Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Irish Provinces minus Imports

  • 13-07-2009 10:13pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭


    So I decided to make a starting 15 of the provinces best players minus imports. Which team do you think is the strongest?

    Leinster :

    1.Healy
    2.Jackman
    3.Ross
    4.Cullen
    5.Malcom O'Kelly
    6.Sean O'Brien
    7.Jennings
    8.Heaslip
    9.Reddan
    10.Sexton
    11.Fitzgerald
    12.D'arcy
    13.Brian O'Driscoll
    14.Horgan
    15.Kearney

    Munster :

    1.Horan
    2.Flannery
    3.Hayes
    4.DOC
    5.POC
    6.Quinlan
    7.Wallace
    8.Leamy
    9.T'OL
    10.ROG
    11.Dowling
    12.Murphy
    13.Earls
    14.Felix Jones
    15.Hurley

    Ulster :

    1.Court
    2.Best
    3.Young
    4.Caldwell
    5.McCullough
    6.Ferris
    7.Pollock
    8.Henry
    9.Boss
    10.Humphries
    11.Trimble
    12.Wallace
    13.Cave
    14.McCrea
    15.Cunnigham

    Connacht :

    1.Lyn
    2.Cronin
    3.McGovern
    4.Farley
    5.Gannon/Swift
    6.O'Connor
    7.Rigney (no.8 but no other Irish flankers)
    8.Muldoon
    9.Murphy
    10.Keatley
    11.Fionn Carr
    12.Deane
    13. Hearty/Matthews
    14.Riordan
    15.Gavin Duffy

    Which side is the strongest without imports? 53 votes

    Leinster
    0%
    Munster
    66%
    CrashSamuraiozt9vdujny3srfSundyfunky penguinSpAcEd OuT[Jackass]yeraulonechupacabraMorfJellostephen_nOisinjmbudhabobB0XRiskymovektulu123Podge_irlLegion2008rockman15 35 votes
    Ulster
    32%
    2040Mossy MonkJilmNukemOtaconAuversAmazotheamazingOafley Jonesbuck65premierstonetwinytwoJudgement DaythebossanovaTomtom364HyperbulletMickTippobcork 17 votes
    Connacht
    1%
    Stev_o 1 vote


Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    Munster
    Well it's clearly between Leinster and Munster anyway, I went for Leinster because I don't think that Munster backline looks too good. Munster having an all Irish first choice back helps them anyway.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 211 ✭✭MickTipp


    Ulster
    munster would have the best team


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    I went with leinster as you have arguably a backline that could hold its own at international level as well as a very strong pack with players like Jennings, Healy, Malcom O'Kelly, Cullen and Heaslip, 3 of which I can see starting 6nations. Whereas with Munster I could see the backline in particular getting destroyed. Ulster have a decent team but other than Ferris and Best are very ordinary whilst Connacht couldn't possibly challenge


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,463 ✭✭✭twinytwo


    Ulster
    munster pack by a mile leinster backs by a mile thats the way its been for years... that said bring on the HC


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    twinytwo wrote: »
    munster pack by a mile leinster backs by a mile thats the way its been for years... that said bring on the HC

    I disagree although not as good players such as Ross (GP dream team player) would be more than able to hold his own against an ageing Hayes, Cullen and MOK have proven they can nulify POC and DOC whilst Jennings is playing better than Wallace is currently. Healy is better than Horan, Heaslip is better than Leamy. The only players munster have better than Leinster by a mile in the pack is Flannery and Quinlan. Meanwhile with the Leinster backline you have arguably other than Reddan and Horgan the Irish international backline for the upcoming 6 nations whereas Munster have to start players such as Dowling, Hurley, Murphy, Jones.

    I think the Leinster pack would be more or less able to hold its ground but I believe the Munster backline would get absolutely destroyed and thats the difference for me. That said I believe Ulster are solid all around but just not exceptional anywhere.


