Do you compete?

cowzerp

I seen this 1 on the self defens/martial arts forum and though we could do something similar here..

Griffin Small Shootout wrote: »

And if you do, do you think it should be a requirement on your journey through your various grades and do you think it makes one a better coach?.

Personally speaking it used to annoy me when I was kickboxing that people could grade through their clubs syllabus right through to black belt, then go onto coach students without having the benefit of competing to advise their students as to what did and did not work in competition.

Also, does fighting scare you?.. Be a little honest here, in the days before fighting are you just a little scared.. Personally I get very nervous and try not to dwell too much on the up coming event.

I find fighting/competition is a great learning experience and a great motivator (for me anyway).

Now a simple question, and I'm not being judgemental at all - but if you don't compete, why?.

arybvtcw0eolkf

'Copy cat, copy cat, one two three - go home and tell your mammy that you copied off me'... :P

Right I'll answer this one in relation to MMA here.

When I discovered MMA I trained in it for awhile, tipping my toes in the water so to speak whilst at the same time I was just finishing my time in kickboxing and had just recently taken up Judo.

So why didn't I fight MMA or continue to train in MMA?.

Well I had fallen completely in love with Judo and with other commitements, ie family and work, I decided concentrating on Judo was going to be more constructive for me.

Also at the time I felt I was just that little bit too old to start fighting MMA, and tbh - I wouldn't get anything out of training in a style which I wasn't going to compete in.

As regards coaching, I do feel that a coach who has never fought lacks an understanding of the game and what drive's fighters to do what they do.

But thats just a personal view that I hold, why?.. Well after a fight (as anyone here who competes know's) everyone has a comment to make (win, lose or draw), well for me its the fighters who always have that little extra understanding to say the right thing almost every time.

I'm not answering it all as I want to keep some for my own post in SD&MA :P

Nothingcompares

Do I compete

No.

if you don't compete, why?.

I think MMA is serious business (unlike the other sports which are games with a pinch of vocation) and i wouldn't like to do it half-arsed. I've no problem turning up for a grappling tournament hungover and not trained in 6 weeks but if i was to compete in MMA I'd want to do it properly or not at all.

I don't compete yet, This is my first year of doing MMA, As to anything else, I coach kickboxing and I've done at least 3 competitions on each grade that i've done.

Professey Chin

Not competing yet.Aiming for my 1st league participation in the dublin round(of course ill be scouting in kilkenny )

Tyler MacDurden

I've started competing in the MMA League this year, my first experience of solo competitive sport. Previously I've only done team sports, rugby mainly. I hope to do some grappling competitions too, injuries permitting.

I've done the whole belt-factory martial arts experience too, and found it faintly ridiculous: pay 30 quid, perform glorified aerobics, receive another belt. Doing a martial art that actually involves testing yourself in competition is worlds removed from that, at any level I reckon.

I'd say I learned more valuable lessons in my first 5 minutes in the League than I did in several years of learning aerobic routines in 'pretend' kickboxing. Pain and humiliation focus the mind wonderfully.

As for the fear-factor, I was as nervous as hell for days beforehand, but I would have been more afraid of pulling out or quitting, if that makes sense?

One thing that comes from competition, I think, is deeper respect for anyone who fights. I cringe when I hear anyone criticise or abuse fighters, sitting on a barstool or on the sidelines. Until you've stepped up onto the mat, into the cage or wherever, the least you can show is some courtesy towards those who do.

soretoe

Great Thread.

MMA competition is de facto the toughest martial arts competition experience you can have - compare a black belt TKD international final with a decent C rules MMA match up and you'll see which is tougher. I've done a few gradings in a few martial arts growing up and competed in a couple of small competitions and I've been to a few more but none of them had anything on the MMA League and IT has no head shots! I gave the MMA league a lash one round down in Galway a few years back mostly out of curiousity as I'd had vitually no MMA training bar a few classes here and there and I learned an awful lot from those two fights and from watching the others. I got my ass handed to me on a plate in one and held out for a draw in the other but I was prowd for turning up and havin a go. The thing is with MMA is it's full on - you can't possibly consider fighting full MMA rules without a load of mental tough hard training as much as physically possible or you will get destroyed - and that's why there aren't many people who do - even in the best MMA gyms with membership of more than 200 you might get maybe 6 or 8 guys/girls willing to step it up to competitive MMA - the rest might have a go in the league but never step it up to C or B rules because you really gotta be sure you have what it takes which your trainer will tell you - there's no room for messing in MMA. The MMA league ROCKS! and anyone who is even half thinking of havin a lash should - great experience - full on resisting MMA against someone you never met - no head shots, no cheatin and a hand shake afterwards !

arybvtcw0eolkf

soretoe wrote: »

Great Thread.

