Research for Historical Fiction

CallistaRose

I only skimmed the first three pages but then gave up, so this might be here somewhere.

I found this site via topic about cliches. I was looking up Irish names, trying to come up with some that were pretty basic and not uncommon, but not over used.

I'm working on a story line that follows a girl through the famine and immigration from Dublin to Canada. Her elder sister and brother in-law settle in New York.

I found some census summaries for the 1860's on popular male and female names in Ireland, however, that is really only good for the second of the two which deals with the Fenian movement in southern Ontario. It's not, NOT useful by any means, but I'm having difficulties.

So for instance, I know Kailey is an Irish name, and I'm using it for the main characters name <.< , but I want her sister to be named Kathleen. One of her brothers will be named Patrick, and yes, I know that's cliche but I don't particularly care either :P according to the census, it was the second most common male name in Ireland during this time period! But in terms of shortening it, Pat, Patty (which will never happen because I hate that) or Paddy? I mean, I prefer Paddy but then again, that comes from my favourite band being Great Big Sea.

I all ready know to avoid the terrible red hair cliche, especially since, historically, that's not even Ireland, it's SCOTLAND. *sigh*: two cliche, historic appearances: Black hair and green eyes; red hair and blue eyes. My family are *ALL* in the second category so don't even try to tell me it's not practical or it's without truth. I have ONE cousin that isn't a red head or a blonde and that's because she's half native, and only two of them (there are sixteen of them) other than the aforementioned have eyes that are brown.

I think I'll write without an accent. I only accent in fantasy settings, just because I'm paranoid like that.

I was wondering, other than idea's, if someone can help me with a general idea for historical locations. YES, I DO want them to be from the country :P but partway they move to Dublin, and no I've never been there. I need some reliable information on The Irish Young and the famine as well, but I can find most of that myself on-line.

I've got OCD tendencies with research. It's why I've never done a historical before because when I write, if something doesn't match up the way I want it to or need it to, I will actually freak out and possibly have an emotional breakdown that will involve me throwing out everything I've done to that point. So anyways, advice from others on how best to approach the research, names and trying to figure out geography would be HUGELY appreciated.

Pleaaase?

Antilles

I'm Irish, and have lived in Ireland my entire life, and I have never met or heard of anyone with the name 'Kailey'.

EileenG

Agree, I've never met a Kailey. I know of one American Kailey. In the 250 children in my daughter's school, there are no Kaileys.

Patrick is usually shortened to Pat or Paddy or Packy, but because there are so many Patricks, a lot of them have nicknames.

A quick check is to see if there is a saint with that name. Most Irish Catholics of that time would be named after saints. So lots of Patrick, Mary, John, Michael, Anne, Kathleen, Bernadette, Peter etc.

Red hair and blue eyes are definitely an Irish trait, but brown hair and blue eyes are more common.

I live in Dublin now, but I'm originally from Granard in Co Longford, which is in the middle of Ireland. What sort of thing do you want to know?

CallistaRose

Kailey is an English name in truth, but has Irish roots in the original Caelan and they both have the same meaning: slender, or Caellach which is Bright-Headed.

Well statistics are fairly easy to come by, it's the actual actions that might have occurred historically that I can maybe use. I don't know how much is far fetched and how much is honest. The second story is particularly easy because it's set within an hour of where I live lol, because I'm from a huge Irish immigration area, even though the Scots and orangemen kind of pushed the others out.

I'm trying to find a good place to set the beginning of the story.. it needs to be somewhere that they could move to Dublin from but that was impacted by the Famine pretty hard.

EileenG

Well, Granard and Longford are about 75 miles from Dublin. There's a story that my own family originated in Donegal, but a widow with seven children decided to move elsewhere because of the famine. She got as far as Longford when the wheel fell off her cart and broke, so she settled there. Certainly everyone with my surname in that area is second cousin or closer.

There are a lot of stories about how the landlords of the area used the tenants as their own personal slaves, ending with a priest's curse and a road going through the remains of their manor house.

