Time for Kinane to Retire

Kauto

This should have happened a few years ago IMO. Everybody singing his praises because he won a derby on a horse who could be the best we have seen in 10-15 years. His ride on Alandi in the curragh cup was shocking. I backed the winner thank god but if Fran Berry or any other decent jockey was on board he would have won easily. The errors have been coming to regularly in the last 3 to 4 years and one superstar horse shouldnt be enough to save him!

k_d

totally agree,i was on him unfortunatly

Fran berry in my opinion is one of the best and will give and good horse a decent ride, iv backed him 4 times in the last 6 days, and 3 winners, at sligo delia in the 1st race, 10/1.. on jessica harringtons fille the other night, 1st time out 25/1 winner and on headford view, a good 8/1 winner..

i think people look past him and his abilities a bit to much..always looking towards what murtagh or others are on

fr wishy washy

Kauto wrote: »

This should have happened a few years ago IMO. Everybody singing his praises because he won a derby on a horse who could be the best we have seen in 10-15 years. His ride on Alandi in the curragh cup was shocking. I backed the winner thank god but if Fran Berry or any other decent jockey was on board he would have won easily. The errors have been coming to regularly in the last 3 to 4 years and one superstar horse shouldnt be enough to save him!

In fairness the gap closed on him just at the wrong time and it wasn't his fault,afaik Murtagh got a 1 day ban for allowing his horse cross Alandi.

What did he do wrong iyo?




PS,I'd still take him on a horse ahead of Berry.

starchild

id have to disagree, i think kinane is still a great jockey, i think the proof of that is more than evident in that john oxx who is renowned as one of the top trainers in the game still retains him

biomech

starchild wrote: »

id have to disagree, i think kinane is still a great jockey, i think the proof of that is more than evident in that john oxx who is renowned as one of the top trainers in the game still retains him

+1 dont see anyone on here paying his wage.... ill take mr oxx's side on this one... ya cant beat a bit of experience

Cantoris

Nothing wrong with his ride of Alandi, he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. You must remember, he works for a man who takes care of his horses too so Kinane can often be riding to his bosses instructions. When the chips are down, there is no one better and if I wanted a flat jock, I'd have him any day. You can pick holes in all jocks. Fran Berry can be very weak when compared to the likes of McDonagh but he's got a pretty good head and rides some of the tighter tracks pretty well.

applehunter

Kinane has made his money.

Move over and let some of the young guys make a few quid.

He has experience but he is also pushing on and is not the force he was.

Famous45

Has everyone forgot Murtagh's ride on Masterofthehorse at Chester? Was diabolical, and yet he produces a masterpiece of a ride on board Yeats to win the Gold Cup. Hasn't been the only mistake he's made over the last couple of years either. I don't think Mick was at fault and he has definitely not lost the appetite for the game, nor the lack of ability. Furthermore from being a total gentleman he is still a top class rider in my opinion. Kinane has a great relationship with horses as does as top class jockey and just because Sea the Stars dotted up in the Derby doesn't mean that Fran Berry or ourselves would have done similar. He rode the perfect race and in turn saved everything for the horse for when the exact moment was right, now you try and argue with me that's not top draw horsemanship?

It won't be up to any of you to suggest when it's time for Kinane to retire (he is one of the greatest jockeys you'll ever see) in my opinion you have very little deep knowledge of the sport if you think you have the right for an opinion on whether Kinane should retire, the only person with that right is the man himself, believe me Kinane would love to retire and spend his days walking around Punchestown and golfing on Ireland's finest courses but he knows and still proves that he can mix it with the best riders of today.

Whyno

There is more to a jockey than just riding one race. Sure he had the horse in wrong place at wrong time but that doesnt happen to often with Kinane. He is still one of the most tactical astute Jockeys in the world and for one sure thing a tight arse trainer like John Oxx certainly wouldnt keep him if he wasnt up to scratch. FACT
However i did hear than Kinane is actually hanging up his boots at the end of this season anyway.

As for other jockeys like Fran Berry, the man shakes his fist for winning low grades hadicaps in listowel. Whats that about!! I`d take kinane over that numpty anyday and as for strenght in a finish well kinane would beat berry everytime.

makker

I agree with OP, the guy is beyond his sell by date.

The ride that springs to mind for me was Rock of Gibraltrar in the breeder cup mile probably around 7 years ago.
Remember the DRF in the states referred to him as Pinhead on the back of that race and I pretty much agree with that.

Plenty of other bigs races stand out where he should have done better

Giants causeway in BC classic
Azamour in Tattersalls gold cup
George Washington in Celebration mile

Whyno

makker wrote: »

George Washington in Celebration mile

You obiously know fcuk all if you reckon he was at fault in the race. Lots of fools talkin outta there holes in or should i say letting their pockets do the talking.

premierstone

If four rides is all you can find fault with for a guy whos been at the top of he's game and riding Group Winners since 1982 in 13 differnet countries Id say he's alright :rolleyes:

biomech

Whyno wrote: »

You obiously know fcuk all if you reckon he was at fault in the race. Lots of fools talkin outta there holes in or should i say letting their pockets do the talking.

just to clear that one up... these guys are def talking through their holes. kinane is in one of the top yards in europe and has no prob holding his job... hed be gone at a minutes notice if mr oxx wasnt happy with any ride he gave a horse.