  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 10,598 Mod ✭✭✭✭Robbo


    Connacht :

    1.Lyn
    2.Cronin
    3.McGovern
    4.Farley
    5.Gannon/Swift
    6.O'Connor
    7.Rigney (no.8 but no other Irish flankers)
    8.Muldoon
    9.Murphy
    10.Keatley
    11.Fionn Carr
    12.Deane
    13. Hearty/Matthews
    14.Riordan
    15.Gavin Duffy
    John Lyne, Brian McGovern,Mel Deane (who is English, as it happens), David Gannon, Andrew Farley (Australian but Irish qualified and I think capped) and Danny Riordan are no longer at Connacht.

    In the second row, I think Michael Swift is Irish qualified. Mike McCarthy might be ineligible and Bernie Upton's a Kiwi.

    So on account of comings and goings and assuming Swifty can be more than just an honorary Galwegian...

    1. Ronan Loughney
    2. Sean Cronin
    3. Jamie Hagan
    4. Andrew Browne
    5. Michael Swift
    6. Johnny O'Connor
    7. Colm Rigney
    8. John Muldoon

    9. Frank Murphy
    10. Ian Keatley
    11. Brian Tuohy
    12. Keith Matthews
    13. Aidan Wynne
    14. Fionn Carr
    15. Gavin Duffy

    A tactical genius of the stature of Michael Bradley might go with Duffy, Carr, Wynne at 13-14-15.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    Robbo wrote: »
    John Lyne, Brian McGovern,Mel Deane (who is English, as it happens), David Gannon, Andrew Farley (Australian but Irish qualified and I think capped) and Danny Riordan are no longer at Connacht.

    In the second row, I think Michael Swift is Irish qualified. Mike McCarthy might be ineligible and Bernie Upton's a Kiwi.

    So on account of comings and goings and assuming Swifty can be more than just an honorary Galwegian...

    1. Ronan Loughney
    2. Sean Cronin
    3. Jamie Hagan
    4. Andrew Browne
    5. Michael Swift
    6. Johnny O'Connor
    7. Colm Rigney
    8. John Muldoon

    9. Frank Murphy
    10. Ian Keatley
    11. Brian Tuohy
    12. Keith Matthews
    13. Aidan Wynne
    14. Fionn Carr
    15. Gavin Duffy

    A tactical genius of the stature of Michael Bradley might go with Duffy, Carr, Wynne at 13-14-15.



    A lot of comings and goings! I thought Deane qualified for Ireland??


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,463 ✭✭✭twinytwo


    Ulster
    I disagree although not as good players such as Ross (GP dream team player) would be more than able to hold his own against an ageing Hayes, Cullen and MOK have proven they can nulify POC and DOC whilst Jennings is playing better than Wallace is currently. Healy is better than Horan, Heaslip is better than Leamy. The only players munster have better than Leinster by a mile in the pack is Flannery and Quinlan. Meanwhile with the Leinster backline you have arguably other than Reddan and Horgan the Irish international backline for the upcoming 6 nations whereas Munster have to start players such as Dowling, Hurley, Murphy, Jones.

    I think the Leinster pack would be more or less able to hold its ground but I believe the Munster backline would get absolutely destroyed and thats the difference for me. That said I believe Ulster are solid all around but just not exceptional anywhere.

    Im assuming u are basing this on one Hc semi final?... when was the last time MOk or cullen played for ireland?.. and as iv said before had he have been given a decent shot Wallace would probally have been one of the best 8's this country has ever produced


  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 10,598 Mod ✭✭✭✭Robbo


    A lot of comings and goings! I thought Deane qualified for Ireland??
    I stand corrected. Apparently he has A and 7's caps.

    That said, his second stint at the Sportsground was best forgotten.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Munster
    Munster without Mafi, Howlett, Warwick (I don't include Nick "WTF?" Williams in this list btw) would be a really weakened team.

