Terry on AH

Mr.Lizard

Would like to report 'Terry' for banning me from After Hours for 2 days for "personal abuse" when in fact none was ever given.

Clearly the guy takes things too 'personal' when he's banning people for comments that (whilst he may disagree with) he cannot technically define as personal.

Don't care what the outcome of this report is. Would just like it registered somewhere so that people can see that he is abusing his athority as a mod on AH.

Regards.

Gordon

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

Just ignore him. He's usually just talking drunken nonsense.

How is that not taking a shot at someone?

Terry

As quoted above by Gordon, that is personal abuse.

Had you said that to anyone else, you would have been banned.
I'm not going to sit back and take crap from anyone just because I happen to be a mod in AH.

You are a low level troll reminiscent of someone I won't name and your bans are just going to get longer if you keep this up.
No, I'm not going to go through your thousands of posts to pick out references. Just know that you are on the radar and are heading for a permanent ban from AH if you continue your low level trolling.

Mr.Lizard

It's not personal abuse. It's a statement of fact.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59886583&highlight=DRUNK#post59886583

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59638883&highlight=DRUNK#post59638883

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59576245&highlight=DRUNK#post59576245

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59576208&highlight=DRUNK#post59576208

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59120586&highlight=DRUNK#post59120586

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58411118&highlight=DRUNK#post58411118

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58373851&highlight=DRUNK#post58373851

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58245698&highlight=DRUNK#post58245698

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=57761982&highlight=DRUNK#post57761982

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=56290279&highlight=DRUNK#post56290279

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=56008587&highlight=DRUNK#post56008587

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=54488314&highlight=DRUNK#post54488314

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=54479000&highlight=DRUNK#post54479000


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=54142114&highlight=DRUNK#post54142114

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=54142965&highlight=DRUNK#post54142965


If you want not be referred to as a drunken poster then stop doing it and specifically stop admitting to it freely on boards.ie for anyone to read.

As I see it, Terry has banned me for 2 days because I called a spade-a-spade and insulting his musical taste. Quite childish and a clear abuse of moderator power.

sceptre

So you felt the need to go for a second helping of abuse in your reply to the ban notification? Or you reckon that wasn't abuse either?

Mr.Lizard

He had already banned me at that at that point. I felt I might as well get my moneys-worth and have no desire for the ban to be resinded.

It still remains that the ban itself was unjust. As has been demonstrated Terry has banned me for nothing more than insulting his musical taste and for calling him a drunken poster (a statement that has been backed up by at least a dozen of his own personal admissions).

I would suggest that the people who run this site sort him out before people on AH realise what hypocrites you probably are.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

It's not personal abuse. It's a statement of fact.

No. It's a half truth.
Did you see me state anywhere tonight that I am drunk?
No point in searching. I'm sober.
I clicked on the first couple of links. They go back 2 years. I'm not going through the rest of them. I'm sure they all say the same thing. Whooo. I'm drunk. or something along those lines.
That has nothing to do with my moderation here tonight.
You insulted a user of After Hours and you were banned for it.

If you want not be referred to as a drunken poster then stop doing it and specifically stop admitting to it freely on boards.ie for anyone to read.

If I'm drunk, I'll point out that I'm drunk like plenty of other AH users do.
I do not ban people when I'm drunk (unless they deserve it, but that's neither here nor there).

As far as AH is concerned, I'm a user first and a moderator second.
I love that forum and that's why I post there all the time.
My love of that forum is why I was asked to be a moderator there in the first place.
The then Cmod saw that I had a passion for it and saw that I would do a decent job. I still remain an AH user first though.

As I see it, Terry has banned me for 2 days because I called a spade-a-spade and insulting his musical taste. Quite childish and a clear abuse of moderator power.

You insulted my musical taste?
I'm afraid you have me a bit stumped there.
I banned you for the post quoted above and that's all I banned you for.
I'm currently listening to Pet Sounds by the Beach Boys. I don't ever recall you saying anything bad about them.

Anyway, ban extended because of the abusive PM you sent me.
It's a week now.
I have discussed this with an Admin and have been given approval for this action.

