Our Minister ?

marlin vs

Has anyone heard our Minister speak out on the state of the job situtation in our City / (County)

rasper

Sure what does that waster care about, I see the number of unemployment in the city has hit 13,000 out of a population of say under 50k , thats a savage percentage , someone needs to act otherwise we'll continue on this downward spiral with no chance of recovery

daftdave

rasper wrote: »

Sure what does that waster care about, I see the number of unemployment in the city has hit 13,000 out of a population of say under 50k , thats a savage percentage , someone needs to act otherwise we'll continue on this downward spiral with no chance of recovery

thats an awful thing to say....im sure if the man could give you or others a job ...he would.

its called an economic downturn where people happen to become unemployed ......

Sully

daftdave wrote: »

thats an awful thing to say....im sure if the man could give you or others a job ...he would.

its called an economic downturn where people happen to become unemployed ......

I think a lot of people felt the government never reacted properly to the situation, after getting us into this mess. From what I gathered, most people were very annoyed at the poor response from him in regards to the Crystals closure.

Not sure he is all that bad though, didn't he give the RFC a lot of money for example?

daftdave

people might think the country is fooked.....but ireland is not the only country going through hardship..... there is only so much the government can do to try stem the tide ..... its like the 80's .... people are gonna just have to ride it out.... as difficult as it is....its the only way.

Sully

daftdave wrote: »

people might think the country is fooked.....but ireland is not the only country going through hardship..... there is only so much the government can do to try stem the tide ..... its like the 80's .... people are gonna just have to ride it out.... as difficult as it is....its the only way.

Assuming now that your a FF supporter, as thats the usual party line

Most reports have concluded we are a lot worse then other countrys. Our government is partly to blame because of the mess we are in. Sure, there is a bigger problem but a lot of what we deal with here (again) is because of our government. Even trying to fix the problems, there not exactly doing a sterling job.

Anyway, this discussion is more geared towards the Politics forum. Locally, we probably have escpaed a lot of injury in terms of job cuts but to loose Waterford Crystal with little support from the government was probably a big insult to the people who voted that way.

wellbutty

Sully wrote: »

but to loose Waterford Crystal with little support from the government was probably a big insult to the people who voted that way.

I think a lot of good things came our way during his reign (bypass, airport, WIT funding) but the Waterford Crystal situation has been a disaster for him.

Interestingly Ireland is still the 2nd richest country in the EU!:
http://www.rte.ie/business/2009/0625/eu.html

Sully

wellbutty wrote: »

I think a lot of good things came our way during his reign (bypass, airport, WIT funding) but the Waterford Crystal situation has been a disaster for him.

Agreed. I think without a minister, Waterford would have been doomed long ago. Strong chance we wont have him for much longer and I cant see Desey getting a spot in the FG bench.

Interestingly Ireland is still the 2nd richest country in the EU!:
http://www.rte.ie/business/2009/0625/eu.html

Ya I thought that was amusing alright!

mad man

Sully wrote: »

Assuming now that your a FF supporter, as thats the usual party line

Most reports have concluded we are a lot worse then other countrys. Our government is partly to blame because of the mess we are in. Sure, there is a bigger problem but a lot of what we deal with here (again) is because of our government. Even trying to fix the problems, there not exactly doing a sterling job.

Anyway, this discussion is more geared towards the Politics forum. Locally, we probably have escpaed a lot of injury in terms of job cuts but to loose Waterford Crystal with little support from the government was probably a big insult to the people who voted that way.

Do you not think its a bit unfair to call him a FF supporter Sully. The facts are we not a lot worse than most other countrys.The situation with our banks is exactly like most other countrys in particular the UK and the States.You need to get some more facts and not what is reported in the papers and the news which tend to be mere heaqdlines. Do you not think its noteworthy that FG has not been given an endorsement by two of their most able former leaders i.e Garrett and Dukes.Fitzgerald specifically stated FG would not be able to do any better that what FF are doing now.People like also seem to forget the 2007 election and the farcical campaign that FG and Labour ran.They snatched defeat from the Jaws of Vicyory.

FG are doing well in the polls because of anger and not because of ability.If you actually read some of their policies and looked at them objectively you will might actually see that that they are unworkable.The electorate needs to cop on to this or otherwise we will get a stark and unwanted reminder of why we rejected them for the last 30 years.

Sully

mad man wrote: »

Do you not think its a bit unfair to call him a FF supporter Sully.

No. Because FF are in denial pretty much and they always use the same line each time this arrises. You can always tell a FF supporter, their in denial and blame everyone but themselves.

The facts are we not a lot worse than most other countrys.The situation with our banks is exactly like most other countrys in particular the UK and the States.You need to get some more facts and not what is reported in the papers and the news which tend to be mere heaqdlines.