    Munster Backline

    9. TOL/Strings

    10. ROG ................no back up here at all

    11. Dowling

    12. Barry Murphy............. Decent player but nowhere near Mafi's class

    13. Earls ......................Fine

    14. Felix Jones....... Out of position but the only decent option (Carney, Lewis gone).

    15. Hurley ..........God have mercy on our souls. :(:(

    Jaysus, I have to say Leinster. :eek:

    No wonder we need to get another SH import i.e. Jean De Villiers


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    twinytwo wrote: »
    Im assuming u are basing this on one Hc semi final?

    I am basing this over watching these players over the season. Healy has been better than Horan this season no doubt. Ross was voted into the GP dream team and I see no reason why he couldn't hold more or less his own against Hayes whilst in the lineouts we have never seen DOC, POC completely dominate Cullen and MOK they always manage to more or less hold their own. This season in my eyes Jennings has been better than Wallace and you can't really argue that Heaslip is better than Leamy. To say Munster's pack is miles better is simply not true, better yes but not by miles. I think you also can't argue that Leinster's backline would destroy the likes of Murphy, Dowling and Hurley and be bit much of an inexperienced Jones. In many people's eyes Sexton is ahead of O'Gara and at scrum half Reddan is not far off TO'L. I think whilst Munsters pack would beat Leinster's (not by a huge amount though) the weakness of Munsters backline would be demolished by Leinster's


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    Munster
    I am basing this over watching these players over the season. Healy has been better than Horan this season no doubt. Ross was voted into the GP dream team and I see no reason why he couldn't hold more or less his own against Hayes whilst in the lineouts we have never seen DOC, POC completely dominate Cullen and MOK they always manage to more or less hold their own. This season in my eyes Jennings has been better than Wallace and you can't really argue that Heaslip is better than Leamy. To say Munster's pack is miles better is simply not true, better yes but not by miles. I think you also can't argue that Leinster's backline would destroy the likes of Murphy, Dowling and Hurley and be bit much of an inexperienced Jones. In many people's eyes Sexton is ahead of O'Gara and at scrum half Reddan is not far off TO'L.

    Minor point - Hayes and Ross are both THs so wouldn't be up against each other in the scrums.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 211 ✭✭MickTipp


    Ulster
    Munster without Mafi, Howlett, Warwick (I don't include Nick "WTF?" Williams in this list btw) would be a really weakened team.

    nick williams was very average last year, he looked unfit. maybe he was injured earlier in they year! im expecting great things from him this coming season


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,463 ✭✭✭twinytwo


    Ulster
    I am basing this over watching these players over the season. Healy has been better than Horan this season no doubt. Ross was voted into the GP dream team and I see no reason why he couldn't hold more or less his own against Hayes whilst in the lineouts we have never seen DOC, POC completely dominate Cullen and MOK they always manage to more or less hold their own. This season in my eyes Jennings has been better than Wallace and you can't really argue that Heaslip is better than Leamy. To say Munster's pack is miles better is simply not true, better yes but not by miles. I think you also can't argue that Leinster's backline would destroy the likes of Murphy, Dowling and Hurley and be bit much of an inexperienced Jones. In many people's eyes Sexton is ahead of O'Gara and at scrum half Reddan is not far off TO'L.

    Darcy and drico on top form would destroy that munster back line... did wallace not play alot of the season at 8?.. while yes Sexton played well in the Semi and final of the HC.. would he have played had phil not been injured?.. Im not deciding on him until iv seen him play against some quality SH backrow


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    MickTipp wrote: »
    nick williams was very average last year, he looked unfit. maybe he was injured earlier in they year! im expecting great things from him this coming season

    In fairness to him I believe he was coming off an injury.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 211 ✭✭MickTipp


