Do you compete?.

arybvtcw0eolkf

And if you do, do you think it should be a requirement on your journey through your various grades and do you think it makes one a better coach?.

Personally speaking it used to annoy me when I was kickboxing that people could grade through their clubs syllabus right through to black belt, then go onto coach students without having the benefit of competing to advise their students as to what did and did not work in competition.

Also, does fighting scare you?.. Be a little honest here, in the days before fighting are you just a little scared.. Personally I get very nervous and try not to dwell too much on the up coming event.

I find fighting/competition is a great learning experience and a great motivator (for me anyway).

Now a simple question, and I'm not being judgemental at all - but if you don't compete, why?.

.

Nothingcompares

I train mostly in BJJ and Judo as a hobby. I think 'organised competitions' like submission wrestling tournaments, Irish Open et.c are very enjoyable just to compete in, win/lose or draw. I think it's very healthy to participate in a game you play (whether it's judo or rugby or chess) with people from outside your club/group/team just to gain that deeper perspective on what it's all about.

Like I remember playing rugby as a child in school and we were never encouraged to kick the ball by our coaches (presumably their idea was to focus on improving handling skills). One day we played a team (presumably) full of Gaa crossover players. And they never stopped kicking the ball. So that was interesting just to see there are people doing the same thing very differently.

Also, competitions are the best way just to meet other people from the different clubs you don't train in and catch up etc. In sports like judo and BJJ it's especially important to roll (spar)with different people and competitions are often the best way to do this.

With regard to coaching, I'm largely from the school of taught that you can only coach as far as you've competed yourself. So if you want to compete in the Olympics or you want to win a world championship you need to be training with people that have been there and done that (as close to that level as possible). I also subscribe to the point of view that if you want to be successful as an athlete you have to leave the coaching to someone else.

Having said that there are many exceptions to the above rules. Also it's worth stating that the title "coach" is quite ambiguous. Manchester united soccer team have a manager, a coach and a trainer who all perform different roles.

Like in saying you need a Olympic Standard coach to become an Olympic standard athlete I don't necessarily mean you need a former Olympian holding your hand while you're out doing a jog, doing press ups, doing fairly normal training.

I think GSP represents this type of athlete. GSP doesn't train on a day to day basis with Greg Jackson (an elite level coach (but a non-elite level competitor)) but he has trainers in Wrestling, Bjj and Muay Thai who are at the highest level (afaik).

Furthermore, it's obviously not the case that the best athletes become the best coaches or the best coaches were once the best athletes. If i want to start running 100m in 10s i'm going to give Ushain Bolt's trainer a call not Bolt himself. If i want to be the best football in the world, I'd watch C Ronaldo or L Messi but I'd be speaking with and traininng under trainers.

Definitely reached my words per post limit.

HammerHeadGym

Do you compete?.
Yes, I do. And will again in 4 weeks actually.

I don't do grades but I definitely think it should be a requirement for advancement in any art. And definitely I don't see how anyone can coach a fighter if he hasn't fought himself.

I agree totally with the comment about coachs who have never fought. It used to go through me in the trad arts, particularly in Ninpo when guys who'd never seen a scuffle since fifth class would be telling me what would and would not work in 'real' situations.

Fighting scares the bejeezus out of me. It's also an incredible rush. I crap myself all the way up to the event, then when the bell rings I always say, 'I didn't train enough'. Then I get a box in the mush and then I go from Dave to Hammerhead.

If I'm going to be honest here, I have to say that taking a fight is the only way to gewt me to train at my maximum potential. I definitely learn a lot but usually by watching the vid after.

dasmoose

Good thread.

I'm on the fence about whether or not competition should be mandatory for rank advancement. Some people are fantastic coaches and club fighters but for whatever reason just don't do themselves justice in competition - whether through nerves, or cardio, or whatever - but does this mean they don't deserve promoted?

I do however think that everyone should compete at least once. The experience (the first few times at least) is radically different from training and will give you an idea how you'll react under pressure.

Personally I compete all the time. I did my first grappling tournament 3 months after starting BJJ and on average I've done one tournament every month or two since then. For me competing is just as much a part of BJJ as going to class, and while I can theoretically understand why others don't compete as much (or at all) for me it's just part of the sport.

I think one area where I would give constructive criticism is to people who take competition too seriously. I've often heard from a lot of different people (when I ask if they fancy entering a tournament) that they "haven't been training much" or "are out of shape" or "it's only 3 weeks away" and so on - and my response tends to be "...and?". I think it would be helpful for people to appreciate that competition on the level of local comps isn't really a big deal. This isn't to say the level isn't very good - it is, and it gets better all the time - but in the scheme of things is it really such a big deal if you lose a grappling match in a local tournament? If you're competing in the right division and someone beats you... so what? You should be competing against people who can beat you!