Are we not? You might want to ask your minister for Finance to check his own facts then, as he reported differently. Source

Oh and not forgetting the IMF, I do believe they agreed. Source #1 | Source #2

I think that should cover my point that we are a lot worse then other country's (not all of course, I haven't forgotten Iceland and the gloomy predictions for our neighbour, whose government is also falling)

Do you not think its noteworthy that FG has not been given an endorsement by two of their most able former leaders i.e Garrett and Dukes.Fitzgerald specifically stated FG would not be able to do any better that what FF are doing now.People like also seem to forget the 2007 election and the farcical campaign that FG and Labour ran.They snatched defeat from the Jaws of Vicyory.

What has this to do with our economic downfall, or this topic? I haven't mentioned anything of our opposition doing better or change of government. That's a separate issue completely from this. (PS Sorry your party did poorly in the local/european/by-elections, maybe this might wake them up to do more and ask Cowen to leave!)

FG are doing well in the polls because of anger and not because of ability.If you actually read some of their policies and looked at them objectively you will might actually see that that they are unworkable.The electorate needs to cop on to this or otherwise we will get a stark and unwanted reminder of why we rejected them for the last 30 years.

Not the topic (or place) for a debate on opposition. If you think this country needs FF however, you are mistaken.

If you want to take this over to politics forum - ill gladly continue the discussion in depth. However, we need to keep to the topic at hand which is about our local minister who has done some good for our county but seems to be quiet enough at the moment. Obviously the economic discussion partly comes into the discussion, but we need to keep the right balance as its a regional forum.

anon11

He's a clown anyway:rolleyes: My opinion:)

BBM77

mad man wrote: »

FG are doing well in the polls because of anger and not because of ability.If you actually read some of their policies and looked at them objectively you will might actually see that that they are unworkable.The electorate needs to cop on to this or otherwise we will get a stark and unwanted reminder of why we rejected them for the last 30 years.

My first memory of politics is how hated the FG – Fitzgerald government was. My parent’s always say that no matter what FF does it is better than having FG in power and a lot of people of my parent’s generation are the same. Being that it is mostly older people that vote in general elections and that Enda Kenny is not that popular there are serious questions as to whether FG would win an election.

It is easy for people to be giving out about jobs creation but where are these jobs going to come from in the current global economic climate.

As for Ireland being hit worse than the rest of the EU. Well that is a misrepresentation as most of EU economies were stagnant through Ireland's Celtic Tiger period and did not have growth to lose.

Sully

Ballybrickenman wrote: »

My first memory of politics is how hated the FG – Fitzgerald government was. My parent’s always say that no matter what FF does it is better than having FG in power and a lot of people of my parent’s generation are the same. Being that it is mostly older people that vote in general elections and that Enda Kenny is not that popular there are serious questions as to whether FG would win an election.

It is easy for people to be giving out about jobs creation but where are these jobs going to come from in the current global economic climate.

As for Ireland being hit worse than the rest of the EU. Well that is a misrepresentation as most of EU economies were stagnant through Ireland's Celtic Tiger period and did not have growth to lose.

I don't want to get into a Political discussion on this forum as its not the right place, but most people in that generation were usually FF supporters anyway. Its probably been more so in recent years there has been a significant shift for FG, especially under Enda Kenny's leadership with a young enough front bench, because most people are tired of the FF lead government. I know local elections are different but the word on the street, even from the elder generation, was that the vote for FF in their household is no longer there.

Mind, we are forgetting Labour and the Greens which have a significant impact in terms of polling well (excluding the Greens lately, of course).

Anyway, lets try keep this locally based. I think iv dragged it further off topic enough!

galwayrush

Stop complaining,it could be worse, you don't have Frank Fahey like us.:rolleyes:

rasper

Sorry still don't see that Cullen brought that much to Waterford after the last 20 years as a TD and 10+ in the FF led government, not when we look at how the rest of the cities advanced in those 10 boom years of reckless spending and we got a tolled ByPass.
While politicians in general make me sick atm , FG is better option (and I'm no fan) than FF as they've been there for way too long and are too arrogant, corrupt , and incompetent to run the country

Sully

rasper wrote: »

Sorry still don't see that Cullen brought that much to Waterford after the last 20 years as a TD and 10+ in the FF led government, not when we look at how the rest of the cities advanced in those 10 boom years of reckless spending and we got a tolled ByPass.
While politicians in general make me sick atm , FG is better option (and I'm no fan) than FF as they've been there for way too long and are too arrogant, corrupt , and incompetent to run the country

Okay, perhaps he never gave that much especially during the good times. But that was the party style - help the bankers and developers, everyone else can lump it. I think that FF could have done a lot better when in government, failed to get us out of the whole which was predicted and warned (I belive Cowen said recently they were "about" to fix the problems before everything went upside down).

