Where is the heat going!!

Gun_Slinger

Hi All,

I am living in a 3 year old house (from new) and it is constantly cold. During the winter if we had the heat on for 3 hours it would be cold again an hour later.

The house has a 10 year home bond and I have added another layer of insulation to the attic. The cavity is also insulated. In our estate the neighbours have the same problem.

Any ideas where we could be losing the heat? We kind of left it on the long finger up to now but with a new arrival in the house we need to tackle the problem before the Autumn/Winter (or Summer ).

sinnerboy

Have an air tightness test done . Cost around €700.00 . Suspect is air leaks .

MacTheKnife1

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Any ideas where we could be losing the heat?

Are there many windows on the north face of the house?

Air tightness hould cost less than 700 I think. Depends where you are though I suppose.

sinnerboy

MacTheKnife1 wrote: »

Air tightness hould cost less than 700 I think. Depends where you are though I suppose.

Fair point - shop around .

Do you have an open fireplace in the house that you don't use, this can be a cause of heat loss.

Poor Uncle Tom

Point of interest:
What is the construction method of the houses on the estate?

archtech

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Point of interest:
What is the construction method of the houses on the estate?

Good question tom, was about to ask it myself, as there could lie the problem.

muffler

Yip. I think it may well be the construction method but we will have to wait and see.

Gun_Slinger

Thanks for the replies folks.

Answers to your questions:

1 north facing window only at the back of the house.

I have no idea what construction method was used to build them. The house is a bungalow with normal cavity walls, red brick to the front and pebble dash all over.

I got a quote today for Air Pressure testing of the house for 250 euro. That must be different to the 700 one mentioned above?

trad

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

.

I got a quote today for Air Pressure testing of the house for 250 euro. That must be different to the 700 one mentioned above?

About €450 different I'd say

muffler

Any idea what type of insulation is in the cavity or is supposed to be in there?

Gun_Slinger

When I put in my extractor fan there was just the white styrofoam in the cavity. cant remember the thickness.

Also, we have an open chimney. Stuffed for the summer months and fires all winter.

MicktheMan

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Hi All,

I am living in a 3 year old house (from new) and it is constantly cold. During the winter if we had the heat on for 3 hours it would be cold again an hour later.

The house has a 10 year home bond and I have added another layer of insulation to the attic. The cavity is also insulated. In our estate the neighbours have the same problem.

Any ideas where we could be losing the heat? We kind of left it on the long finger up to now but with a new arrival in the house we need to tackle the problem before the Autumn/Winter (or Summer ).

Heatloss in a house is a two sided coin, one being conduction loss through walls, roofs windows etc, the other being air tightness (or lack of).
Even if the (cavity) walls are insulated, if this insulation was not installed properly its effect will be severly compromised. Simerly with roof insulation.
Air tightness issues may be caused by the internal finish of the external walls - are they drylined? If drylined then more than likely the blockwork is not sealed and therefore not airtight. Do you have many (any) recessed light fittings? They are another major source of air infiltration.
I have just hit on a couple of areas of heatloss and tbh, there could be many more. Get the advise of a good heat loss surveyor (who has the equipment and experience to determine exactly what is happening in the house) and have hime do a full survey. Btw, you mention that your house may not be the only one in the estate with similiar problems. Would it be an idea to get a group of householders together to defray the costs if the belief is the issues are similiar?

sinnerboy

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

I got a quote today for Air Pressure testing of the house for 250 euro. That must be different to the 700 one mentioned above?

Not necessarily . Times are tough , business is slack . It is not so much the test result you are after ( useful all the same ) - it is the live smoke "candle" testing that will highlight area where leaks are occurring

Suspects are

- base of skirtings
- around windows - i.e. behind plasterboard where window is connected to wall
- pipes and cables entering through the wall . Kitchens + bathrooms
- recessed lighting fittings

Air leaks are "sensible" . I mean a sheet of calculations expressing in Kw/hr/annum does not express the actual heat loss that your body can feel .

Check in particular before you do anything else - how is the base of your front door in terms of drafts . Loads of icy air can fly in here . That alone can have a hugely disportionate affect on how the house feels .

Gun_Slinger

Hey, thanks for all the info guys. I think I will go ahead with the Air Pressure test and see what it turns up. I cant go through a freezing winter again with a baby in the house. At this rate I would have the boiler going 24/7!

Whatever I have to spend will hopefully be worth it in the end. I will update the thread with the results from the test.

