always be condensed down to pill size and swallowed.

Sleipnir

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Yeh if you want to learn something worth learning....it can't always be condensed down to pill size and swallowed.

There are other options if the pill cannot be swallowed...

Sleipnir

Op, the debt has been sold on so you can't really pay the company you originally owed the debt to.
The debt was probably sold for between 10c and 30c in the euro so it's probably not worth their while bringing you to court.

Contact the original company and ask how you can settle the debt and see what they say. Most likely, it will be "that debt isn't owed to us anymore, it's owed to the debt collection agency so go and pay them"

eyeswideopen111

Sleipnir wrote: »

Most likely, it will be "that debt isn't owed to us anymore, it's owed to the debt collection agency so go and pay them"

How can the debt collection company actual make lawful claim against him if he has no existing agreement with them?

It's all about exthortion...they're scaring you into paying.

here's a more digestable example...

John-David: Doe

Yellow Brick Road House number 1,

Near Anyplace,

In Dublin

Joseph Crook CEO,
Corrupt International Bank,
666 Bank Centre,
Dublin,
Ireland

Dear Mr Crook

I am writing to you in relation to a/c number 912345-77654321. I would be happy to settle any financial obligation I might lawfully owe, as soon as I have received the following documentation from you:

1. Validation of the debt (i.e. the actual accounting showing the Banks real losses);
2. Verification of your claim against me (a sworn affidavit or a hand signed invoice in accordance with The Bills of Exchange Act 1882);
1. A copy of the contract signed by both parties and therefore binding both parties to the agreement.
2. Proof that there is any money in circulation backed by anything of real value with which to pay this debt. (*This one just if you want).

I hereby give you ten (10) days to reply to this notice from the above date with a
Notice sent using recorded post and signed under full commercial liability and
penalties of perjury, assuring and promising me that all of the replies and details
given to the above requests are true and without deception, fraud or mischief. Your
said failure to provide the aforementioned documentation within ten (10) days, from
the above date, to validate the debt, will constitute your agreement to the following
terms:

1. That the debt did not exist in the first place;
OR
2. It has already been paid in full;
AND
3. That any damages I suffer, you will be held culpable;
4. That any negative remarks made to a credit reference agency will be removed;
5. You will no longer pursue this matter any further.

Please Note: I wish to deal with this matter in writing and I do not give your
organisation permission to contact me by telephone. Should it do so, I must warn you
that the calls could constitute ‘harassment’ and I may take action against you.
.
Sincerely Yours in Honour and Respect,

________________________________.
By: John-David: Doe;

No assured value, No liability. All Rights Reserved.
Authorised Representative

Please note - It is not likely that only one Notice of this kind is going to be enough to clear your debt, the Banks don’t give up that easily but it is the first step in the process. You will need to serve a series of Notices/Registered Letters to the bank to successfully discharge your debt, but by serving this first Notice/Registered Letter you put the Bank in a position where it now needs to prove you owe them! The resources at the rear of this guide will provide you with further information and the knowledge required for you to confidently and successfully serve these notices and discharge your debt completely lawfully!

eyeswideopen111

The Banking System

After Trade & Barter the most accepted form of currency became coins of Gold, Silver or other precious metals. The coins were a specific weight and held actual value. Carrying all these heavy coins around wasn’t always desirable or safe and for this reason people would deposit their Coins, Gold and Silver with the Bank for safe keeping and in return for this they would be issued with bank receipts or Credit Notes. These credit notes could then be redeemed at a later date from the bank. As a point of convenience people began to use these Credit Notes as currency between themselves – as they could always be redeemed for their true value in Gold or Silver at the bank. (Notes today are Debit Notes and are not backed by value).
Bankers soon realised that they had a lot of Gold & Silver in their reserves and it was unlikely or at least very rare that all the Depositors would come to claim their reserves on the same day. This means that at any one time there would be an amount of Gold or Silver sitting unused in the safe – The Bankers began to lend this money out to Borrowers keeping only a fraction of total deposits on reserve, thus Fractional Reserve Banking was born.

What this means is that Banks are only required to keep a small percentage of funds on deposit and can lend out what is essentially other people’s money plus interest! It is little known that Banks are not allowed to loan their own assets or funds – only other peoples and that which is created by You and Your signature (more to follow). Now get this. Usually when someone borrows from the Bank they will leave the funds in an account, rather than withdraw the full amount, until such a time as they require it. This new amount which the bank has ‘loaned’ is then added to the total in the banks deposit – with which the bank can lend out more money off the back of.