At least we got something locally, and I guess nationally. I do think without Cullen, we probably would be a lot worse off then we are today (in Waterford). As much as it pains me to say that about a FF candidate

daftdave

Sully wrote: »

Assuming now that your a FF supporter, as thats the usual party line

Most reports have concluded we are a lot worse then other countrys. Our government is partly to blame because of the mess we are in. Sure, there is a bigger problem but a lot of what we deal with here (again) is because of our government. Even trying to fix the problems, there not exactly doing a sterling job.

Anyway, this discussion is more geared towards the Politics forum. Locally, we probably have escpaed a lot of injury in terms of job cuts but to loose Waterford Crystal with little support from the government was probably a big insult to the people who voted that way.

nope, TBH im not into politics at all..... it bores me , its just my personal opinion and my opinion might sound like a FF one , but what i say is true about having to ride it out , there is no other way, unless someone comes up with a masterplan to fix everybodys problems.

Sully

daftdave wrote: »

nope, TBH im not into politics at all..... it bores me , its just my personal opinion and my opinion might sound like a FF one , but what i say is true about having to ride it out , there is no other way, unless someone comes up with a masterplan to fix everybodys problems.

Fair enough. Well, everyone has to ride it out. Its how we ride it out is the problem, and the opposition each have their own ideas. Rather then the concept of "Lets tax our way out of a recession, screw the elderly and young people, and keep the rich, developers and banks happy!".

mad man

Sully wrote: »

No. Because FF are in denial pretty much and they always use the same line each time this arrises. You can always tell a FF supporter, their in denial and blame everyone but themselves.

That still doesn‘t mean he is a FF supporter.That is just your subjective opininion. FG supporters are equally as bad claiming they created the Celtic Tiger in the five minutes they were in power in the 90‘s

Sully wrote: »

Are we not? You might want to ask your minister for Finance to check his own facts then, as he reported differently. Source

A qoute fron the Indo no less.Let‘s hope this one costs them less than 1.8 million.

Sully wrote: »

Oh and not forgetting the IMF, I do believe they agreed. Source #1 | Source #2

On the contrary they say no such thing.They say we are the worst of the advance economies.This is an entirely different thing altogether.

Sully wrote: »

I think that should cover my point that we are a lot worse then other country's (not all of course, I haven't forgotten Iceland and the gloomy predictions for our neighbour, whose government is also falling)

Japan are worse off than us. The USA and UK are on a similar par.We are only now reaching levels of unemloyment that have been Normal in Germany and France for the last 10 years. Most of Eastern Europe is worse off then us.

Sully wrote: »

What has this to do with our economic downfall, or this topic? I haven't mentioned anything of our opposition doing better or change of government. That's a separate issue completely from this. (PS Sorry your party did poorly in the local/european/by-elections, maybe this might wake them up to do more and ask Cowen to leave!)

My party?Just because I don‘t swallow FG snake oil. You can always tell a FG supporter.They imediately accuse you of been a paid up member of FF as soon as you criticize them. BTW congrats on your success in the locals and too bad you probably won‘t be able to replicate it in a General Election. FF have been here before and made much more vicious cuts and they still won the subsequent election.The worst case scenario for FF is that they‘ll lose the next election and the electorate will get sick of FG in three years at the most.All this nonsense about the electorate moving away from FF.FG supporters have been saying this since the seventies and it still hasn‘t transpired.

Sully wrote: »

Not the topic (or place) for a debate on opposition. If you think this country needs FF however, you are mistaken.

I never said that at all.I‘m just saying that if we blindly vote for FG without seeing if their policies add up then we will get a worse government.The fact is that is how FG lose elections.Their policies don‘t add up.

Sully wrote: »

If you want to take this over to politics forum - ill gladly continue the discussion in depth. However, we need to keep to the topic at hand which is about our local minister who has done some good for our county but seems to be quiet enough at the moment. Obviously the economic discussion partly comes into the discussion, but we need to keep the right balance as its a regional forum

I didn‘t bring this off topic.If you feel the need to move it over to the politics forum then that‘s up to you.

Sully

mad man wrote: »

That still doesn‘t mean he is a FF supporter.That is just your subjective opininion. FG supporters are equally as bad claiming they created the Celtic Tiger in the five minutes they were in power in the 90‘s

Well its either one of two things; 1) Politically uneducated (ie not interested) and just picking up on bits and pieces, 2) FF supporter. Thats the line FF have trotted, against everybody else who can see that its not true.

A qoute fron the Indo no less.Let‘s hope this one costs them less than 1.8 million.

Sorry, how about The Irish Examiner? Source

On the contrary they say no such thing.They say we are the worst of the advance economies.This is an entirely different thing altogether.