MMA competition is de facto the toughest martial arts competition experience you can have - compare a black belt TKD international final with a decent C rules MMA match up and you'll see which is tougher. I've done a few gradings in a few martial arts growing up and competed in a couple of small competitions and I've been to a few more but none of them had anything on the MMA League and IT has no head shots! I gave the MMA league a lash one round down in Galway a few years back mostly out of curiousity as I'd had vitually no MMA training bar a few classes here and there and I learned an awful lot from those two fights and from watching the others. I got my ass handed to me on a plate in one and held out for a draw in the other but I was prowd for turning up and havin a go. The thing is with MMA is it's full on - you can't possibly consider fighting full MMA rules without a load of mental tough hard training as much as physically possible or you will get destroyed - and that's why there aren't many people who do - even in the best MMA gyms with membership of more than 200 you might get maybe 6 or 8 guys/girls willing to step it up to competitive MMA - the rest might have a go in the league but never step it up to C or B rules because you really gotta be sure you have what it takes which your trainer will tell you - there's no room for messing in MMA. The MMA league ROCKS! and anyone who is even half thinking of havin a lash should - great experience - full on resisting MMA against someone you never met - no head shots, no cheatin and a hand shake afterwards !

So what your saying is you enjoyed the MMA league, good stuff!.

Any opinions on anything else, ie coaching - does fight experience count? - do champions make champions?, how does competition motivate you, or does it?.

.

Tim_Murphy

MMA competition is de facto the toughest martial arts competition experience you can have - compare a black belt TKD international final with a decent C rules MMA match up and you'll see which is tougher.

I would expect the person in an anyway decent TKD international to be much more proficient in their sport than the C class MMA fighter would be in his TBH. It’s hard to compare fitness levels as the two sports are completely different but I would expect the TKDist to be fit for their final whereas it would be common enough for a C class fighter to gas badly in the last round of their fights.
If you want to compare martial arts competitions in terms of pure toughness then my money would be on Muay Thai.

cowzerp

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

If you want to compare martial arts competitions in terms of pure toughness then my money would be on Muay Thai.

I agree with this but would also add in top pro boxing aswell-both i feel are tougher than MMA, Muay thai is very punishing on the body and very tough, also 12 x 3 rounds of pro boxing is crazy and well above the work mere mortals could usually do, especially when taking many head blows and body shots..

MMA in my opinion is the complete martial art and the most effective but not the toughest..

Dragan

Do i compete?

Hell no. MMA looks tough as hell, really tough. You need to dedicate time and effort to ensure a win....it's not exactly time that i have at the moment. One thing i must say is that when your 28, the guys like Richie Moore and Karl Roache are real inspiring, as it was late when they even came into the game....so it's still in the back of my mind that if i start the training soon enough, i could possibly compete over the next couple of years.

That said, time is currently not on my side, i'm just back training in the gym and repairing all the little problems with my body ( it would be nice to be sure my knee wasn't going to explode if i went for a Triangle ), i'm working on my Portfolio for college, trying to get my book finished and also working on an album. Add in the fact that starting in MMA would mean starting form absolute zero....and it all gets a little daunting.

As such, for me it's ALWAYS a matter of time....i won't be able to do something that i want to do and it always turns out to be the MA side of things because in all honesty, it's just not as important for me to do that as for me to do the other things that i do.

Roper

Ummm Karl Roche isn't that old. I'll be sure to tell him you thought he was though. Actually, neither is Richie, although he looks ancient.

The other side of the coin is that one day I will train someone who will fight at a level well beyond what I am capable of. I'll have been around coaching circles a while then so I would hope that I would have gained the necessary experience to take them further. But by the rationale I'm using at the moment, this wouldn't be possible! I would have no problem handing an athlete over to someone else to further their development, but if I'm in any way decent as a coach, my students should be kicking my ass after a few years training. Indeed, a few of them already do.

I'm a fighter second and a coach first. If someone in my gym is a better grappler than me, it doesn't mean I can no longer coach them it just means I've done a really good job. If someone is a better fighter than me likewise. I do agree that I think you have to have competed, but I think people need to seperate coaching from fighting.

Also, stop TKD hating please. Apples and oranges.

OMCCABE

Compete?

Not as of yet but I will and I have time (I'm 22).

Nothingcompares nailed this for me. I haven't been nervous (at all) in sports since I was 12 years old and this includes combative sports because while I take them very seriously, they are a game to me.

I respect MMA as been as serious as you can get. I have been nursing bad injuries since I was 16 including a blowen out knee, torn shoulder and extremely brittle hands (I've broken 1 particular knuckle on 4 separate occasions as well as several others). I have constant problems with my thumbs as they are long and narrow and as such take a lot of impact when I land a closed fist.

