Penalty Points

amo_09

Hey.

Don't know if this is the right spot to post this

Anyway. I was stopped last week by a guard for speeding i was going about 10kph over. He pulled me over i pretended i did'nt know why i was stopped, he said i was driving like a mad woman that he could hardly keep up wit me which was lies my cars only a 1.5 , its modified so i reckon thats wat go me noticed, he said he was following me for ages again another lies as a always check my rear mirror every couple of secs. He even said he got a call in 2 clondalkin garda station about me. I was miles away from clondalkin.

I showed him my licence he took all my details, asked me had i any points (i don't) then he handed me my licence said there you go, he walked over to his car, i sat there expecting him to come back but he flew off.

Any1 know wat will happen there??? Fair enought if i get the fine its my own fault, but he did'nt mention anything. does that mean he let me off or should i be expecting a letter on the way out

Victor

Expect a letter. They rarely hand out tickets these days.

vixenbees

yeah they just take down your address and reg no. from your licence, thats all they need to send ya out a letter..80 yoyo's..happened me a month ago on the N3.

White_Feather

my bf got stopped tonight by the guards. I was in the car too. When the guard came up he said that my bf ran a red light (the light was green by the way). We disputed this with him and he said it was definitly red. Anyways, he said he will be getting a fixed penalty in the post. Does this mean its just the usual fine or did he mean penalty points? Im telling my bf to appeal it if it turns out to be penalty points, as it was 100% green light!:rolleyes:

vixenbees

you'll get a letter from the RSA about 2 weeks after the incident telling you if points have went on your licence..

holly1

So its the guards word against yours??How do you prove they are telling fibs..???

Victor

When you say there was a green light, was it a filter light that he wasn't allowed use?

holly1 wrote: »

So its the guards word against yours??How do you prove they are telling fibs..???

You go in front of a judge and convince him.

PCPhoto

Victor wrote: »

When you say there was a green light, was it a filter light that he wasn't allowed use?
You go in front of a judge and convince him.

isnt that guilty until proven innocent ???

if you simply explain your case and state the facts without claiming that the guard is lying - then the judge will have no choice but to strikeout the charge ..... as it would be a case of both sides telling different versions - the judge cant side with the garda since he/she is only human and may have made an error, similarly ...the judge cant side with the OP as he/she is only human and could also have made an error.

it will mean a wasted couple of hours in a courtroom - for OP and OH..... dont pay the fine and wait 6months for the summons and another couple of months for the court date.

Jo King

PCPhoto wrote: »

isnt that guilty until proven innocent ???

if you simply explain your case and state the facts without claiming that the guard is lying - then the judge will have no choice but to strikeout the charge ..... as it would be a case of both sides telling different versions - the judge cant side with the garda since he/she is only human and may have made an error, similarly ...the judge cant side with the OP as he/she is only human and could also have made an error.

Nonsense. If there are two versions of events the judge is entitled to decide which version to prefer. Happens every day. Most judges believe the garda, most of the time. If a person gives evidence they can be cross-examined. It is a matter for the judge to decide from the demeanour of the witness whether to believe the witness or not.

Our man in Havana

vixenbees wrote: »

you'll get a letter from the RSA about 2 weeks after the incident telling you if points have went on your licence..

Wrong, that letter only comes if you pay a FCPN.

Procedure is:

1. Stopped by Gardaí, details taken at scene.
2. FCPN arrives in post, alleging offence and gives option of paying or do nothing.
3. Accused pays up. RSA issue points letter. Case closed.
4. Accused does nothing, 56 days later a summons is issued. Accused pleads case in court.
5. Accused is found not guilty, cased closed. No points.
6. Accused is found guilty, fine and points. RSA points letter issues when fine is paid.

Until you receive that RSA letter you do not have points. Gardaí cannot give out points.

enry

IM in court every week and this is what happens.

Judge I did not get my points in the post. all I got was a summons in the post.

so you did not get the chance to pay your fine.

No Judge

Ok strick out the case..



As for as I can see nobody gets there points and fines in the post so when they go to court and explain that to the judge he has to throw the case out.

legal eagle 1

Just out of curiousity OP did the guard show you the speed gun showing how much you were going over the speed limit??

trad

What did the Garda use to measure your speed?

Did the Garda tell you what speed you were doing?

Did you get an oral warning that you eill be prosecuted for exceeding the speed limit?

From what you posted you may have recieved a "caution". In other words he knew you were speeding, you knew you were speeding but he / she lacked the necessary evidence to prosecute ie a speed detector.

Hooch

trad wrote: »

What did the Garda use to measure your speed?

Did the Garda tell you what speed you were doing?

Did you get an oral warning that you eill be prosecuted for exceeding the speed limit?

From what you posted you may have recieved a "caution". In other words he knew you were speeding, you knew you were speeding but he / she lacked the necessary evidence to prosecute ie a speed detector.