    Ulster
    ya i was thinking that he was coming back from an injury alright


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,048 ✭✭✭Amazotheamazing


    Ulster
    Munster, majority of the pack and halfbacks which brought Ireland the Grand Slam. 9 players picked for the Lions, as well as the Lions captain, two HEC's and a league in the last few years.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Munster
    Would have to say Leinster over Munster but not much in it. The combined experience and strength of the Munster pack would shade it for them but Leinsters backline is defenitely better in terms of experience and overall ability. But looking at those selections there would be very little in it and would make for a really interesting game!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,706 ✭✭✭premierstone


    Ulster
    stephen_n wrote: »
    Would have to say Leinster over Munster but not much in it. The combined experience and strength of the Munster pack would shade it for them but Leinsters backline is defenitely better in terms of experience and overall ability. But looking at those selections there would be very little in it and would make for a really interesting game!

    Much the same as it is with the imports so ;) and I agree :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Munster
    Who voted Connacht? :p


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Munster
    Much the same as it is with the imports so ;) and I agree :D

    Yes but I do think Mafi and Warrick even up the backlines as they are both class players


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,249 ✭✭✭Stev_o


    Connacht
    Can we allow Morland to play for Munster for these matches just so they get absolutely nowhere when it comes to ruck time.:pac:



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Munster
    Stev_o wrote: »
    Can we allow Morland to play for Munster for these matches just so they get absolutely nowhere when it comes to ruck time.:pac:


    I think the words "Take It Back Now Y'All" got to his head. :pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭siltirocker


    Connacht team would be:

    Wilkinson (Irish citizen and qualified)
    Cronin
    Hagan
    Browne (On the CC A squad)
    Swift
    O'Connor
    Ofisa (Can declare for Ireland now)
    Muldoon
    Murphy
    Keatley
    Touhy
    Matthews
    Wynne
    Carr
    Duffy

    That team could beat the others (-imports), well maybe not Leinster but, ya know what i mean. Ulster looks good too, Munster backs look ****e though!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    So Non Nationals who are Irish Qualified are not Imports then?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    Connacht team would be:

    Wilkinson (Irish citizen and qualified)
    Cronin
    Hagan
    Browne (On the CC A squad)
    Swift
    O'Connor
    Ofisa (Can declare for Ireland now)
    Muldoon
    Murphy
    Keatley
    Touhy
    Matthews
    Wynne
    Carr
    Duffy

    That team could beat the others (-imports), well maybe not Leinster but, ya know what i mean. Ulster looks good too, Munster backs look ****e though!

    That team would certainly not beat all others. With Leinster you could easily have more or less the starting team for next year and other than 3 players the HC champion squad from last year!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭siltirocker


    That team would certainly not beat all others. With Leinster you could easily have more or less the starting team for next year and other than 3 players the HC champion squad from last year!

    i said could. Probably wouldn't though.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    i said could. Probably wouldn't though.

    yet you voted Connacht as the best team in the poll.. Odd.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭siltirocker


    yet you voted Connacht as the best team in the poll.. Odd.

    pretty sure i voted leinster.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    pretty sure i voted leinster.

    Nope you voted Connacht. Doesn't matter anyway I just thought it was an odd selection thats all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Munster
    I would have to say Leinster.

    For the simple reason of the emergence of Healy and signing of Ross we can field a good front row, and with O'Brien coming through also, it makes a very solid back-row...

    The the signing of Reddan is a big one, and emergence of Sexton to maturity last season is crucial.

    Outside of the half backs we've never struggled simualr to how Munster have never struggled in the pack.

    But when you think of it, Leinsters best 15 only contains 2 foreign players anyway:

    1. Healy
    2. Jackman
    3. Van Der Linde (Ross)
    4. Cullen
    5. Toner
    6. O'Brien
    7. Jennings
    8. Heaslip

    9. Reddan
    10. Sexton
    11. Fitzgerald
    12. D'Arcy
    13. O'Driscoll
    14. Nacewa (Horgan)
    15. Kearney

    2 very good replacements can come in for them also. Leinster lost some big foreign players last season (Rocky, Whitaker, Contepomi, Jowwit - although Irish qualified)...this really is the first season of the combined "new generation" in my book. And mostly Irish too, which is great!

