Quick question???

wiggy123

I bought a PB,reg Angus heifer last Autumn..i ai's her before xmas,she was in with other cows,mayb got bullied..anyway-i scanned her+other cows at the start of March...She proved empty+dirty according to my Scanner man...said to get her cleaned,i never did-she came a bulling after that-and then again-when i ai'd her again..she since came a bulling again this month! and i let a bull to her..She is 19 days at mo--no sign yet of activity-so fingers crossed she has kept!when shes on-shes on(get me drift-very noticable)

I have looked at her breeding--and it seems that her Sire--is a Son of her Dam, with a different Sire..get me drift! see below...
[SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]DALRENE EXTRA 36A [SS] (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#711752(CA)22[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]YOUNG DALE MONARCH 12E [AI] (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#838732(CA)23[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]YOUNG DALE GRACE 16C [ET] (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#763744(CA)22[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]Sire: LURGHAMLOUGH WESTERN [SIZE=-1]#20030492(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]ROOSE ULAH (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#IWN.U1.09(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]LURGHAMLOUGH KATE [SIZE=-1]#IUZ.K2.27(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]WARREN EVELIN [SIZE=-1]#IJO.E1.22(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=+1]Animal: FORMILL DAISY (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#20071187(IR)33[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]BLACK EAGLE CHALLENGER 19E (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#404727(CA)01[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]ROOSE ULAH (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#IWN.U1.09(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]ROOSE LILIAN [SIZE=-1]#2390(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]Dam: LURGHAMLOUGH KATE [SIZE=-1]#IUZ.K2.27(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]CREGGA VINCENT (IMP) [SIZE=-1]#1391(IR)00[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]WARREN EVELIN [SIZE=-1]#IJO.E1.22(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE] [SIZE=+0][/SIZE][SIZE=+0]BRANCHFIELD SARAH [SIZE=-1]#3369(IR)[/SIZE][/SIZE]

Would this be the problem????
advice please..she costed me a gd few pound-at a Pedigree Sale-but i know the owner,etc....she is a lovely animal..and do want to breed her!

If a animal is showing heat,etc..coudl she still be dirty inside...

This is the 2nd time,this has happened to me..i had a angus heifer last year(cost €2k)ai's 4 times+a natural service--never kept! her breeding was ok...man took her back...so am thinking i have no luck with outside heifers--to only breed from my own..

Rant over!

Bitten & Hisses

It's a bit irresponsible of the breeder to sell an inbred animal with a pedigree cert, let alone at a society sale. I'd be sending her back if I were you.

wiggy123

so B&H, would u take it--thats my problem...she might hold to the natural serviice..fingers crossed

reilig

wiggy123 wrote: »

so B&H, would u take it--thats my problem...she might hold to the natural serviice..fingers crossed

She might hold in calf, in fact she probably will, but you don't want to be breeding pedigree animals with her. Firts of all the AA Society should never have registered her. Secondly, calves from her may be deformed when born. Also, inbred calves will not perform as well as non inbred. Not with commercial cattle anyway.

just my twopence worth

whelan1

we too have pedigree angus had really bad problems getting them in calf this year then we gave them an extra shot of lepto seemed to do the trick. Didnt think the angus society would allow an animal to be registered if there is a high rate of inbreeding in the bloodline maybe give them a ring

wiggy123

hear what ye--are all saying..well she is registered,have her papers-and transferred into my name/herd! Society never asked questions about her!
to me -she shouldn't have been registered
is a lovely heifer!so am trying to breed from her!
have you whelan..gd man! well--i have all ai'd(10)in the last 2 weeks..so fingers crossed,they'll keep..etc!
as bad summer so far..fertilty wise--has been for the last few years--according to reports

whelan1

watch her and if no heat scan at 28 days if empty wash out and start again

wiggy123

that what i plan to do...scan all cows-start of july!
had 75% rate last summer
autumn rate was poor 40%..so got rid of some...
all young cows,mayb were to fat--as angus,fatten fast!
not wait till over 30--40 days..best time to scan..according to man that scans for me...

Bitten & Hisses

wiggy123 wrote: »

so B&H, would u take it--thats my problem...she might hold to the natural serviice..fingers crossed

Are you asking if I would take her back if I was the guy who had sold her? I wouldn't have sold her for breeding in the first place, but I think the vendor has a responsibility here. You should go through the fine print in the sale catalogue. Normally, there's a clause about fertility guarantees. e.g. this one from the Limousin Society, which is printed in every sale catalogue. (Page 2, clause 7 (e) )

http://irishlimousin.com/09/downloads/conditions%20of%20sale.pdf

wiggy123

i hear you B & H..i bought at a local marts(Ballybay monaghan) autumn pedigree sale of males and females(all breeds)..
unsure the conditions they used...

pakalasa

I am not speaking with authority on this but, in-breeding like this may be ok. I remember seeing something about this before in an Irish Limousin catalouge....have it here.
The 2006 Sire catalouge - it says about the Inbreeding matrix "this matrix examines the levels of inbreeding via inbreeding coeffecients, only on the PATERNAL side of female. Offspring may be inbred from the maternal side of the female."

whelan1

very technical!!! there are 2 angus groups here i think ring kathryn bradshaw in mohill can get your number if you want and she will clear the inbreeding thing up for you

nilhg

Inbreeding per se is not a problem as long as it's not overdone, infact it's quite common in racehorses and greyhounds, take a look at the pedigree of the famous racehorse Rock of Gibraltar, he's inbred 3x3 (the same animal appears twice in the third line of the pedigree) to the great sire Northern Dancer. The trick is to know when to use it and when not to, if you don't know the difference then outbreed.

TBH I think you made a mistake not having her washed out by a vet, there must be a possibility that some damage has been done.

whelan1

wiggy123 off the topic slightly have you any black bulls for sale we are sold out and have a few people ringing us

wiggy123

whelan1....
hi, i have 3 bulls there at mo...all are PB, 1 not reg-other 2 are! are april/may 08......nice animals
justed tested ytday..so will b a heading soon!

where u at? me in louth

http://dunnamor.synthasite.com

whelan1

i am in louth too , have 3 people looking for bulls for cows would yours do the job? and what sires

whelan1

nice website we have a herd along the motorway between dunleer and drogheda - priestown herd !

wiggy123

whelan1...
cheers! still in design--have to update with new pictures!
hmm--ah gd man or woman! ur either a son or daughter of noel mc donnell....called to him before-about a bull,yrs back..hmm--3 bulls,are by a stock bull i had-which was by priestown jupiter(u's bred him)...
they are nice bulls--suitable for any females i think..call if u want-hav a quick check..then u get inform them folk..if u want! welcome..
Am ai'ing all my stock--better animals,at better value!

i recommended a fella,of you,last year...donal/gerry mc elroy-kilkerley...no?think they bought a bull of ya! seen him if so--nice bull-covers the ground very well..beefy!!

whelan1

ye i am his daughter i have the dairy herd over the road and he has the sucklers ptj was a brilliant calf and did exceptional in tully ... only wish we could have had more of him... we did et but the price was crap at the time for bulls .. i gave your mobile to a few people so see how it goes...

wiggy123

thats grand whelan1..cheers for that
he is a great bull--hav used him myself this year..through ai!
he also bred priestown tornado...not used much,pedigree use!

whelan1

ptn was a different type of bull out of a totally different breeding he was a lovely bull but just didnt have the rear end !!!!!!!!!!!!

wiggy123

that he was.mite use straws again of him!
hav rough pics up on website of the said bulls..will get better 1's over the wkend