Due to a mix of the above I haven't really been in "good" shape for about 3 years and I won't disrespect MMA by entering it with half a gas tank and far less strenght than I have had in the past. I love the sport too much for that and that is why I have resisted the urge to ask for fights on 2 recent shows put on by coaches I know.


Coaching?
I don't believe at all that it is necessary to compete in MMA in order to be a great MMA coach. I think if you are already a great coach then competing will only improve your coaching but I have met great competitiors in both amateur and professional sports that make shocking coaches and vice versa.

My main opinion is this :
If you want to know if you are a good coach then you should look at your students and there achievements and improvements which are built by your skills that you bring to the training/teaching mat and the training ring...not necessarily the skills that you bring to the competitive arena yourself.


Great question and very interestin responses that I am grateful to read.

-Oisin

Valmont

I have competed in a few sub wrestling tournaments but I get the jitters pretty bad so I've avoided them the last year or so.

I can only imagine having a few actual MMA fights would really help with anyone's game develop although I don't think it's completely necessary to having a decent enough training-only game; as long as you spar of course.

Jason Mc

Have competed at judo, JJ and kickboxing.

Haven't fought in a match in about 5 years. I'm 35 now.

I'm in an odd situation where I miss competing but because of commintments with family and coaching its very hard to train the way I think it is necessary to do well at MMA.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Valmont wrote: »

I have competed in a few sub wrestling tournaments but I get the jitters pretty bad so I've avoided them the last year or so.

.

Thats very honest of you, if truth be known I've come close to that myself but I've never actually pulled out.

In the final week or so before a competition I usually find myself looking for valid excuse's to pull out "Oh, that knee is at me again" , or "Nah, I haven't really prepared" and other stuff but I don't believe for a moment that anyone here (except Cowzer maybe :P - more of this later) hasn't suffered some doubt/fear and pushed through it, I think thats one thing that a coach who has never fought will never understand.

Some time to blow smoke up Cowzer's hole now - inspiration!.. Fighter's who take on a fight with literally a days notice, they inspire me when I'm having some doubts about myself.

I remember when Cowzer first came on the scene, taking his first few fights with little or no notice and the talk in the gym's "Ere, does anyone know this fella 'Paul 'something' from Rush - he's got red hair?".

I've often wondered to myself, and have never asked Paul - do you not get the jitter's like me? and if you do what drive's you through it.

I'd appricate Pauls thoughts as both a coach & a fighter.

.

cowzerp

Griffin Small Shootout wrote: »

Some time to blow smoke up Cowzer's hole now - inspiration!.. Fighter's who take on a fight with literally a days notice, they inspire me when I'm having some doubts about myself.

I remember when Cowzer first came on the scene, taking his first few fights with little or no notice and the talk in the gym's "Ere, does anyone know this fella 'Paul 'something' from Rush - he's got red hair?".

I've often wondered to myself, and have never asked Paul - do you not get the jitter's like me? and if you do what drive's you through it.

I'd appricate Pauls thoughts as both a coach & a fighter.

.

LOL-Long post ahead

My 1st fight was in the old point on cage rage against James Doolan, he's beaten Mickey Young, Kevin Mcalonan, Neil Seery and Steve Mcombe (all top fighters in there own rights) i got the call to come and weigh in and literally jumped in the car hung over and weighed in, i lost by choke after been hit some heavy leg kicks which i was not used too, when i connected a big right it went straight to clinch and to the ground, i escaped mount if i remember correct and went into a basic choke to lose, i really had a poor ground game, a bit of natural wrestling ability and no real BJJ skills.

that was in may 07 and i was training for my 1st pro fight to be had in august 07 so i was on the weight, i also fought ring of truth in under a week notice in july and fought with a flu(never again), i had not boxed for awhile before these 2 as i'd broke my knee cap playing soccer and tried to play on for 5 mins so was out of action for a while after that.

I dont fear pain, my only fear is not been able to provide for my baby and pay the mortgage-as far as nerves go i do get nervous doing MMA which i love as i'd lost the nerves in Boxing and this inhibits your abilities so i'd tell anyone who gets nerves to be happy, but like they say in rocky-dont let them burn you up. (i also get just as nervous when my fighters are fighting-i dont like these nerves!)

As far as coaching goes, if a club has a number of coaches and none have fought MMA then i dont really get why there teaching MMA, there is 5 coaches in my club and 3 have fought and the other 2 are gone past the age to fight (They are specialist coaches anyway)

In saying that competition is not for everyone so if a lad trains with a good MMA club for a period of time so there at a high enough level to inspire and teach fighters then i would look at that different if they set up a club and ran it properly

Now if a Kickboxing club (JUST AN EXAMPLE) learn MMA off the internet and start coaching MMA then i think thats BS, maybe they should get a mentor from 1 of the top gyms to oversee them for a few years till they can really take over and become a real MMA club and compete and show that your actually an MMA fighter/coach.

colinlaird000

Hey guys,

Whats my experience..