MacTheKnife1

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

I got a quote today for Air Pressure testing of the house for 250 euro. That must be different to the 700 one mentioned above?

No - that is more like the price I was thinking of. I paid 350 a few months ago and prices have dropped.

MacTheKnife1

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Whatever I have to spend will hopefully be worth it in the end.

I lived in a cold house a few years back. We replaced the open fire with a small stove and the difference was amazing. Also we doubled the attic insulation and that worked great too.

Gun_Slinger

Ok, got the air pressure test done and the guy reckons we have one of the most air tight houses he has ever seen! Even did the test twice to make sure his readings were correct. He did mention that there were some leaks around the ESB box outside and the kitchen lights but that was it. No problems with skirting boards, window sills, doors etc.

Now I am baffled. Does this mean the problem is specific to insulation? I have already doubled the insulation in the attic. He did say he could do a thermal test where we would leave the heat on for a few hours and then check where the heat loss was occurring. Would this be worth it as it would be another 200 without sorting out the problem at all.

sydthebeat

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Ok, got the air pressure test done and the guy reckons we have one of the most air tight houses he has ever seen! Even did the test twice to make sure his readings were correct. He did mention that there were some leaks around the ESB box outside and the kitchen lights but that was it. No problems with skirting boards, window sills, doors etc.

Now I am baffled. Does this mean the problem is specific to insulation? I have already doubled the insulation in the attic. He did say he could do a thermal test where we would leave the heat on for a few hours and then check where the heat loss was occurring. Would this be worth it as it would be another 200 without sorting out the problem at all.

yes, certainly worth €200

it will identify where exactly the house is loosing heat....

Chimpster

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Ok, got the air pressure test done and the guy reckons we have one of the most air tight houses he has ever seen! Even did the test twice to make sure his readings were correct. He did mention that there were some leaks around the ESB box outside and the kitchen lights but that was it. No problems with skirting boards, window sills, doors etc.

Now I am baffled. Does this mean the problem is specific to insulation? I have already doubled the insulation in the attic. He did say he could do a thermal test where we would leave the heat on for a few hours and then check where the heat loss was occurring. Would this be worth it as it would be another 200 without sorting out the problem at all.

Well if the results of the AT test were good then you know your uncontolled ventilation heat losses are not where the problem exists.

Next logical step would be the thermal survey but...

Its not a great time of year for doing it at present. For proper results a temp diff between inside and outside of 10 degrees would be needed. This can be hard to achieve in summer.

Your getting good value. Rates in Galway are 400 -600 (Plus VAT) depending on house size for an AT test.

muffler

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Ok, got the air pressure test done and the guy reckons we have one of the most air tight houses he has ever seen! Even did the test twice to make sure his readings were correct. He did mention that there were some leaks around the ESB box outside and the kitchen lights but that was it. No problems with skirting boards, window sills, doors etc.

Now I am baffled. Does this mean the problem is specific to insulation? I have already doubled the insulation in the attic. He did say he could do a thermal test where we would leave the heat on for a few hours and then check where the heat loss was occurring. Would this be worth it as it would be another 200 without sorting out the problem at all.

Well you have eliminated air movement as being the problem so its down to insulation really. When you have gone this far another €200 wont break the bank but i suspect that the results will show roof and walls being your problem.

What type and depth of insulation do you have in the attic? 3 year old houses should have at least 200mm fibreglass for example.

You can also get your cavities pumped with something like EcoBead platinum which can be used in conjunction with existing aeroboard insulation.

There are grants available for this work but its for pre 2006 houses so unless you could prove that the house was occupied prior to that you wouldnt get a grant. Check here to be sure. In any event Id be surprised if the wall and attic insulation would run you any more than €1500. You would save it in fuel bills within 3 or 4 years.

Gun_Slinger

Thanks again folks, I think I will go the extra bit and get this done. Sounds right to do this when the temp is cool outside as this is when the most heat is lost.

sas

Gun_Slinger wrote: »

Ok, got the air pressure test done and the guy reckons we have one of the most air tight houses he has ever seen! Even did the test twice to make sure his readings were correct.

Out of interest, can you tell us what result you got?

Gun_Slinger

sas wrote: »

Out of interest, can you tell us what result you got?

1.5. He mentioned 7 was a pass.

2sounds

Have to say weve got the same problem, cavity wall const , house about 8 yrs old. House heats quickly enough but cold again within an hour. Id say theres a lot of houses out there with similar issues. Ive noticed before a seriuos draughts under the skirts in my gaff. Ill be interested to see what the diagnosis is ...