Boylesports.com require Sports Writers

lilywhites1982

Hi Guys,

On behalf of Boylesports.com we are looking for writers interested in gaining experience for their portfolio by writing sport previews and reports for a range of sports which will be published on our Betting News site, http://bettingnews.boylesports.com/ We are trying to build a bank of writers that can provide us with content throughout the year. If anyone is interested please contact me at azamboglou@boylesports.com This opportunity may suit beginners or student hoping to add some experience to their portfolio.

Fatboydim

I take it that there is no payment. If there was I might be interested in doing some articles. But only at union rates.

rockbeer

Yeah, I get pretty annoyed by folk coming on here basically looking for free content for their sites.

No free content, but here's a free tip for you lilywhites1982: you get what you pay for.

leggo

rockbeer, unless you're currently a WELL paid journalist then you've really no right to comment. And, if you were, you'd understand that this isn't a position to be sneezed at.

You get your opportunities in these fields by taking whatever opportunities you can get for little to no financial reimbursement, then build up your value through strength of portfolio. Who do you think an editor of a major publication is going to publish? A guy who's attitude is, "I'm so freaking good...but you won't get to see how good I am until you give me figures!" or a guy who's got a portfolio full of solid, published material for established publications, websites and companies?

You build your value. When you start out you're worth nothing...even if you believe that your stuff is gold and will make you a millionaire one day, other's don't know that and won't give you the chance to show it until you prove you're worth it.

This is a good opportunity for aspiring writers. Get some high quality stuff out there that's regularly featured prominently on the site. Network and keep your bosses satisfied and on good terms so that they'll give you a reference down the line. Then take your work elsewhere at a later stage. That's how you work your way up the ladder. Don't believe advice to the contrary for those whose value is equally worthless.

rockbeer

I don't really see the relevance between what I earn and my right to comment. The way I see it, there is an alarming and growing trend these days to not value the work people produce. What you regard as an unpaid apprenticeship I, being more old school I suspect, regard as exploitation. While people can get their content for nothing, and while people are willing to provide it for nothing, what motivation is there for anyone to pay?

But just to clarify my position, I write freelance and I get paid for it. And you probably wouldn't believe how often I get blagged by people who flatter me, praise my work, and then ask me to give them some in exchange for "the experience" or "the exposure". I'm tired of explaining to these people that exposure doesn't pay the bills. It's a fiction. If you work for nothing then the value you place on your work is, precisely, nothing.

If you're fine with that kind of world then that's your business, but personally I foresee a time when very few people can realistically expect to get paid for producing content because there's always somebody less capable or with less self-respect who is happy to provide it for nothing, often under the illusion that it is somehow in their interests to do so.

Frankiestylee

Better off posting this in the media&journalism board.

As a journalism student I can tell you that I know loads of people who would jump at this chance and I'll be forwarding this page to them. I'd do it myself but my sporting knowledge wouldn't be up to the task.

It's all about building up your portfolio, artists do it, musicians do it, many professions do it. It's not exploitation if it's serving your interests.

EileenG

I am a big believer in getting paid for your work. If it's good enough to publish, it's worth paying for. Yes, we all do some writing for love, but professional writing should be paid professional rates. Otherwise, writing will soon cease to be a profession.

leggo

In an ideal world...yes, we would all get paid exactly what we're worth for our work.

The fact is, though, that there's a million and one writers out there and neither enough time in the day for editors to sift through their writings nor cash to pay them for it.

You get regular paid work...in both journalism, the entertainment industry and pretty much everywhere...by busting your arse for nothing (or next to it), paying your dues and building up a value until you are so well reputed and equipped that those with the big bucks can't ignore you anymore. The phrase 'It takes money to make money' comes to mind. It also takes time and dedication.

Here's the thing: no matter how good you are, nobody out there -- not ONE person -- wants to just GIVE you money out of their pocket for being talented! However, if they can make money off you, if they see a value in you and, therefore, if you've built up a value in yourself through said hard work and dedication...THEN you can start picking and choosing.