They still said it.

Japan are worse off than us. The USA and UK are on a similar par.We are only now reaching levels of unemloyment that have been Normal in Germany and France for the last 10 years. Most of Eastern Europe is worse off then us.

Never claimed we were the "worst". One of the worst is different.

My party?Just because I don‘t swallow FG snake oil. You can always tell a FG supporter.They imediately accuse you of been a paid up member of FF as soon as you criticize them. BTW congrats on your success in the locals and too bad you probably won‘t be able to replicate it in a General Election. FF have been here before and made much more vicious cuts and they still won the subsequent election.The worst case scenario for FF is that they‘ll lose the next election and the electorate will get sick of FG in three years at the most.All this nonsense about the electorate moving away from FF.FG supporters have been saying this since the seventies and it still hasn‘t transpired.

What about Labour? Or Sinn Fein? I guess all party's are bad bar FF then? FF - the party of the future eh. I think FG replicated very well in the last GE, in comparison to other years.

I never said that at all.I‘m just saying that if we blindly vote for FG without seeing if their policies add up then we will get a worse government.The fact is that is how FG lose elections.Their policies don‘t add up.

I highly doubt that FG/Labour could provide a worse government to be fair.

I didn‘t bring this off topic.If you feel the need to move it over to the politics forum then that‘s up to you.

Well, we both did. We are having a political discussion not related to Waterford, so its off topic Nothing personal btw, I enjoy a good political debate from time to time

j walsh

Come on now sully at post 13 you said you dragged it enough off topic now at post 20 your still at it , remember now it should be the same rule for everyone

Sully

j walsh wrote: »

Come on now sully at post 13 you said you dragged it enough off topic now at post 20 your still at it , remember now it should be the same rule for everyone

I'm tempted to move it, but its not ideal to move. But ya, best I stop before we turn the thread into a complete politics one!

j walsh

Hey don't include me in that WE remark, I'm one of the politically uneducated :D

Woodgate

anon11 wrote: »

He's a clown anyway:rolleyes: My opinion:)

Who, Sully?;)

j walsh

Woodgate wrote: »

Who, Sully?;)

Now now, keep it on topic or it will be moved .

Sully

Anyway, lets swing back onto topic. Whats the general opinion on Cullen? A good minister for Waterford?

j walsh

I don't think he's done very much for Waterford at all!!!!!!!

daftdave

Sully wrote: »

Fair enough. Well, everyone has to ride it out. Its how we ride it out is the problem, and the opposition each have their own ideas. Rather then the concept of "Lets tax our way out of a recession, screw the elderly and young people, and keep the rich, developers and banks happy!".

completely agree with ya 100% on this

mad man

Sully wrote: »

Well its either one of two things; 1) Politically uneducated (ie not interested) and just picking up on bits and pieces, 2) FF supporter. Thats the line FF have trotted, against everybody else who can see that its not true. :

That‘s an incredibly arrogant remark.Politically uneducated? All you‘re criticisms of FF have been newspaper headlines in other words picking up bits and pieces.

Sully wrote: »

Sorry, how about The Irish Examiner? Source:

This is a doorstep off the remark.You‘re trying to compare this to the IMF assessment or some other detailed analysis.

Sully wrote: »

Never claimed we were the "worst". One of the worst is different :

But we‘re not one of the worst either. We‘re one the worst of the *advanced*.Its an entirely different scenario. What their talking about is probably the top 10 economies.Because the fact is their is plenty of countries in the EU who are way worse off than us.

Sully wrote: »

What about Labour? Or Sinn Fein? I guess all party's are bad bar FF then? FF - the party of the future eh. I think FG replicated very well in the last GE, in comparison to other years :

So tell me about SF and Labour.

When you‘re at rock bottom the only way is up. Thta‘s all that happened here.They still fluffed an election that was theirs.

Sully wrote: »

I highly doubt that FG/Labour could provide a worse government to be fair. :

Why not? Well the electorate consistently do.After all they‘ve never gotten a second chance in the history of the state If you are capable of objectivity then read their policies.If you are not politically ignorant you will see that they havn‘t got any. What they call policy is already poilicy and anything different is rubbish like makeing all the towns in Irelkand city‘s.

Sully wrote: »

Well, we both did. We are having a political discussion not related to Waterford, so its off topic Nothing personal btw, I enjoy a good political debate from time to time :

Actually Sully I didn‘t bring it off topic.Are you still the moderator? I‘ve no problem with keeping thnings on topic but you seem to be only willing to do it after you‘ve had the last word on the digression.

Sully

mad_man: Thanks for the kind words, but we have moved back onto the original topic (which I will happily admit I took a role in dragging it off!). Appreciate if you could join us