Any other Assessor get this Email re. Safety Statement?

Pkiernan

It seems a little fishy to me....

For one thing, my insurance company does not require that I need this.

As to a Safety Statement, to my knowledge, it is only required by a Company, not a private individual, and in any case can be written easily yourself.

As in all walks of business, be careful.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Dear BER Assessor,
As you are aware the market has opened up, due to the last phase of the legislation been implemented on the 1st January 2009.
As an Assessor I am aware of the requirements going forward and this is why I have acquired a Health and Safety Statement written specifically for BER Assessors.
You will need this statement to make sure you have all you paperwork in order. Also your insurance company will require you to have one to validate your insurance.
The going rate for this document would be approximately €300, however I can offer this statement at the bargain price of €150.
In the current climate of rising costs I understand that value for money is paramount and that is why I am insisting on keeping costs down.
Should you wish to purchase a Safety Statement please forward your cheque/postal order for €150 + €10 print and postage costs payable to Peak Safety Consultants at the below address.
I look forward to your response and I will be more than happy to answer any queries you may have. Also a safety statement can be tailored for your needs if required.

Yours Sincerely,

******************************



do not mention company names here!

syd

SilverBER

We are bombarded daily with stuff like this that is deemed by the sender to be urgently required for BER assessors. Our company safety statement is a generic document that we purchased from a consultancy in Dublin a few years ago which we update as required ourselves. Safety statements are a generic document that is stored on a hard drive and only requires a name change to make it relevant to the individual who is buying it. Its a bit ironic that they are charging an extra tenner for printing when that is all they are doing in the first place. I am unsure if a BER assessor requires one but a BER assessor should be registered as a company as it is required under the SEI registration system. At least it was in my case unless they have moved the goalposts again.

papachango

These guys are hoping you dont know anything about Health and Safety issues / requirements. I will try and shed some light on this.
Some of what they say is true, I believe. For example, In some instances an insurance company will seek to wriggle out of payment on an insurance claim should the company/individual not have a safety statement in place, if said company/individual is required to have one by law. If the company said they had one in place but did not, well, thats a different matter.
The problem for BER assessors working alone is the following. There is not a 'health & safety code of practice' for BER assessors issued by the HSA(Health Safety Authority). As such, BER assessors ARE required by law to at least have 'risk assessments' carried out. These assessments should identify any potential risk to the BER assessor, people affected by their work or the general public. If there are risks, then the control measures to eliminate or reduce the risks to acceptable levels, should be documented and put in place. Risk assessments are the first step in drawing up a safety statement anyway.
Returning to the offer of 'BER assessor' safety statements from these guys in relation to its legality and value. The following should be of concern to any prospective clients of 'peak safety consultants'. In closing the offer, They state 'Also a safety statement can be tailored for your needs if required.' From my knowledge When a safety statement is required it MUST be drawn up company specific/site specific and be based on risk assessments carried out in the field and be tailored specifically to cover the operations in question 'BY LAW'.
SilverBER is obviously correct when he says that his companies safety is a generic document, and that these guys should not be charging 150 euro for printing off a generic document stored locally on a machine. He's right, but the funny side of this, for myself, is that it nearly every report has a generic format. for example, BER reports are as generic as they come and BER assesors aren't shy about charging 3,4,5 hundred euro a pop and the rest if they can get away with it. But clearly the BER assessor must visit and assess the property in question. That is where they earn their money. The resulting report, as we all know does not take long and follows a generic format.
Bottom line, if you are in business and have three or more employees(even once a year for seasonal work) you must have a health & safety statement in place including all associated risk assesments.
If you're a BER assessor working alone you have a legal duty to have the risk assessments documented.