Mr.Lizard

I said you were 'usually drunk'. I never said you were drunk for this specfic incident. Nor am I blaming your banning of me on being drunk.

What exactly from all of my statements do you find personally insulting that you have to ban me for?

I have discussed this with an Admin and have been given approval for this action.

I'm not surprised in the slightest. They must have been impressed by your 'passion'. :rolleyes:

Gordon

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

I said you were 'usually drunk'. I never said you were drunk for this specfic incident. Nor am I blaming your banning of me on being drunk.

You still drinking loads of coffee?

Mr.Lizard

Gordon wrote: »

You still drinking loads of coffee?

Have to say Gordon. I used to consider you one of the few 'adults' of boards.ie'' so that pureile point-scoring attempt has honestly startled me.

But yeah to answer your question .... absolutely. If anything each cup makes me more alert (as opposed to Terry's drinking habit).

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

I said you were 'usually drunk'. I never said you were drunk for this specfic incident. Nor am I blaming your banning of me on being drunk.

You claimed that most of my posts were made in a drunken state.
This is not true.

What exactly from all of my statements do you find personally insulting that you have to ban me for?

As I already said, the one quoted above by Gordon.

I'm now done with this thread and complaint.
Should you send any more abusive PMs, I will continue to extend your ban.

Mr.Lizard

Terry wrote: »

You claimed that most of my posts were made in a drunken state.
This is not true.


As I already said, the one quoted above by Gordon.

I'm now done with this thread and complaint.
Should you send any more abusive PMs, I will continue to extend your ban.

In fairness you've stated yourself that you are consistently drunk from the hours of 7pm to 4am (9hours per day) which if we presume you (like most people) sleep an average of 8 hours per day means you are drunk for 9 of every 16 hours per day (ie 56% of the day). That is 'most' of the day which can represent 'most' of your posts.

I am not throwing around accusations. My allegations are based entirely on your own testimony.

Gordon

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

Have to say Gordon. I used to consider you one of the few 'adults' of boards.ie'' so that pureile point-scoring attempt has honestly startled me.

You cut me deep.

But yeah to answer your question .... absolutely. If anything each cup makes me more alert (as opposed to Terry's drinking habit).

Alert, like that lovable South Park scamp Tweek.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

Have to say Gordon. I used to consider you one of the few 'adults' of boards.ie'' so that pureile point-scoring attempt has honestly startled me.

But yeah to answer your question .... absolutely. If anything each cup makes me more alert (as opposed to Terry's drinking habit).

You continue to insult me.
I've already stated that I will not take any crap from anyone.
Your ban is now 2 weeks.
It's just going to double every time you insult me.

Yes, this is abuse of power, but I feel completely justified in doing it.

I can take a joke, but you are just being malicious and I'm not going to sit back and take that crap.

Want to insult me again?
That will make it a month.

I'm just going to keep increasing the ban.
If you were to talk about another AH user in the same manner, then it would already be permanent.
If you were to talk about another AH mod in this way, then I would just double what I'm already doing.

We volunteer our time to this site and we do not deserve this sort of crap from anyone.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

In fairness you've stated yourself that you are consistently drunk from the hours of 7pm to 4am (9hours per day) which if we presume you (like most people) sleep an average of 8 hours per day means you are drunk for 9 of every 16 hours per day (ie 56% of the day). That is 'most' of the day which can represent 'most' of your posts.

I am not throwing around accusations. My allegations are based entirely on your own testimony.

You obviously missed the part where I said that i don't drink when I'm working.

Mr.Lizard

Terry wrote: »

You obviously missed the part where I said that i don't drink when I'm working.

I've seen you modding 7pm to 4am. eg tonight

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

I've seen you modding 7pm to 4am. eg tonight

Such knowledge for someone who is only here 3 months.

I'm actually on my annual 6 week leave from AH and am only banning the obvious.
You know, the ones who just continue to cross the line or those who just toe it and think they are immune to both moderation and banning.
You fall into the latter category.
Anyway. I'm off to bed now. 6 and a half hours sleep will do.
Goodnight.

Mr.Lizard

FYI everyone, he's currently extended my ban on *After Hours* to 1 month for posts written *here*. :rolleyes:

Beruthiel

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

It's not personal abuse. It's a statement of fact.

It was a cheap shot.

seamus

Your reply to Terry's ban PM and your admission here that you might as well "get your money's worth" is a direct admission of the intent of your initial statement. It wasn't intended as something light-hearted or a statement of fact, it was intended as abuse.

You shot yourself in the foot.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

He had already banned me at that at that point. I felt I might as well get my moneys-worth and have no desire for the ban to be resinded.

It still remains that the ban itself was unjust. As has been demonstrated Terry has banned me for nothing more than insulting his musical taste and for calling him a drunken poster (a statement that has been backed up by at least a dozen of his own personal admissions).

I would suggest that the people who run this site sort him out before people on AH realise what hypocrites you probably are.

I was going to ignore that part, but you're still insulting me via PM, so your ban is now permanent.

Mr.Lizard

seamus wrote: »

Your reply to Terry's ban PM and your admission here that you might as well "get your money's worth" is a direct admission of the intent of your initial statement. It wasn't intended as something light-hearted or a statement of fact, it was intended as abuse.

You shot yourself in the foot.

Not really. It doesn't change the fact that I had neither said nor demonstrated any 'intent' whatsover PRIOR to the ban. Terry made it personal himself and banned me unjustly. Anything that may have been said to him subsequent to the ban was merely an over-reaction on my part to his unjust behavior. It doesn't prove prior intent. I will apologise for that subsequent behavaior and let it be known I full accept any punishment due for that PM. However, even now he is repeatedly extending my ban (perm ban now I take it?) on ANOTHER FORUM for posts made HERE so if that is not an abuse of his position then I don't know what is?

I had fully expected other members of the clique to come rushing here to defend one of their own so I don't expect you to change your attitude to this mod or my situaation. I have made this thread to highlight an abuse of power on AH . I hope (if nothing more than to demonstration fairness on the part of the Admins) that you will leave this thread here (and open) so others can read about this incident, make up their own mind and post their views on the matter.

Thank you.

Asok

You were abusive and I don't accept for a second that you were trying to be anything else. Can you also explain why you pm'd other mods asking them to post here?

Mr.Lizard

Asok wrote: »

Can you also explain why you pm'd other mods asking them to post here?

Because I wanted myself and others to hear their views on the matter.

seamus

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

Not really. It doesn't change the fact that I had neither said nor demonstrated any 'intent' whatsover PRIOR to the ban.

I disagree. There may have some ambiguity which could have supported your case, had you not then gone on a tirade against Terry.

However, even now he is repeatedly extending my ban (perm ban now I take it?) on ANOTHER FORUM for posts made HERE so if that is not an abuse of his position then I don't know what is?

He's extending your ban based on the abusive PMs you keep sending him and the "campaign" you're now attempting to start up to get people to harass him.

I have made this thread to highlight an abuse of power on AH . I hope (if nothing more than to demonstration fairness on the part of the Admins) that you will leave this thread here (and open) so others can read about this incident, make up their own mind and post their views on the matter.

I'm afraid it's your attitude which stinks. If you'd tried to deal with this like a rational human being, this would have been a very different thread.

The only thing Terry did wrong is that he dealt with it himself when good practice would dictate that he reports it and asks someone else to deal with it. That doesn't mean the ban was unjust however.

Mr.Lizard

seamus wrote: »

I disagree. There may have some ambiguity which could have supported your case, had you not then gone on a tirade against Terry.

Again it doesn't change the fact that his ban was based on 'ambiguity'.

He's extending your ban based on the abusive PMs you keep sending him and the "campaign" you're now attempting to start up to get people to harass him.

I don't 'keep sending him' anything so please don't misrepresent me. I have never asked anyone to harass him either.

I'm afraid it's your attitude which stinks. If you'd tried to deal with this like a rational human being, this would have been a very different thread.

Somehow I doubt that very strongly. For instance can you show me examples of where Terry has been made accountable for his modding?

seamus

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

Again it doesn't change the fact that his ban was based on 'ambiguity'.

No, the intent of your post was ambiguous, the reason for the ban was not. Whether action was required is not in doubt. If Terry wasn't a mod, it would still have required action.
That is, your post was a dig at another poster - it wasn't a good-hearted chuckle or a gentle rib at a friend. It was a deliberate dig at another poster.

The "ambiguity" arises because you could have easily turned around and said, "Sorry about that, it wasn't meant to be abusive, it sounded funnier in my head". At which point Terry or ourselves could have said, "Ok, fair enough" and Terry could have looked at reducing the ban. Instead you went the other way and went full-on with the abuse, which confirms that the initial comment was not meant to be light-hearted.

I don't 'keep sending him' anything so please don't misrepresent me.

I'll admit that without timestamps, it's hard to confirm when PMs were sent, but nevertheless you have sent a great deal of abusive PMs to Terry in the last 12 hours.

I have never asked anyone to harass him either.

So you didn't PM a whole load of people and ask them to post here and contact Terry?

Somehow I doubt that very strongly. For instance can you show me examples of where Terry has been made accountable for his modding?

There was a thread here not so long ago where I told Terry that ban length was excessive and he duly agreed. Search and you'll find it.

Mr.Lizard

seamus wrote: »

No, the intent of your post was ambiguous, the reason for the ban was not. Whether action was required is not in doubt. If Terry wasn't a mod, it would still have required action.
That is, your post was a dig at another poster - it wasn't a good-hearted chuckle or a gentle rib at a friend. It was a deliberate dig at another poster.

The "ambiguity" arises because you could have easily turned around and said, "Sorry about that, it wasn't meant to be abusive, it sounded funnier in my head". At which point Terry or ourselves could have said, "Ok, fair enough" and Terry could have looked at reducing the ban. Instead you went the other way and went full-on with the abuse, which confirms that the initial comment was not meant to be light-hearted.

You're chasing your tail now. You're condoning it as acceptable behavior for a mod to ban someone for nothing more than an 'ambiguous' comment. Then for insult on top of injury you expect the poster to go crawling to the mod cap-in-hand begging for forgiveness? Either way It is irrelevant what happened or what was said after the banning began. My issue is that the initial 2 day ban itself was unjust.

I'll admit that without timestamps, it's hard to confirm when PMs were sent, but nevertheless you have sent a great deal of abusive PMs to Terry in the last 12 hours.

No I didn't. And even if I did that is all subsequent to the action I am complaining about. Furthermore I have no problem accepting any punishment meeted out for anything said by me subsequently

So you didn't PM a whole load of people and ask them to post here and contact Terry?

Absolutely I did (PM a load of people, that is). However, I never asked anyone to harass him.

Beruthiel

Spin it whatever way you want, you brought this on yourself.
Instead of letting the first two day ban go, you pushed it, harressed the Mod in question via PM and now seem surprised at the result.

seamus

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

You're chasing your tail now. You're condoning it as acceptable behavior for a mod to ban someone for nothing more than an 'ambiguous' comment.

Yes it is. If the meaning/tone of the comment isn't wholly clear, but it appears as abuse, then it's perfectly acceptabel to ban for it.

Then for insult on top of injury you expect the poster to go crawling to the mod cap-in-hand begging for forgiveness?

No, if the poster believes it to be unjust or a misunderstanding, we expect them to act rationally and civil and outline their side of the story.

However, I never asked anyone to harass him.

That's a matter of opinion.

Mr.Lizard

Beruthiel wrote: »

Spin it whatever way you want, you brought this on yourself.
Instead of letting the first two day ban go, you pushed it, harressed the Mod in question via PM and now seem surprised at the result.

I'm not surprised in the slightest. If you'd been paying attention you'd see that my only issue lies with the 2day ban in the first place. Anything I said to him subsequently in PM was fair grounds for a ban extension and even I accept that.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

I'm not surprised in the slightest. If you'd been paying attention you'd see that my only issue lies with the 2day ban in the first place. Anything I said to him in PM was fair grounds for a ban extension and even I accept that.