What happens when I apply for a Loan?
You enter a bank and say you would like a Loan of €1000 (what you are actually saying is ‘I would like access to €1000 of my Credit’). The Bank will do a background or credit check on you. Why is this? It is for them to ensure that they will make money of you via the interest. Once you have been approved the Bank will present you with a Contract that states they are loaning you this amount and you agree to pay it back with interest. You sign this Contract (Note: You are the only signatory to the Contract and it is therefore Unilateral-Not binding). At this point you believe that they are debiting money from the ‘Safe’ and crediting your account.
It may or may not be hard to believe but the Banking system of today is completely fraudulent.
What actually happens is: Your signature creates the new credit! It is your signature on the Document/Contract that holds ALL the value of the agreement. You are essentially drawing down from your own ‘unlimited credit’. The Bank merely acts as the middle man between the Man and Credit, but they appear to be ‘Lenders’. They give the impression that they are personally lending you their own assets or funds. This is not the case. They allow you to believe that they stand to lose money and are taking a ‘risk’ by lending to you.
With all this in mind would you say the terms of the agreement were fully disclosed to you? Obviously not! So far we have covered two areas where you would have grounds to cancel this contract.

1. The Bank did not fully disclose the details of the agreement – Full Disclosure is a requirement of a Contract.
2. The agreement has only one signature: Yours! Therefore the agreement is not binding – Signatures of both (or all involved parties) is a requirement of a contract signifying ‘consensus ad idem’ or a meeting of the minds and binds both parties.

This, coupled with knowledge of the international banking scam is enough information to clear/discharge your debt. But what is the process for doing this? It’s quite simple really. All you have to do is ask the bank to provide ‘Proof of Claim’ for the said Debt.
They are claiming you owe them a certain amount. This would imply that they loaned something to you and they are at a Loss – in other words they are claiming they are ‘out of pocket’ because of you. You can simply ask them to validate this debt.
Below is an example Registered Letter/Notice you might send to the Bank for verification. There are a lot of resources out there for discharging your debt lawfully and it is strongly recommended that you research more first before attempting this.

Jo King

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

The Banking System

2. The agreement has only one signature: Yours! Therefore the agreement is not binding – Signatures of both (or all involved parties) is a requirement of a contract signifying ‘consensus ad idem’ or a meeting of the minds and binds both parties.

This alone is completely wrong. What is your authority for this proposition?

mick.fr

No your bills have not been sold to this debt agency...Just pay whatever you owe this company. Send a cheque by registered letter.
As for the debt agency, you have no obligation to pay their fees. Therefore do not pay them.
Cancel whatever subscription you have with these w@nkers anyway.

eyeswideopen111

Jo King wrote: »

This alone is completely wrong. What is your authority for this proposition?

Jo, that was a very very useful comment. Keep em coming. Care to explain WHY? you beleive this is completley wrong? Allow me to outline the requirements of a contract....

A contract is an agreement between two or more parties creating obligations which are enforceable or recognizable at Law. A Contract has four requirements for it to be considered Lawful:
1. Full Disclosure - Meaning that both parties must be fully open in setting and agreeing upon the details and the terms of the contract. Both parties must be left with no doubt or confusion about the terms set out in the contract.
2. Consideration – Can be ‘that which is offered’ in the agreement. Allows the parties’ time to consider if they stand to lose or gain from the contract.
3. Terms & Conditions – Outline the structure and the requirements of the agreement and obligations of each or all of the involved parties.
4. Signature - This is the most important part of the Contract and is the proof that the agreement took place. It also implies ‘consensus ad idem’ or a ‘meeting of the minds’. Your Signature is very powerful and you should always pay caution to what you are signing.

Furthermore... Jo, explain to me how this has been working then? Explain to me why you beleive that it's 'completley wrong' without given any rhyme or reason?
I think we have a shrill here lads!

Jo King

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Jo, that was a very very useful comment. Keep em coming. Care to explain WHY? you beleive this is completley wrong? Allow me to outline the requirements of a contract....

A contract is an agreement between two or more parties creating obligations which are enforceable or recognizable at Law. A Contract has four requirements for it to be considered Lawful:
1. Full Disclosure - Meaning that both parties must be fully open in setting and agreeing upon the details and the terms of the contract. Both parties must be left with no doubt or confusion about the terms set out in the contract.
2. Consideration – Can be ‘that which is offered’ in the agreement. Allows the parties’ time to consider if they stand to lose or gain from the contract.
3. Terms & Conditions – Outline the structure and the requirements of the agreement and obligations of each or all of the involved parties.
4. Signature - This is the most important part of the Contract and is the proof that the agreement took place. It also implies ‘consensus ad idem’ or a ‘meeting of the minds’. Your Signature is very powerful and you should always pay caution to what you are signing.