Original email
"Dear BER Assessor,
As you are aware the market has opened up, due to the last phase of the legislation been implemented on the 1st January 2009.
As an Assessor I am aware of the requirements going forward and this is why I have acquired a Health and Safety Statement written specifically for BER Assessors.
You will need this statement to make sure you have all you paperwork in order. Also your insurance company will require you to have one to validate your insurance.
The going rate for this document would be approximately €300, however I can offer this statement at the bargain price of €150.
In the current climate of rising costs I understand that value for money is paramount and that is why I am insisting on keeping costs down.
Should you wish to purchase a Safety Statement please forward your cheque/postal order for €150 + €10 print and postage costs payable to Peak Safety Consultants at the below address.
I look forward to your response and I will be more than happy to answer any queries you may have. Also a safety statement can be tailored for your needs if required.
Yours Sincerely,
*********************************

SilverBER

papachango wrote: »

SilverBER is obviously correct when he says that his companies safety is a generic document, and that these guys should not be charging 150 euro for printing off a generic document stored locally on a machine. He's right, but the funny side of this, for myself, is that it nearly every report has a generic format. for example, BER reports are as generic as they come and BER assesors aren't shy about charging 3,4,5 hundred euro a pop and the rest if they can get away with it. But clearly the BER assessor must visit and assess the property in question. That is where they earn their money. The resulting report, as we all know does not take long and follows a generic format.

I would argue the comparison between a BER report and a generic document such as a safety statement. The supplier of my safety statement did not come to my office and survey it, neither did he spend the guts of an hour calculating the data before entering it in the system. Neither did he then pay a fee to publish the document.
The safety statement that we hold was purchased following a brief conversation on the telephone after which someone in his office typed our details into the document where it was applicable before posting it off to us upon receipt if the agreed fee. A business acquaintance of mine was also in the market for a similar document so I recommended the person who did ours. I subsequently had a look at what he got and found it was the very same thing with different company details.

papachango

As I've said in the previous reply....

But clearly the BER assessor must visit and assess the property in question. That is where they earn their money.

To avoid the kettle calling the pot black etc....

I thought I would inform you of the practice of some BER assessors. (Though I expect you are aware of this already as its pretty much standard practice)
BER assessors do duplicate certs for buildings when they are producing them for a new housing development. ie 50 houses of Type A, Type B, Type C. Three BER assesments are done to reflect the different house types.
The addresses are then changed on each cert as required. The houses are then sold to the client with a BER assesment in place.

Just thought you should know of this. As I've also said these safety guys should have visited your property and performed risk assessments and then drawn up the report.

Hope this clears thigs up.:D

sinnerboy

Orientation , no of sides sheltered , and "mirroring" of units will all conspire to require a lot more than 3 generics in your example . Each house will have a unique MPRN number . Often in such developments the number of En suites can vary within a given type . Garages and attics can be offered converted or not . The type of fire - secondary heat source - can be fixed throughout - or varied as an allowance . A bit more to it all I'm afraid

Chimpster

sinnerboy wrote: »

Orientation , no of sides sheltered , and "mirroring" of units will all conspire to require a lot more than 3 generics in your example . Each house will have a unique MPRN number . Often in such developments the number of En suites can vary within a given type . Garages and attics can be offered converted or not . The type of fire - secondary heat source - can be fixed throughout - or varied as an allowance . A bit more to it all I'm afraid

Correct.

Doing a bulk job at the minute and each unit needs to be surveyed individually.

% Low Energy Lights, Orientation, Attic Insulation in place (you'd be suprised!), Shading, Sheltering, Exposed areas.... These can differ greatly on even new estates.

papachango

Agree with both of the last replies. This is how it should be done. This whole thread is about people NOT doing what they are meant to do. And then passing off generic reports as detailed and accurate reports.
BER Cert involves assessor visiting premises, assesing the building, aspect, insulation, energy consumption etc and generating the report.
Health and Safety Statement involves OHS individual visiting Site and performing risk assessments, getting company details, staff details etc and then drawing up a detailed and accurate Health & Safety statement.
The original post is about someone passing off a generic health & safety statement as a company specific safety statement. This is illegal. A site vist IS required.
I made the point the same things happens with BER certs, particularly with new developments. Its Not meant to happen, but it does.
Both documents require site visits. Simple as that people.
A proper health & safety statement is no more generic than a proper BER certificate. Thats the point I am making.
But generic forms of both DO exist and DO get sold to unsuspecting clients so be aware of the requirements of site specific Safety Statements AND Building specific BER Certificates. Hope thats cleared up where I'm coming from on this. Enjoy the booming demand for both!! :rolleyes: