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Is once saved always saved

  • 11-06-2009 02:55PM
    #1
    bobbiw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 211 ✭✭


    The first lie that the devil ever told. As he said to Adam and Eve that (in their saved state, perfect relationship to God) that if they sinned they would not actually die.


Comments

  • #2
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    bobbiw wrote: »
    The first lie that the devil ever told.

    I doubt that. Although I imagine the lie he told Eve was the first lie he told to a human. It's reasonable to suppose that the angels cast out of heaven with him were lied to by him - in order to convince them that rebelling against God was an okay thing to do.
    As he said to Adam and Eve that (in their saved state, perfect relationship to God) that if they sinned they would not actually die.

    Once saved always saved refers to previously lost people who have now been found and the doctrine of OSAS refers only to that case. Adam and Eve weren't lost at the time you refer to in order that they could be considered to exist in a "saved state" so the doctrine OSAS doesn't apply to them.

    Besides, there is good reason to suppose that Gods admittedly 'perfect' relationship with Adam and Eve was limited to the extent of guardianship. God educated, provided for, protected, instructed - fulfilling the role of guardian. But search where you will: there is no indication of loving, intimate union between them. That such an intimate relationship is intended between God and "saved state" people is a notion that drips from the pores of the Bible. I'd imagine that Adam and Eve had as much opportunity to be saved from their lost state as the next man (and woman). If so, they too would enter into another kind of perfect relationship with God. One based on mutual love.

    Two reasons thus, to suppose that you might be comparing apples and pears?


  • #3
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    This subject was discussed before. :)

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055160611&highlight=saved


  • #4
    PDN
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,686 ✭✭✭✭PDN


    Maybe it's predestined that we discuss it again?


  • #5
    Soul Winner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,534 ✭✭✭Soul Winner


    bobbiw wrote: »
    The first lie that the devil ever told. As he said to Adam and Eve that (in their saved state, perfect relationship to God) that if they sinned they would not actually die.

    He didn't actually say it that way. What he said was this: "Did God really say that you will die if you eat of that tree?" He put the seed of doubt about what God actually said in their hearts first. Then he proceeded to tell them that wasn't true after all, that what God meant was that if they eat of it then they'll become like Him and the reason He didn't want them eating of it was because God didn't want them to be like Him, which was a lie because God had already said to the Elohim, "Let us make Adam in our own image." Part of getting to that "image of God" state was trusting what God said. They failed at the first hurdle and it has been a reconstructive effort on God's part ever since. But God fixed the damage that was done by Adam through the work of Christ and now He can take us on the basis of what Jesus did. Making us over in His image by the power of His indwelling Spirit by faith.


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