Furthermore... Jo, explain to me how this has been working then? Explain to me why you beleive that it's 'completley wrong' without given any rhyme or reason?



I think we have a shrill here lads!

I am not going to type in a complete book on the law of contract in order to alleviate your ignorance of the subject. Go and do a course if you want legal education.

I have asked you to quote authority for your propositions. You have none.

1. A contract is a metaphysical object. It is never signed by anybody.

2. Full disclosure is only required in a contract of uberimme fides such as a contract of insurance.

3. Consideration is the price for which the promise is bought. It has nothing to do with giving parties time.

Can you produce a quote from any recognised textbook or written judgment to contradict any of the above? If so I would be interested to see it.

GerardKeating

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

J4. Signature - This is the most important part of the Contract and is the proof that the agreement took place. It also implies ‘consensus ad idem’ or a ‘meeting of the minds’. Your Signature is very powerful and you should always pay caution to what you are signing.

Signatures are not always required, if i go into a store and buy a Mars bar, i do not sign for anything, but a "contract" exists for the sale.

eyeswideopen111

GerardKeating wrote: »

Signatures are not always required, if i go into a store and buy a Mars bar, i do not sign for anything, but a "contract" exists for the sale.

Obviously - but in the context of this thread - there would be.

eyeswideopen111

Jo King wrote: »

I am not going to type in a complete book on the law of contract in order to alleviate your ignorance of the subject. Go and do a course if you want legal education.

I have asked you to quote authority for your propositions. You have none.

1. A contract is a metaphysical object. It is never signed by anybody.

2. Full disclosure is only required in a contract of uberimme fides such as a contract of insurance.

3. Consideration is the price for which the promise is bought. It has nothing to do with giving parties time.

Can you produce a quote from any recognised textbook or written judgment to contradict any of the above? If so I would be interested to see it.

1. I couldn't agreem more. The contract does not exist in real terms.

2. What you are referring to here is subregation which is true in commercial or business law. Are you suggesting that if I was to go into agreement or contract with a man I don't have to disclose all the details?

3. Consideration is the essence of the mechanism of exchange - time can be consideration. Time is valuable - and can be considered adequate consideration. Consideration does not have to be valuable just adequate.

I feel you are failing to see the Wood for the Trees my friend. I havn't come on here to argue to fundamentals of Contract.
Just here to try give the original poster some help with a problem he is having. Provide him with an option he may not have been aware of.

The other posters seem to be more interested in nit-picking rather then helping.

Are you missing the point of what i am saying in relation to debt?!! You seem to prefer to use this an oppurtunity to flex your obviously superior intellect! very helpful.

Anything productive to say to help this man? Anything else you need me to clarify let me know...i'll alleviate your ignorance.

eyeswideopen111

Jo King wrote: »

This alone is completely wrong. What is your authority for this proposition?

I am speaking from my own authority. I am not bound to anything unless I signed it.

I got a loan...one signature? - so.....?

What's your authority? Are you using your own knowledge or someone elses? Are you speaking English or Legalese. I imagine your the type who'd only beleive it if they seen it written down by another member of the Law Society so heres a reference for you.

"Essentials of Irish Business Law Second ed Chapter 10 pg 58" - You'll find what you need there.

i'll outline what blacks law says...

Ad Idem - To same point or matter of the same mind , 'the parties reached a consesus ad idem'

Jeez I should really charge you for this education you're getting.

Now stop bothering me with these useless quibbles. Another user who is missing the gem being laid before them here.

Please at least read my post properly and lets discuss the potential of the message therein. Are you blind by your 'intellect'?

Jo King

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

1. I couldn't agreem more. The contract does not exist in real terms.

A contract certainly does exist.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

2. What you are referring to here is subregation which is true in commercial or business law. Are you suggesting that if I was to go into agreement or contract with a man I don't have to disclose all the details?

There is no such word as subregation. You can contract with a man without giving all details. You simply cannot lie or give a misleading response to a question.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

3. Consideration is the essence of the mechanism of exchange - time can be consideration. Time is valuable - and can be considered adequate consideration. Consideration does not have to be valuable just adequate.