My first MMA fight was against a certain Mark Leonard in cage wars in Belfast, and i nearly wet myself to be honest. Beforehand i had done a couple of Mc-jitsu grappling competitions, and considered myself to be ok. I was really just a light heavy weight sized fish in an uninteresting pond.

After that i fought John Donnelly in an exhibition (I wish someone had told John that lol), Gareth Loye, and Stevie Lynch at amateur level. Between these i entered the BJJ open at white belt level and did ok.. Not winning, but getting a couple of shiny things for my efforts.

Moved up to pro after finishing my masters degree. was offered a fight in england, and took it. They then proceeded to change my opponent quite a few times (sigh) but i fought anyway. I wasnt going all that way for nothing. Was quite twitchy as my dad wasnt well, and probbaly needed to vent a little to be honest!

Then fought ritchie moore (twice. i hear he wants to go again lol. The nut) And fought againts the man mountain sergei at crc. After this my face looked funny for a while so i competed at the bjj europeans. On paper i did ok, but i came home with a to of work to do!

As for getting the jitters. I propped for my school 1st XV (The top one in northern ireland probably) and then did the same at uni, and got to the BUSA quarter finals. Never got nervous. When you're on your own in the middle of a room full of people, and a 93kg guy is trying to make your face look like somebody elses, its a different story the first few times. Oddly though, my last fight, where i got my arse handed to me, i had no nerves at all. Therefore i must assume nerves, for me anyway, are good.

Coaching.. Maybe coaching and doing corner are two different things. I reckon a good cornerman needs to have been there, and think tactially while appreciating getting slammed and punched in the face for 15 minutes makes you a bit tired occasionally. A coach needs to be able to develop the abilities of his fighters to their maximum potential. I'm just an assistant really at present, and i take my hat off to guys who coach full time. The effort, time, and organisation that goes into keeping a gym open, never mind making it successful, are an achievement in itself.

And I'm 33. Less of the ageist comments lol

Tim_Murphy

Fighter's who take on a fight with literally a days notice, they inspire me when I'm having some doubts about myself.

I'm all for guys giving it a lash but fighters jumping into fights when they either aren't prepared, or are simply out of their depth isn't the way to go either.

cowzerp

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

I'm all for guys giving it a lash but fighters jumping into fights when they either aren't prepared, or are simply out of their depth isn't the way to go either.

Thats 100% true Tim, in hindsight i wish i never took my 1st 2 short notice fights as i was not fight fit or at the skill level required to fight the 2 opponents and put me into that bracket before i'd got a chance to work my way up, Now if i was fit and already in training for a fight i'd do it again but only if i actually felt ready.

ollieo

I've competed in both MMA league rounds this year and plan on doing the next two legs over the coming months.

To be honest I got very nervous coming up to my fights but I think thats normal as anyone I've ever asked about getting nervous have told me that they do.

I would like to fight at C Class at some stage but I would need to be able to completely commit to training, which I cannot do at the moment due to work placement and I'm going into my final year in college in September also.

koking

in my opinion if i wasnt nervous for a fight i would then be gettin worried nerves if u can control them keep u sharp,its small things like knowin the feelin of the nerves and how to deal wit them that a coach who hasnt competed cant help u with,its very easy to throw someone into a match and say ah ul b grand ur ready when the coach hasnt competed him/herself to know if the fighter is mentally ready for it.

I've done a few grappling tournaments but around 3 years ago I started suffering from a pretty severe anxiety problem which pretty much stopped me from training nevermind competing. I found it pretty hard to get myself up for competitions and got the jitters pretty bad. That as well as my job which kept me working loads and led to me missing training a lot meant I was out of comps for a long time. Towards the end of last year I thought to myself that I have to just start going for it so I did my 1st two MMA League fights back in December on about a weeks notice and now I'm planning on entering pretty much any jits competitions I can from now on and depending on how sharp I can get my stand up (I haven't trained in months so want to sharpen up again 1st) I may even compete MMA before the year end.

For those who get the jitters it's the same with anything, I felt the same before I jumped out of a plane or did a cliff jump or even sometimes did an exam, you just have to focus your energy, embrace the fear and do it anyway. You'll regret it otherwise.

"The real hero is the man who fights even though he is scared."

Dragan

Roper wrote: »

Ummm Karl Roche isn't that old. I'll be sure to tell him you thought he was though. Actually, neither is Richie, although he looks ancient.

Pretty sure both of them are older than me, which makes them old.

Perspective Barry, t'is all about perspective.

Thanks for dashing that last hope though mate, i'll be sure to give you a hug if i'm ever snapping an event your at.