    Looking at Munster again though, that backline isn't that bad...I really rate Murphy and obviously Earls also...Not a big fan of Dowling but a solid player, Jones is class...my only problem would be at 15 really.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭siltirocker


    Nope you voted Connacht. Doesn't matter anyway I just thought it was an odd selection thats all.

    Profile is shared, (they're will be words when they get home:mad:), it is an odd selection, i suppose Connacht look a lot better w/this on the grand scale, but Leinster still look just absolutely awesome!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,300 ✭✭✭2040


    Ulster
    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Looking at Munster again though, that backline isn't that bad...I really rate Murphy and obviously Earls also...Not a big fan of Dowling but a solid player, Jones is class...my only problem would be at 15 really.

    I was about to say this before you edited. :D Barry Murphy is definitely underrated. Ian Dowling though, while not the most glamorous of players, is rock solid. His denial of a Tiatia a try in the last Ospreys game was an example of this. And Earls, obviously has a real eye for the try line. Also, Ciaran O'Boyle on the wing looks like a real talent. Scored two tries in the two games he played. Injured now though i think.

    I must say though, the Leinster setup is looking really good, and is encouraging for Irish rugby. Hopefully JDV & Co. will tide us over until the Munster academy produces some more talent.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,900 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    Munster
    d'Oracle wrote: »
    So Non Nationals who are Irish Qualified are not Imports then?

    is felix jones not an import to Munster?:p


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Munster
    Riskymove wrote: »
    is felix jones not an import to Munster?:p

    Nah, ye exported him.

    On that subject, would ye accept an export of Denis Hurley? :p


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 943 ✭✭✭OldJay


    On that subject, would ye accept an export of Denis Hurley? :p
    Originally from Navan so he's in fact already an 'export' ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 277 ✭✭rockman15


    Munster
    really no contest here...leinster by several miles...throughout the squad they have an abundance of irish talent and that doesnt include the academy players who made up over 50% of this years underage WC irish team....so things look good for the future too


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Munster
    Riskymove wrote: »
    is felix jones not an import to Munster?:p

    Aren't Reddan, Fogarty & Ross exports from Munster? :p

    (I know we have Stephen Keogh & Trevor Hogan who are Munster lads too...but they'd never get within an asses roar of the Leinster team if all were fit)
    rockman15 wrote:
    that doesnt include the academy players who made up over 50% of this years underage WC irish team....so things look good for the future too

    I'll be really interested to see how this one turns out...presumably the A teams will be all academy / youth players in the up and coming A tournament, so while at the moment I agree with you, it'll be interesting to see how they compare in a competetive enviornment.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Size=everything


    Munster
    rockman15 wrote: »
    really no contest here...leinster by several miles...throughout the squad they have an abundance of irish talent and that doesnt include the academy players who made up over 50% of this years underage WC irish team....so things look good for the future too

    I believe 12 out of the 15 were Leinster so more than 50%!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,900 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    Munster
    Nah, ye exported him.

    On that subject, would ye accept an export of Denis Hurley? :p

    er...you seem to think I am a Leinster fan?


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Munster
    Riskymove wrote: »
    er...you seem to think I am a Leinster fan?

    Sorry, who do you support?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,900 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    Munster
    Sorry, who do you support?

    Munster


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,900 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    Munster
    Munster :

    1.Horan
    2.Flannery
    3.Hayes
    4.DOC
    5.POC
    6.Quinlan
    7.Wallace
    8.Leamy
    9.T'OL
    10.ROG
    11.Dowling
    12.Murphy
    13.Earls
    14.Felix Jones
    15.Hurley



    I'd play Jones at 15 and play one iof the young lads who came through the academy on the wing....O'boyle or someone like that


Advertisement