Consideration cannot be adequate unless it has value

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

I feel you are failing to see the Wood for the Trees my friend. I havn't come on here to argue to fundamentals of Contract.

I am not surprised. You know nothing about the fundamentals of contract.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Just here to try give the original poster some help with a problem he is having. Provide him with an option he may not have been aware of.


The other posters seem to be more interested in nit-picking rather then helping.

That is why the charter precludes the giving of legal advice. To protect people from acting on lunatic suggestions.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Are you missing the point of what i am saying in relation to debt?!! You seem to prefer to use this an oppurtunity to flex your obviously superior intellect! very helpful.

I am not missing the point. There isn't one.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Anything productive to say to help this man? Anything else you need me to clarify let me know...i'll alleviate your ignorance.

Yes. Do not pay any attention to the nonsense suggested in this thread. He is in a small amount of debt. What do you wnat him to do? End up with legal bill a multiple of the debt?

Jo King

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

I am speaking from my own authority. I am not bound to anything unless I signed it.

Go to an auction and make a bid. There is deemed to be a contract when the hammer falls. You are bound even though you haven't signed anything.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

I got a loan...one signature? - so.....?

Ever heard of the doctrine of part performance or the statute of frauds Ireland Act 1695? One signature is more than enough.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

What's your authority? Are you using your own knowledge or someone elses? Are you speaking English or Legalese. I imagine your the type who'd only beleive it if they seen it written down by another member of the Law Society so heres a reference for you.

"Essentials of Irish Business Law Second ed Chapter 10 pg 58" - You'll find what you need there.

i'll outline what blacks law says...

Ad Idem - To same point or matter of the same mind , 'the parties reached a consesus ad idem'

Jeez I should really charge you for this education you're getting.

The fact of a consensus ad idem can be established without signatures. Your book says nothing different.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Now stop bothering me with these useless quibbles. Another user who is missing the gem being laid before them here.

There is no gem. More of a snake oil cure.

eyeswideopen111 wrote: »

Please at least read my post properly and lets discuss the potential of the message therein. Are you blind by your 'intellect'?

That drivel in your post has been circulating around the states for quite some time. Try it in court and watch yourself get a whopper of a legal bill.

birdz

Hi all, i am currently working in a big finance company. Believe me I wound not pay that bill!! And do not worry @ all about the solicitors letters! They are generic letters that go out to all customers that go into default it does not matter how much is outstanding! nothing will be done about it. I have been working with this company for nearly 1 year and have we have only taken action against 2 customers so far and the arrs were over 2k and balance of 20+. The reason these letters are sent is we are required to send them by law so we then can terminate the a/c and sell it on to another company. The only thing i would be concerned about is it will be recorded as a missed payment on your credit profile and may go against you getting lending in the future especially if it has been written off to another company, ppl done realises it remains on your cr for 5years after you have paid off the dept in full! The reason that no one is giving you anwers re your bank details is that you have not made your case serious enough for them to listen to you. call them again and threaten them with the financial regulator and make sure you get that agent to log a complaint and request a response in writing. Believe me this will work. Then request the amend your credit rating and follow this up by contacting the ICB. As regards the data protect act, it you have requested all the info the co hold on you there is a charge and if the company have not made you aware of this then they have not reguested it for you!! Good luck let me know how you get on!!!

nuac

As a practising lawyer, prefer Jo King's view of contract law. Would not advise Eyewideopen to try his/her theories in court. While most judges will listen to submissions that appear to make sense and are on the point there are limits to their tolerance and I think Eyeswideopen would test those limits.

faceman

blackrovers, ignore what the eyeswideshutopen111 fella has to say.

as we have limited information to your contract and payment terms we cant give a qualified or educated comment on your specific case but a couple of points to note.

* By law, you cannot be contacted at your place of work unless you have given your consent. Had you provided them with your work contact details?

* You are not disputing the debt validity and we will assume that the debt is valid and correct. If the contract your signed stipulates the payment method that you are paying by and the company has failed to take payment by that method, then you should contact the company and cc. the debt collection agency in writing, by registered post, pointing out their failure to take the payment as contractually agreed and asking them when they will be taking the payment from you.

* If the payment method isnt covered in the contract, if it was me, i would pay the bill and cancel my account with the company. I would then send a letter by registered post to the customer service director or equivalient explaining why you cancelled.

As with any issues of this nature, all correspondance should be writing or by email so there is an audit trail. Phone conversations arent worth the paper they are written on.