CallistaRose

Hmm I'll look into that! Thanks!

I'm looking into and at the origins of the Fenian movement as well, since I want the main characters elder brothers to be involved with it. I appreciate that!

Yeah I was planning primarily for varying shades of brown hair in the main family, and blue and hazel eyes. My family is very Canadian lol. I'm Irish and Scottish on my dads side and Irish and Cherokee from my mom, but our family hasn't been out of North American for over a hundred years now- they just like to keep marrying other Irish and Scottish-Americans so we have lots of information on the North American immigration idea but it's been brutal attempting to come up with reliable information, and I don't have the funds to take an actual trip to Ireland for research.

Thankyou!

EileenG

One of the side-effects of the famine and the whole English/Irish language thing is that there isn't nearly as much documentation as you'd like. Try contacting the Famine Museum www.strokestownpark.ie/museum.html. Chances are that anything they can't answer themselves, they'll know who can.

I find it amazing how willing people are to answer questions as long as you ask sensible questions about specific things.

Antilles

Hi OP, on the topic of names again, don't be afraid to go with the stereotypes. Saints names are gold as far as the Irish are concerned. Patrick, John, Bridget, Michael, and the like. Unusual names (like Kailey) are popular now, but among the elderly people I know, the only ones I know with names that stand out are named after obscure saints/holy people. I know one lady called "Asumpta", for example, which I always thought was cool

If you really like the name Kailey for your character, maybe you could give an explanation for why she has such an unusual name (it could have been after a non-Irish namesake?).

A little off topic, by the way, but to illustrate the "religious stereotype" thing above, my mother and her two siblings are all named Mary on their birth cert - including her brother!

I'll change the other names to protect identities, but the pattern goes: Mary Ruth O'Brien, Mary Anna O'Brien and Mary Michael O'Brien. They all go by their middle names in conversation

EileenG

I was about to say that about the names. When I announced I was naming my daughter Eris, my aunt looked at me and said "And what Saint is she named after?"

But it would be perfectly reasonable for your heroine to be called Kathleen or Catherine, and have her name shortened or nicknamed to Kailey. I've got an aunt, who was known until the day she died, aged 93, as "Babbie" because that was what her sister called her when she was born.

CallistaRose

Okay thanks. Heh. I've decided to go with Brighid for the main character... but now i'm obsessed with the spelling because one way you spell it, it's a Celtic Goddess, the other way a Catholic saint lol.

I decided to not go with Kailey for it, and Mary Kathleen and Mary Margaret for her sisters along with Johanna. I'm going wiht a large family for the main character. It's going to start with her youngest sisters funeral >.< So she has eight living siblings, six brothers and two sisters. I couldn't help it. I tried to keep it reasonable but then I ran the numbers on deaths verses lives... Going with Mary-Kathleen (Katie), Thomas (Tom), Colin, Brighid, Patrick (Paddy and Pat.. depending on the age since it covers time), Peter, Michael (Mikey), Johanna (Jo), David, Margaret (Maggie). >.<

I'm going to look up: the Irish Young, general facts about the famine, the towns mentioned, traditions (Marriage, birth, death and baptism), as well as catholic Irish information, and legal information (ie hangings, riots, expulsion stuff <.<) If there is anythign else I'm blatantly missing, can you give a suggestion?

I really appreciate the help I've gotten so far! Thanks so much!

EileenG

Sounds good. Lots of very big Irish families back then. Actually, my best friend at school was one of 13 children. And putting Mary in the names of most of the girls happened all the time.

My only niggle would be Johanna. Not a typical Irish name. What about Josephine, shortened to Jo?

I'm sure you'll find most of the specific stuff you need. One thing that might be a bit unusual in Ireland was that while girls married young enough, there was a tendency for men to stay home, unmarried, until they were a lot older, often when their parents died and they get the farm. That applied in the country more than in towns.

i-digress

I second that, Johanna would not have been a popular Irish name. If you're set on using it, I'd take out the H.