Those who sit around with an ego to them (and rockbeer, for the record, this isn't directed at you so please don't take offence) expecting the pay cheques and job offers to come rolling in after meandering through a journalism degree are going to be left waiting a long time for that big pay cheque.

Disagreeing with these simple FACTS exposes a lack of real world experience and savvy unfortunately.

This is a perfectly fine job offer for aspiring sports writers looking to add to their CV. Boyle Sports is a known, respected brand and being published on their official Irish website wouldn't get sneezed at by any means.

godspal

its a simple matter of if you want to have people see your writing or not. And I want people to see my writing, my ego can be put to one side for stuff i care about. This is something to put on my CV, which will be awesome! I want to WRITE!

rockbeer

leggo wrote: »

Disagreeing with these simple FACTS exposes a lack of real world experience and savvy unfortunately.

leggo, I don't know what you do, nor how much you earn for it, nor how you got where you are. But let me just say that my own personal direct experience is in direct contradiction to your "simple facts".

I have written for nothing - who hasn't? But to nothing like the extent you claim is necessary. There are certainly ways to get paid for freelance writing work other than busting a gut for nothing. You'd be amazed at the results you might get from the following:

- being professional
- writing to a high standard, with due attention to the tools of your trade
- researching your markets carefully
- being professional
- pitching in a professional manner that editors will recognize as such
- knowing your subject matter
- developing unusual and thought-provoking angles on your subjects.
- Did I mention being professional?

I'm not saying it's easy, but what I would say is that editors, in my experience (and remember that this is the verifiable real-world experience of a freelance writer who gets regular work, not the ramblings of someone "lacking real-world experience and savvy"), definitely do not have enough time to trawl through acres of free copy even if I choose to waste my time writing it. They are interested in seeing a small handful of worthwhile clippings and the best way to establish yourself is to concentrate on trying to get yourself such a selection of clippings, accompanied by a seriously professional attitude. And a significant part of that is valuing yourself and what you do.

I would say from experience that your time would be much better spent trying very hard to sell a small number of worthwhile articles to reasonable publications than writing acres of free copy for people who aren't prepared to recognize your efforts. Of course writing all that free copy can certainly help you develop your style and learn your trade, but in terms of helping you get proper paid work I'd say it's pretty much worthless.

And what sort of writer doesn't write all the time anyway?

No offence taken - we're clearly on different sides of the fence here, but please believe me when I say there are many more ways than one to skin this particular cat. Because I know.

lilywhites1982

rockbeer wrote: »

Yeah, I get pretty annoyed by folk coming on here basically looking for free content for their sites.

No free content, but here's a free tip for you lilywhites1982: you get what you pay for.

I realise it may seem like I have come on to get 'free content' for our site. Although we have no shortage of content as we have Press Association wire but we are actually looking for opinionated sports editorial in the style of 'letters to the editor', but maybe I made this point incorrectly in my post.

I have spent years contributing content anywhere I can and enjoy writing articles for a hobbie more than anything. I felt that there may be students out there hoping to get some experience in journalism and we would in turn have no problem providing a reference for their future job opportunities. I don't expect to receive content from freelance journalists for free, as I believe that their content is their living.

Anyway it's an offer that is opened for anyone who is interested and we have already received plenty of people hoping to contribute an article. If you would like to contact me further about this that just drop me a mail azamboglou@boylesports.com

Thank you

Fabulosa

Ok, speaking as someone who has had a successful (pre-recession) career as a commercial writer in a very competitive area, and as a someone who worked for peanuts to get there...

By all means Boylesport, throw the challenge out there. Make it a bit of a contest. Collect 50 pieces for free. Publish them even. Then pick one you'd like to work with. And offer the kid a 100 euros per article, 50 even?

I realise you (lilywhiteetc.) are probably just an open minded marketing/pr head with an interest in writers/writing but you can squeeze that amount out of any budget. And we ALL know Boyle sports has the spondulux. The house never loses, right?

redapple

Fabulosa wrote: »

Ok, speaking as someone who has had a successful (pre-recession) career as a commercial writer in a very competitive area, and as a someone who worked for peanuts to get there...