You insulted me, so I banned you. Had you said the same of anyone else, I still would have banned you.
You then sent me abusive PMs, so I extended the ban.

Now you may not have noticed it, but there is a report PM function.
All the Admins posting here have seen the abusive PMs you sent me, so there really is no point in you denying sending them (post #28).

I've taken away your ability to send me any more abusive PMs by putting you on my ignore list.

Mr.Lizard

Terry wrote: »

You insulted me, so I banned you. Had you said the same of anyone else, I still would have banned you.
You then sent me abusive PMs, so I extended the ban.

So you can frequently go around brazenly proclaiming you're posting drunk yet if anyone else makes reference to it it becomes a personal insult? You're really not making any sense here.

Now you may not have noticed it, but there is a report PM function.
All the Admins posting here have seen the abusive PMs you sent me, so there really is no point in you denying sending them (post #28).

I didn't deny sending them. I denied sending "a great deal" of them which is what the specific accusation laid to me in post#28 was.

I've taken away your ability to send me any more abusive PMs by putting you on my ignore list.

Ya poor mite. Wasted effort anyway as I had already said all I was going to say to you last night.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

So you can frequently go around brazenly proclaiming you're posting drunk yet if anyone else makes reference to it it becomes a personal insult? You're really not making any sense here.

You worded it in an insulting manner.
I don't mind people taking the piss out of me in a light hearted manner, but that's not what you were doing.

It was a malacious comment designed to provoke a reaction.
You just didn't get the reaction you were hoping for.

Having looked at your profile, I see you're a member of the AH messers user group. A group which has a picture of troll dolls as a logo.
A not very subtle way of telling people that you just use AH to troll.

You can tell your buddies there that I'll be keeping an eye out for them.

Ya poor mite. Wasted effort anyway as I had already said all I was going to say to you last night.

It was only 3 or 4 clicks.

Mr.Lizard

Terry wrote: »

You worded it in an insulting manner.
I don't mind people taking the piss out of me in a light hearted manner, but that's not what you were doing.

....."In your opinion". An opinion that I can confirm in this particular case is incorrect.

It was a malacious comment designed to provoke a reaction.
You just didn't get the reaction you were hoping for.

No it wasn't nor do I expect any reaction for what I write.

Having looked at your profile, I see you're a member of the AH messers user group. A group which has a picture of troll dolls as a logo.
A not very subtle way of telling people that you just use AH to troll.

Pfft, is that the best you can do? :rolleyes: I was invited to join that group and saw no reason not to avoid being sociable. I'd have joined the 'OAP's knitting' user group or 'friends of Mary Harney' usergroup if there were one and someone invited me to join. We don't all take our own image on boards as seriously as you appear to do.

I used AH (much like most) for joking around and generally take the piss out of current affairs topics & people in the public eye. I don't use it to troll or insult people personally.

You can tell your buddies there that I'll be keeping an eye out for them.

Tell them yourself. You're great at PM-ing people who just as soon not hear from you.

It was only 3 or 4 clicks.

Glad to hear it.

Terry

Mr.Lizard wrote: »

....."In your opinion". An opinion that I can confirm in this particular case is incorrect.

I don't believe you.

I used AH (much like most) for joking around and generally take the piss out of current affairs topics & people in the public eye. I don't use it to troll or insult people personally.

You're a low level troll. You have been from the start.

Tell them yourself. You're great at PM-ing people who just as soon not hear from you.

You're still trying to insult me.
I'm laughing because the only PMs I send are to people I ban (who generally do not want to read a PM telling them they are banned and would fit the description above), people who initiate PM conversations with me and the odd one to someone who may report a post that is deemed ok. In that case I just send an acknowledgement of their report and thank them for it.

I don't send unsolicited PMs of any type to anyone here. I definitely don't send PMs to people to try and start a campaign against someone else.

I'm done here now.
The ban stays. I see no valid reason to lift it.

seamus

This thread is done, I see no reason to overturn the ban.