Am I mad?

markopantelic

in thinking that dublin(and irelands) low population density contributes to poor public transport and higher price of transport? economies of scale and all that.

jhegarty

Contributes yes, explains no.

bladespin

No, I'd say you have a valid point but there are some other factors:

Terrible infrastructural choices made early in the development of the city/country (tight paddy :rolleyes:).
We love our cars (most do) so there will always be a preference in private transport, rattly buses and trains aren't going to attract me out of my comfy car, especially if the trip will actually cost me more (time and money).
Public transport that is determined to dictate transport patterns not adjust to them (night buses etc).
Rural living puts added stress on public transport, essential routes generate losses.

It would all be very easy if we were starting from scratch again

markopantelic

does anybody know the rural/urban ration in denmark for example. In Ireland its 40:60 I think.

also irelands location, if you are austria or switzerland for example you're a focal point to all over europe, here we are on a big island which by all accounts is underpopulated in comparison to other countries.

murphaph

Ireland has a very low pop. density and it's an indictment of the poor planning that abounds (in NI too) that even with only 5 million people you are never more than a few hundred metres from some sh!tty bungalow blot on the landscape.

Irish people need to cop on and realise that unless they are prepared to develop Dublin/Cork/Limerick/Galway/Waterford/Athlone (cue the protestations from those from cities/towns/villages/parishes/cross-roads not metioned above) into true cities and leave the countryside to farming and living there for those who work the land or allied trades, that we will NEVER have really good public infrastructure, of ANY sort-transport, medical, educational, industrial, social care etc. etc.

I was talking to a guy from rural Western Pomerania the other day. They have 2 buses a day each way from his village to the nearest rail head. I aked him was it a problem and he said "no, it's just a small willage, they can't have a service like Berlin, it's mostly retired people or people who work nearby, everyone else leaves and goes to Berlin or West Germany". And there you have it in its naked truth. Irish people just aren't ready to accept that rural living is not conducive to modern life unless you can afford to work from home and don't need to access essential services.

Zebra3

murphaph wrote: »

I was talking to a guy from rural Western Pomerania the other day. They have 2 buses a day each way from his village to the nearest rail head. I aked him was it a problem and he said "no, it's just a small willage, they can't have a service like Berlin, it's mostly retired people or people who work nearby, everyone else leaves and goes to Berlin or West Germany".

Their local GAA team is probably crap though.

ardmacha

The transport system is supposed to serve the people, rather than the people being realigned to suit the transport system. The dispersion of people is relevant, but is not excuse for the mismanagement of transport in this country.

And as for the notion that people living in rural parts cannot be educated, there are people living in the centre of Dublin, 5 minutes walk from all manners of education who refuse to take advantage of these services while people in outlying peninsulas make a much better effort.

munchkin_utd

The low population density doesnt help but the organisation of the services could be a bit more organised.

Firstly, even documenting private services would be a start.
In rural Cavan where I am from, there are actually a number of bus services ran by private operators BUT its next near impossible to get information on them. Fair enough, the pensioners might know. But how does someone in Dublin looking to go to some far flung village supposed to find out?

Local services CONNECTING to long distance services would be another move forward. Some places have it (Clones -> Monaghan linking to Dublin services) but every local service that runs infrequently should be timed to offer good connections.

Infrequent long distance services should offer guaranteed connections within reason. An example to hand is trying to get from Cavan to Derry by bus. You can go via Monaghan or Donegal but you could easily be stuck at the connection point for hours if a convient 10 min connection time just doesnt work out.

I could go on. Bus connections to long distance rail being another thing which just isnt coordinated.

A lack of services is definitely there but if it were a slight bit better organised you could offer more benefit/ journey options than are currently realisticly possible.

Anyhow.
I'm flying to Ireland tomorrow and am hiring a car for the week as I cant stick public transport in Ireland any more.
The quality of trains and busses is good. The frequency on main routes is very good. Its just if you want to make a trip apart from point to point from one centre to another, you may as well give up. The rental car though will do that for me without much chance of my luggage getting nicked from the boot (unlike on busses).