By all means Boylesport, throw the challenge out there. Make it a bit of a contest. Collect 50 pieces for free. Publish them even. Then pick one you'd like to work with. And offer the kid a 100 euros per article, 50 even?

I realise you (lilywhiteetc.) are probably just an open minded marketing/pr head with an interest in writers/writing but you can squeeze that amount out of any budget. And we ALL know Boyle sports has the spondulux. The house never loses, right?

I agree. €50 - 100 would be an incentive besides exposure and also act as a confidence boost to the 'kid' (although I think anyone starting out at any age would be interested).

lilywhites1982

Thanks for all your ideas and suggestions guys. If anyone is interested then you have my details above. We will work with anyone who wishes to contribute and will come to agreement in terms of work and reward with the writers interested,

Aidric

Is this thing a wind up or what? I replied to that email address a week ago and heard nothing. Anyone had something similar?

pog it

Really? I was just about to pass this link onto a friend of mine tomorrow!

Anyone get a reply just to be on safe side??

lilywhites1982

pog it wrote: »

Really? I was just about to pass this link onto a friend of mine tomorrow!

Anyone get a reply just to be on safe side??

Hi Guys,

It definitely isn't a joke! My email address is azamboglou@boylesports.com for those of you who haven't had a reply ensure the address is spelt correctly as my name is Greek so not too easy to remember. Two of the many applicants have already had worked published, here are the links.

Many thanks to the guys for these fantastically written articles,

http://bettingnews.boylesports.com/gaa-gaelic-games/gaelic-football/kerry-unrest-is-simply-fiction.php

and

http://bettingnews.boylesports.com/football/premier-league/prepare-for-premiership-lift-off.php

pog it

Are you still looking for writers?

mike65

Jasus that Premier League article is a cavalcade of cliches!

PCPhoto

Frankiestylee wrote: »

Better off posting this in the media&journalism board.

As a journalism student I can tell you that I know loads of people who would jump at this chance and I'll be forwarding this page to them. I'd do it myself but my sporting knowledge wouldn't be up to the task.

It's all about building up your portfolio, artists do it, musicians do it, many professions do it. It's not exploitation if it's serving your interests.

YES it is !!

Its exploitation of people who are inexperienced, unfortunately its a fact of life that inexperienced people get taken advantage of , its all part of life lessons.

I've been paid €60 by a newspaper to drive from Cork to Monaghan and back and photograph a football game (this was several years ago - I was young and DID have experience in taking pics but not experience in earning money from my hobby at the time)

Even nowadays I have done jobs for regional papers and have not received payments (several months later)...needless to say - a note is made and some papers have been blacklisted from my services.

PCPhoto

lilywhites1982 wrote: »

Hi Guys,

It definitely isn't a joke! My email address is azamboglou@boylesports.com for those of you who haven't had a reply ensure the address is spelt correctly as my name is Greek so not too easy to remember. Two of the many applicants have already had worked published, here are the links.

Many thanks to the guys for these fantastically written articles,

http://bettingnews.boylesports.com/gaa-gaelic-games/gaelic-football/kerry-unrest-is-simply-fiction.php

and

http://bettingnews.boylesports.com/football/premier-league/prepare-for-premiership-lift-off.php

Have these "reporters" received any money for their work ?

pog it

Well on the plus side getting experience starting out in journalism will teach you whether or not you're cut out for it, and also whether you would be happy with a life accepting pay in no way commensurate with your work-rate and talent.

Years ago I got paid the nicest 25 euro I ever made by a regional newspaper that published an article I went in and submitted to the editor. He asked me did I write it, said my talent was really rare BUT that if he could do it over again, he wouldn't have gone down the journalism route at all! I had a good chat with him, and thought hard about it all and realised I'd never do it full-time. I still write for myself.

I guess at least BoyleSports are offering a reference for a couple of articles, and it's a learning curve. Sure no harm. Where else would peope with no experience get this exposure?

Lorddrakul

Are you intested in motorsport material - MotoGP, WorldSuperbikes, British Superbikes etc?

LD