Missionary work and tax

Tim Robbins

Hi,
I was wondering if you do missionary work in another country for an organisation and are being paid for it by a NGO or a Christian organisation are you usually subject to paying tax in the country where you are doing the missionary work?

Now, before anyone says the obvious, depends on the country, I wonder does anyone have any information about any specific country.

Cheers.
Tim Robbins.

PDN

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Hi,
I was wondering if you do missionary work in another country for an organisation and are being paid for it by a NGO or a Christian organisation are you usually subject to paying tax in the country where you are doing the missionary work?

Now, before anyone says the obvious, depends on the country, I wonder does anyone have any information about any specific country.

Cheers.
Tim Robbins.

I've never been paid myself for doing missionary work, but I do know a number of full time missionaries, both those working overseas and those from other countries working here in Ireland. It's exactly the same as if you were working on a contract overseas for any other employer. Each country has its own definition for what makes you liable for tax in a particular country (usually based on how many days in a year you are resident etc. and whether you receive your money in your home nation or on the mission field) and most countries have mutually agreed regulations covering migrant workers.

So, take a US citizen working as a missionary in Africa. If they meet the African nation's criteria then they have to pay tax there. If not, then they have to pay tax at home in the US.

prinz

Why don't you ring Goal and ask then where Sharon Commins pays her taxes? Really, is this what keeps you awake at night? Are we back to the business of Christianity thing again...... where's the transparency, blah, blah. As PDN pointed out it all depends on where you're (a) domiciled (b) ordinarily resident (c) type of work being done (c) how you're being paid (d) where you receive that payment (e) yadda yadda..... talk to a tax specialist Tim.

Tim Robbins

PDN wrote: »

So, take a US citizen working as a missionary in Africa. If they meet the African nation's criteria then they have to pay tax there. If not, then they have to pay tax at home in the US.

I gathered that.

However, I heard anecdotally from someone working with missionaries that that person paid no tax simply because they didn't have to because they were a missionary.

I was wondering was there some clever tax avoidance going on.

For example, the NGO / Missionary organisation register as a UK charity or non profit company. Paid monies to people through it's UK books even though these people worked in another country.

if you work for a Church / Religion here, are you subject to normal tax laws?

Do you have to pay tax PDN?

Excuse my ignorance.

Tim Robbins

prinz wrote: »

Why don't you ring Goal and ask then where Sharon Commins pays her taxes? Really, is this what keeps you awake at night? Are we back to the business of Christianity thing again...... where's the transparency, blah, blah. As PDN pointed out it all depends on where you're (a) domiciled (b) ordinarily resident (c) type of work being done (c) how you're being paid (d) where you receive that payment (e) yadda yadda..... talk to a tax specialist Tim.

Would you relax, these are perfectly valid questions.

PDN

Tim Robbins wrote: »

I gathered that.

However, I heard anecdotally from someone working with missionaries that that person paid no tax simply because they didn't have to because they were a missionary.

No. If they receive money in the UK based on their missionary work overseas then it might well be that they are taxed in the UK - but if they were paying no tax anywhere then that would be illegal.

if you work for a Church / Religion here, are you subject to normal tax laws?

Absolutely. A religious worker may be an employee (PAYE) or self-employed, but they pay tax just like a plumber or anyone else. There are no free passes or exceptions.

Do you have to pay tax PDN?

Indeed I do. I have to declare all my income (whether I receive it here, in the UK, or in the US) and pay tax at Irish rates.

prinz

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Would you relax, these are perfectly valid questions.

Valid in the sense that your questions about MAD2009 were valid? That's not idle interest, all you want to do is get something juicy or controversial, and if very lucky a stick to beat someone with. Noone could possibly tell you what arrangements any person for any organisation in any country in the world has for taxation, except themselves tbh.

About as subtle as a boar hunting truffles.

Tim Robbins

PDN wrote: »

No. If they receive money in the UK based on their missionary work overseas then it might well be that they are taxed in the UK - but if they were paying no tax anywhere then that would be illegal.

Yes there some subtle caveats here.
I think if I am employed by an Irish organisation and go to another European country, I pay Irish tax for the first 90 days and then after that I have to pay tax for the country I am living in.

I wonder what way it works for the countries missionaries usually go to (i.e. mainly african countries).

Indeed I do. I have to declare all my income (whether I receive it here, in the UK, or in the US) and pay tax at Irish rates.

Thanks PDN, and once again excuse my ignorance.

I presume it's the same for RC Priests - i.e. they pay income tax?

All interesting.

prinz

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/who-pays.html

knock yourself out.

http://www.usig.org/countryinfo/ireland.asp

http://www.usig.org/countryinfo/PDF/Ireland.pdf

Tim Robbins

prinz wrote: »

Valid in the sense that your questions about MAD2009 were valid? That's not idle interest, all you want to do is get something juicy or controversial, and if very lucky a stick to beat someone with. Noone could possibly tell you what arrangements any person for any organisation in any country in the world has for taxation, except themselves tbh.

About as subtle as a boar hunting truffles.

I oriiginally put the question to encompass all charities in humanities forums.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055609805

and having no-one replying to me I went to volunteers forum

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=61017307#post61017307

and having noone reply to me came here.

Christianity has been a refuge to me, this time :-)

prinz

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Christianity has been a refuge to me, this time :-)

It could be every time if you just let it :pac:

prinz

Here you go Tim, looks like they're paying tax to me

http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2004/02/08/story38844661.asp

Looks like mostly under the radar for income taxes anyway tbh

Tim Robbins

prinz wrote: »

Here you go Tim, looks like they're paying tax to me

http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2004/02/08/story38844661.asp

Looks like mostly under the radar for income taxes anyway tbh

It's effectively minimum wage and out of the tax net as you say.
Although interesting, it's not much less than most people when you subtract morgage payments.

I wonder are the RCC paying corperate tax. Or what they do if they collect more money than they need to pay their staff.

prinz

Tim Robbins wrote: »

It's effectively minimum wage and out of the tax net as you say.
Although interesting, it's not much less than most people when you subtract morgage payments.

Also on 24 hr call. I think they provide a pretty good social service for that kind of money.

Tim Robbins wrote: »

I wonder are the RCC paying corperate tax. Or what they do if they collect more money than they need to pay their staff.

Seminaries, schools, charities, donations, services, repairs, refurbishments, insurance etc etc etc so many costs. You may find Vatican operated at a deficit last couple of years.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8135753.stm