One of the questions the TS asked was "do you get nervous?" Well this relates to my last point because after doing a lot of tournaments you find you just don't get nervous any more. I was absolutely bricking it for my first grappling tournament After I think around the 5th or 6th I just didn't get nervous any more. Once you've had that experience a bunch of times you realise it's really not such a big scary thing and you can just get on the mat and enjoy it - and that's something that's worth realising as well.

As Kev said MMA is serious business, grappling is fun. Get on the mat, hopefully have a fun match and see where your strengths and weaknesses are. Meet a bunch of new people, shout for your team mates and see how they get on, and of course go for the obligatory fast food afterwards

Khannie

Good idea for a thread. Fair play.

I compete and I really enjoy it. I have learned a HUGE amount from competition, both about myself and my sport.

The biggest thing I've learned is that I have the balls to compete and that I'll be grand after a punch in the head. People worry too much about getting hit. It's grand.

And yes Makikomi....I get nervous. I think there'd be something wrong with you if you didn't (or else you'd wanna think very little of your opponent). I mean...someone's trained hard especially to kick the crap out of you and you're about to face off against them. The nerves are good too though....adrenaline's a powerful painkiller.

Unpossible

Yes I compete when I can for a few reasons.
When I was (and soon will be again) a swimming coach I found it a huge advantage to have been through the various competitions, I knew the type of work needed, the type of mindset needed and I knew what it felt like to have to go to a place and swim my heart out to try and make qualifying times. I can honestly say I would not have been such a good coach had I not been a compeditive swimmer. When I took up HanMooDo I knew there was a possibility I would be coaching it someday and I wanted to know what its like to step on that mat with a guy who is trying to take your head off.

Then there is the fact that I view martial arts as hobbies/sports and if you are going to take up a sport or hobby you should at least try all aspects of it.

Also, does fighting scare you?.. Be a little honest here, in the days before fighting are you just a little scared.. Personally I get very nervous and try not to dwell too much on the up coming event.

Yes, the first two competitions were ok but I won them and for some reason started putting all this pressure on myself and over analysing things the next few comps didn't go badly but I was way more nervous. I don't really understand why I have the problem, competing didn't bother me this much in swimming, but then I am not competing as much.
This is one of the reasons I fight, because it makes me scared and uncomfortable and if I run or walk away from that then I lose. I make myself step in that ring because I don't want to, I hope that if I can deal with that fear then eventually I will lose it or at least I will be better at dealing with it.

Then of course there is the fact that I need to fight to get a black belt. I'm not sure how many competitions I have to fight as a brown belt (I think there has been a rule change), but competitions and training camps are how you get noticed. If the GM doesn't see you very often then he doesn't know how you are progressing and you won't get invited to the Black Belt exam.

Hope that all made sense

beGood

Good questions! I can only write about Judo since it's the area I'm most familiar with. I still compete, but not as much as I used to. When I started Judo I thought it was all about competition but I've since learned that while competition is not an end goal in Judo it is a key element in a Judoka's development. So every Judoka, health permitting, should experience it. There are some lessons one can only learn in shiai.

Regarding gradings, I like the Kodokan system of grading to 1 dan where some competition experience ranging from batsugun to collecting some points is one of the requirements. It can be seen here: Kodokan

As for teaching Judo, since shiai is an important element in a Judoka's experience I would say that it's a prerequisite to being a good teacher. They don't need to have been world beaters but they need to know what it's like to be in that situation. I have never met a Judo teacher that has never competed so I don't think it's a common scenario in Judo.

In the case of a high level coach training athletes to go to international tournaments then the coaches own competitive record doesn't matter IMHO. The coach should of course have competed but a high level coach needs to know not only about Judo but sports psychology, biomechanics, physiology and much more to get results from their athletes. As has been said already, the best fighters don't always make the best coaches and the best coaches weren't necessarily the best fighters.

I certainly do get nervous before competitions but I wouldn't say I get scared. Experiencing the nerves and learning how to deal with them is all part of the journey. It's quite natural, even the legendary Yasuhiro Yama****a admits in his book "The Fighting Spirit of Judo" to being nervous before fighting!

arybvtcw0eolkf

beGood wrote: »

I certainly do get nervous before competitions but I wouldn't say I get scared. Experiencing the nerves and learning how to deal with them is all part of the journey. It's quite natural, even the legendary Yasuhiro Yama****a admits in his book "The Fighting Spirit of Judo" to being nervous before fighting!

Thats another book I've to chase down now!..

Yamashita speaks about his pre-fight nerves in 'The Pyjama Game' too, and how he combats it.

**Edit - thanks, I've just ordered that book from Amazon!.

.

beGood

Cason Enough Pail wrote: »

Yamashita speaks about his pre-fight nerves in 'The Pyjama Game' too, and how he combats it.

**Edit - thanks, I've just ordered that book from Amazon!.

.

Enjoy the book! Another interesting mental barrier discussed in the book is when he loses his fighting spirit. I've lost my appetite for Judo twice in my thirteen years of training but fortunately I've regained it each time. It's encouraging for me to know some of the issues I've had to overcome were once faced by such a great champion!