Whyno

biomech wrote: »

just to clear that one up... these guys are def talking through their holes. kinane is in one of the top yards in europe and has no prob holding his job... hed be gone at a minutes notice if mr oxx wasnt happy with any ride he gave a horse.

.

makker

Imagine in the Oaks a few years back, he made some pigs ear of that ride

I've only highlighted some of his shockers in big Group races, what about day to day meets at lesser tracks that go unseen to most.

Don't get me wrong, he was a top jockey in his day but in the last few years his riding has deteriorated.

I think when Coolmore got rid of him they could see that his riding was not up to scratch anymore, afterall they are the shrewdist operators in the game.

makker

makker wrote: »

Imagine in the Oaks a few years back, he made some pigs ear of that ride

I've only highlighted some of his shockers in big Group races, what about day to day meets at lesser tracks that go unseen to most.

Don't get me wrong, he was a top jockey in his day but in the last few years his riding has deteriorated.

I think when Coolmore got rid of him they could see that his riding was not up to scratch anymore, afterall they are the shrewdist operators in the game.

apologies meant reference to Yesterday and not Imagine

rubayat

kinane in my opinion is the most complete flat jockey ever and is riding better the older and more experienced he gets!

I dont think anyone who is criticising him has ever ridden a horse let alone ridden in a race.

The best jockey ever and when he retires it will be a great loss to the weigh room and horse racing in general

Nulty

yeah he'd better give someone else a go on STS, maybe a maiden apprentice jockey...my nephew is six, he should get a go on STS. Probably win the Champion stakes.

Seriously though, time for people to take things in hand and realise that, like some have said before, Oxx will decide if Kinane is ready to step down from his stable and he himself will know when to quit altogether. If you ask me he's like Alex Ferguson, he should quit when its impossible for him to continue.

DEEP THROAT

makker wrote: »

I think when Coolmore got rid of him they could see that his riding was not up to scratch anymore, afterall they are the shrewdist operators in the game.

Was nothing to do with his riding ability, clash of personalities with Tabor which came close to a physical clash on the gallops..... he was gone a week later

Whyno

Eh....What a brutal ride Kinane gave Sea the Stars yesterday....I mean to get the horse in so much trouble, trapped in in a pocket and bearly get up ta win..:mad:


Oh wait that was one i dreamt up after reading the ops post. Great ride by a great jockey...End of story

makker

Whyno wrote: »

Eh....What a brutal ride Kinane gave Sea the Stars yesterday....I mean to get the horse in so much trouble, trapped in in a pocket and bearly get up ta win..:mad:


Oh wait that was one i dreamt up after reading the ops post. Great ride by a great jockey...End of story

Think you're wrong, kinane by his own admission said he went too early so you can hardly say it was a great ride for that reason alone. You must be wearing blinkers if you thought that was a great ride.

Also he was on the best horse in the race by heads and shoulders and was odds on to win so no real surprise, hardly had to pull all the stops to win that won.

Keep on dreaming!

boccy23

Would not agree about it being a bad ride by Kinane.
The horse got him into a position where he had to push on. He idled in front and one crack of the whip from Kinane set him about his work again.
The horse is a machine in all details and he won comfortably. I never had a sense he would be beaten and he was carrying an amount of my hard earned green backs!
Kinane is still a great jock and I for one would not have him changed. I ma more than happy for my money to be on him.

Whyno

makker wrote: »

Think you're wrong, kinane by his own admission said he went too early so you can hardly say it was a great ride for that reason alone. You must be wearing blinkers if you thought that was a great ride.

Also he was on the best horse in the race by heads and shoulders and was odds on to win so no real surprise, hardly had to pull all the stops to win that won.

Keep on dreaming!

Firstly whether he went to early or not was not his option, STS pulled him into the lead and wanted to race. Kinane didnt panic when the pacemakers tore off. Reined the horse back afte a terrific start to sit in mid field. When the pacemakers began to wilt Kinane was putting STS in the pefect position and not letting him get into any trouble and also at this time knowing RVW was in his slip stream wit fortune gettin ready to press the button. When he said go he took the lead and never relinquished it as RVW tried in vain to catch in and also drifting away from the whip on the both occasions fortune hit him. IMO Fortune should have went inside STS and he may well have caused an upset. Kinane however had all this covered as he had STS in the perfect position.

On the day STS was the best horse in the race and truly is a superstar 3 year old.

Also AoB was delighted wit RVW performance and i`m sure they are licking their lips to a rematch with STS in the irish champion stakes and with murtagh up its all to play for again.