1. Dont have to tell someone how you detected them.

2. Doesnt have to tell you what speed you were doing.

3. Only time a Garda must issue an oral warning is if he/she intends to prosecute for dangerous driving....and this can be done up to six months after the offence.

Think the O/P will be receiving an FCPS im afraid

IT Loser

White_Feather wrote: »

my bf got stopped tonight by the guards. I was in the car too. When the guard came up he said that my bf ran a red light (the light was green by the way). We disputed this with him and he said it was definitly red. Anyways, he said he will be getting a fixed penalty in the post. Does this mean its just the usual fine or did he mean penalty points? Im telling my bf to appeal it if it turns out to be penalty points, as it was 100% green light!:rolleyes:

Hardly surprising. There is an entire wing of AGS now dedicated to the collection of taxes for His Royal Offalyness. They are called the Traffic Corps, and can be found frequenting some of the nations most dangerous stretches of tarmac, like the M11 and the Shankill Bypass, where 55 people have died in the last, I dont know, 23 years or something- mainly at 3 crossings which no longer even exist. You can see them on College Green around Christmas too, cos its such a deadly spot around Christmas, that Trinity College.

Cop is, as is usually the case, making things up to suit a quota. Definitely fight it.

IT Loser

nice guy always wrote: »

1. Dont have to tell someone how you detected them.

2. Doesnt have to tell you what speed you were doing.

3. Only time a Garda must issue an oral warning is if he/she intends to prosecute for dangerous driving....and this can be done up to six months after the offence.

Think the O/P will be receiving an FCPS im afraid

He can stand up in Court and tell them instead.

trad

Seems things change since my time. When I enfroced speed limits you had to have evidence that a motorist was exceeding the speed limit, ie their speed on radar speed meter or a calibrated speedometer, we always informed the motorist of the speed detected and gave them an oral warning under Section 47 of the RTA, 1961 but then again we had to give evidence under oath in Court.

If as niceguyalways says that the force has adopted such sloppy attitude to enforcement I'm afraid you probably get the fixed penalty notice.

In defence of the Traffic Corp they have a job to do and carry it out in a very professional manner. Road Traffic legislation is the one thing that affects ordinary "law abiding " citizens in our day to day lives. IF you obey traffic law you have nothing to fear. If you exceed speed limits, break red lights and generaly drive like a lunatick you will get what you deserve.

The fact that there are so many complaints about them surely shows that they are doing their job and while a lot of people mightn't like what they do, that's what they are paid to do. What's wrong with job satisfaction?

Victor

The law was changed a few years ago.

I imagine some of the reasons to not tell people they are getting a ticket is to avoid confrontations on the side of the road and to allow the garda's supervisors to review things before the ticket is put through the system.

trad

Victor wrote: »

The law was changed a few years ago. .

Any link? legislation? I like to keep up to date

amo_09

trad wrote: »

What did the Garda use to measure your speed?

Did the Garda tell you what speed you were doing?

Did you get an oral warning that you eill be prosecuted for exceeding the speed limit?

From what you posted you may have recieved a "caution". In other words he knew you were speeding, you knew you were speeding but he / she lacked the necessary evidence to prosecute ie a speed detector.

He did'nt use anything 2 measure it, he came outta no were said i was speeding and driving dangerous, i was a about 10kph over the limit at the most but was not driving dangerous

slimjimmc

If you were driving dangerously I would have expected he'd have told you where, when and in what way you were dangerous? something along the lines of 'you forced that white van to swerve out of the way back there'. Unless someone reported you instead.

trad

In order for a prosecution for dangerous driving the event must have been either witnessed by a Garda or have the complainant available in court on the date of prosecution.

In my experience people are very good at making allegations about other motorists but do not want to get involved in court cases, time off work, appearing in local papers etc. so you end up giving the "offender" a talking to but it is surprising how often you come across the same driver again, usually handing you a cast iron case on a plate.

It's a long road that has no turns.

Victor

trad wrote: »

Any link? legislation? I like to keep up to date

I think Road Traffic Act 2006, but it might have been the 2004 one.

trad

Victor wrote: »

I think Road Traffic Act 2006, but it might have been the 2004 one.

I've had a look at the 2002, 2004 and 2006 RTA's. Don't see anything to change my opinion that you need (1) to inform the punter that his is being prosecuted or (2) that you must disclose te evidence ie speed to the punter.

As I say, my opinion, but if anyone out there knows better and can quote specific legislation please let me (us) know.

Hooch

trad wrote: »

As I say, my opinion, but if anyone out there knows better and can quote specific legislation please let me (us) know.

Linky....legistation?????

Just so we can work backwards to find it for you;)

trad

nice guy always wrote: »

Linky....legistation?????

Just so we can work backwards to find it for you;)

I am sure there are other knowledgeable serving members who might have an insight. It's easy to slag , harder to quote exact legislation