Kinane won the race and it was a great ride. Credit given where credit is due and you sir would want to suck up whatever issues you have wit mr.kinane and call a spade a spade. Trust me ive had plenty of gripes over some of his rides throughout the years as i do wit most jockeys but there is no denying the mans talent is still in tact and for 1 sure thing a tight asre fecker like john oxx and also the aga khan wouldnt have him on their horses if he wasnt up to the job. End of story

aidan24326

biomech wrote: »

just to clear that one up... these guys are def talking through their holes. kinane is in one of the top yards in europe and has no prob holding his job... hed be gone at a minutes notice if mr oxx wasnt happy with any ride he gave a horse.

Quite true. Now Kinane has never been my personal favourite as a jockey, but there's simply no denying what he has achieved in racing down through the years. Not only has he got the Oxx job but Michael Stoute also regularly puts him on some of his horses at the big meetings in England, as do some of the other top English trainers whenever he's available. Now if John Oxx and MIchael Stoute (two of Europe's top trainers) think he's good enough then the rest of us should probably shut up.

BY the way, I've spoken with 3 professional flat jockeys in my lifetime, 2 of them pretty successful. I asked all of them who they thought was the best flat jockey in the business and they all said Mick Kinane.

Now Kinane wouldn't be my choice as I think Fallon and Murtagh are better, but there you go, that was the choice of lads who know more about racing than we do. I suppose Kinane has been consistently banging in the winners for such a long time.

makker wrote: »

I've only highlighted some of his shockers in big Group races, what about day to day meets at lesser tracks that go unseen to most.

Don't get me wrong, he was a top jockey in his day but in the last few years his riding has deteriorated.

Every jockey makes mistakes, just when it's KInane or Spencer or Murtagh or someone high profile it gets highlighted more. In a long career at the top I'd say Kinane's rate of mistakes or cock-ups would compare favourably with most. Maybe his riding isn't as good as it was, he's in the twilight of his career now. He's ridden over 100 Group 1 winners in Ireland and England alone, and many more in France, Germany, USA, Japan etc

Dan Chipowski

Mick is a legend of the sport alright, but I agree one or two errors have been creeping in. Only natural though, and he's more than entitled to. The margin between a good ride and a bad ride is getting smaller all the time with the glare of the media on pretty much every race these days.

Frankie Lee

This time last year I may have agreed with the OP, but this year he has been back on form and I'm not just saying that because of STS.

I know for a fact that he put serious effort into keeping fit over the winter and its looking like paying off this season.

Dylan Thomas

Mick is still and while he continues to ride a great jockey.There have been very few like him to get the feel of a horse while riding it well maybe Kieran Fallon the only exception.If mick felt he wasn't at his best he would hang up his boots.To say that this jockey is past it because of StS ride in the Juddmonte is not fair the horse if you can say fell ''asleep'' and took a few strides to get going.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Whyno

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Your on the ball Ziggy aint ya

matthews08

It's hard to believe that anybody is calling for Kinane to retire. He's still riding winners at the highest level for a top stable. His record speaks for itself.

biomech

sorry to dig this one up again but i noticed i havnt heard anyone calling for mick to retire in a while?????? i wonder why????????:D:D

Kauto

He should retire! He nearly got the horse beat. Got him into every bit of trouble going but th ehorse was still good enough to win. Must be the greatest horse ever. Pity he has a jockey who is so far past it. Reckon i would have won on hi putting up 3 stone over weight. Any jockey in that field would have won on him. Hell even Richard Bloody Hills would have won on him!

finbarrk

Well wasn't he lucky he didn't retire when you were ranting about him. I bet you never even sat on a horse.

biomech

what are you on about... he didnt get him into trouble.. he jumped him off under a tight hold and the horse landed 2nd??? obviously the rest of the field jumped off slower.. nothing he could do about it... and i can from and experienced point of view say that very few jockeys would have steered that horse through the gaps that mick brought him.. excellent display of riding... very calm when left out of position early on. :mad:

Kauto

Finbarrk id say i have ridden more fillies than you!!!:D

matthews08

I don't know how anybody can be calling on Kinane to retire after the career he's had, let alone what he's done this season. If he wasn't good enough John Oxx would have him nowhere near Sea The Stars. He won the race, what else do people want from him? Some of the comments he's made this year suggest that he might be thinking about going anyway,I for one think racing will be worse off without him.

fr wishy washy

With the likely retiring of Ses The Stars I'd say Mick will take his leave as well,he would be in top 3 of all time whilst he was in his prime and will be a legend in racing history.

matthews08

I think Kinane has a few big races left in him yet, even at 51 as he'll be next season, but if he decides to call it a day fair play to him. At least he'll have went out on top and from some of the things he's said and from watching the BBC interview with John Oxx Sea The Stars means a lot to everybody connected to him, so it might be fitting for them both to retire at the same time.

bit of a bogey

I'd be surprised if Kinane does decide to retire. Even though I think he shud retire now while at the top, I dont think he will. Micky Joe is a hungry hungry man! I can see him staying on riding in the classics. He's still a gifted rider, stilll good hands, good head and dead cool. But he definitely aint as strong as he used to be!

Pj!

Such a talent.

Will always be known as one of the greats.