Cheapo DTT box from France - any use here?

dowtchaboy

Am off to France next week (for just a week, alas).
Would it be worth looking out for a cheapo DTT set-top box in some hypermarche? I.e. are they using same system as us?

emaherx

France uses MPEG2 for SD channels and MPEG 4 for HD channels.
The cheapest boxes will only do MPEG2 and will be marked with TNT.
MPEG 4 capable boxes will Be marked TNT HD only these will do here.

France uses a diffrent standard for Interactive services, so these boxes may pick up digital channels but not EPG or digital text.

slegs

Sagem is a good brand. TNT HD is the key...

watty

The cheapest TNT boxes rely on the Neotion CAM/Converter as only the pay Channels use MPEG4 for SD.

Make sure it's a box that has built in MPEG4. All HD boxes do.

STB

They are not the VERY same as us (ie you will not receive the fancy MHEG5 teletext on the french models)

This is the logo to look out for



Typically you are looking at €60 and up. Do not buy the Peekton 1650 which is flagged as Mpeg4 but isnt.

http://www.numerama.com/comparer-les-prix/Adaptateur-TNT/1/popularite,1752_MPEG+4+%28HD%29

Confirmed as working in Ireland

Sigmatek DVB-500
Sagem ITD 81 HD

a bientot

If you have a PC then you can opt for a USB hybrid stick that costs about 75 euros in FNAC.....ensure that it is HDTV -MPEG4....900 HD (Hauppage)
You might get it for less in Carrefour or Darty.......


By the way news from France yesterday suggests that pay digital terrestrial tv is in trouble.....as one of the kids channels Canal J has pulled out -not enough customers- and the frequency is now being re offered....

The CSA (the equivalent of our soon(?) to be Super BCI) has reassured the industry that there will not be an increase in the number of free channels: 18 + Canal 0.

As explained earlier if you are not interested in HD or in the pay channels then you can continue with MPEG2 (for France).

However, anyone buying a new tv will find it difficult to find an MPEG2 tv set.
They've all been offloaded to the U.K. and Ireland.

syboit

a bientot wrote: »

If you have a PC then you can opt for a USB hybrid stick that costs about 75 euros in FNAC.....ensure that it is HDTV -MPEG4....900 HD (Hauppage)
You might get it for less in Carrefour or Darty.......

well depending on the spec of the pc, stick wouldnt have to have mpge4, this can be done in software.

I use one of these with dvbviewer, http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=315276

GerardKeating

syboit wrote: »

well depending on the spec of the pc, stick wouldnt have to have mpge4, this can be done in software.

I use one of these with dvbviewer, http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=315276

What kind of a spec for PC would you recommand with that device?

syboit

GerardKeating wrote: »

What kind of a spec for PC would you recommand with that device?

I've had it running on core2duo's from 2.0ghz to quad core 2.4ghz, 2gb ram, pci-x gfx card (say 8500GT - this is at least a year old now). WindowsXP, dvbviewer, and a choice of h.264 codecs. Same spec is fine aswell for my dvb-s/s2 sat card and playing hidef .mkv files, bluray or hd-dvd from disc

watty

PCs are TERRIBLE for TV unless a very high end TV out card.

They have wrong refresh and wrong resolution.

A 99 Euro Lidl TV with 50 Euro dvd player and 100 Euro set box is far better picture than a PC costing €2000.


Virtually any USB DTT tuner supportd by 3rd party viewing apps and CoreAVE will receive Irish DTT.

From about 70 Euro. Or PlayTV USB TV dongle for PS3 (75 Euro?) now has PC drivers £54 in Argos up North?

syboit

watty wrote: »

PCs are TERRIBLE for TV unless a very high end TV out card.

They have wrong refresh and wrong resolution.

off topic, but are you referring to using pc monitor and not say a tv/projector ?

snaps

interesting this, i have a hauppage HVR 600 i think USB DVBT stick, ive tried it with dvb viewer and cannot clear the irish DTT channels, just get sound. I also have a dvbs card in my pc and dvb viewer will open the BBC HD channel ok. What am i doing wrong?

watty

You need CoreAVC or similar MPEG4 H.264 codec
Viewing application that can automatically use it or let you select it.

DVB viewer I think does work. BUT ONLY if you add/configure a suitable MPEG4 H.264 codec.

watty

syboit wrote: »

off topic, but are you referring to using pc monitor and not say a tv/projector ?

PC monitor. But many TV out connections on Laptops or TV out on graphics cards are poor.

Even some higher end cards with HDMI may convert to PC screen frame rate and back to 50Hz for HDMI. Or in some cases only do USA/Japan 60Hz HDMI.

The problem is the PC video timing and architecture is all derived from VGA, which is simply a progressive version of 640x480i NTSC.

Many laptop/graphic card S-Video and Composite outputs seem to only approximate to PAL with the PAL video (720x576i max for Digital) windowed in a 800x600 mode.

With HD using HDMI the issues are 25i native broadcast, 25/50p native files versus 60p graphics card even if you can set a true 1920x1080. The situation on newer cards seems a little improved.

Many Projectors are of course really for PC presentation and not for home cinema, or adapted USA home cinema models. You have to be very careful buying a projector. True native PAL refresh/Resolution models are nearly non-existent. For Non-PC use in Europe the only good bet for a projector is native 1920x1080 WS with high quality deinterlacer 25i/50p and HDMI.

zilog_jones

Using something like PowerStrip you can often get Windows to output 50Hz properly - I have successfully done this with the S-video out on a few PCs (Nvidia graphics cards, haven't tested with HD outputs yet). However even when allegedly outputting 720x576 to the TV-out (overscan and everything), when playing interlaced 576i video the fields are not reproduced properly (it's not wrong field order, just looks kinda frame deinterlaced even though it shouldn't be), so it must still be doing some pointless resizing.

mplayer/ffdshow's Yadif deinterlacer is very good IMO, especially for bob deinterlacing (e.g. 50i->50p)

watty

We have one very expesive PCI express graphics card that plays DVDs and Satellite card at same quality as sat box and DVB player.

It costs more, on its own, than TV + DVD player/recorder and FTA Motorised Sat system!

None of the other cards do it even as well as a 40 Euro DVD player or a 70 Euro sat kit.

syboit

watty wrote: »

PC monitor. But many TV out connections on Laptops or TV out on graphics cards are poor.

Even some higher end cards with HDMI may convert to PC screen frame rate and back to 50Hz for HDMI. Or in some cases only do USA/Japan 60Hz HDMI.

The problem is the PC video timing and architecture is all derived from VGA, which is simply a progressive version of 640x480i NTSC.

Many laptop/graphic card S-Video and Composite outputs seem to only approximate to PAL with the PAL video (720x576i max for Digital) windowed in a 800x600 mode.

With HD using HDMI the issues are 25i native broadcast, 25/50p native files versus 60p graphics card even if you can set a true 1920x1080. The situation on newer cards seems a little improved.

Many Projectors are of course really for PC presentation and not for home cinema, or adapted USA home cinema models. You have to be very careful buying a projector. True native PAL refresh/Resolution models are nearly non-existent. For Non-PC use in Europe the only good bet for a projector is native 1920x1080 WS with high quality deinterlacer 25i/50p and HDMI.

Yup, all true. PC to tv is never the best. Like many others around here, I use the pc as basically a dedicated mediabox (no games or any other stuff), only connected to a proper home cinema projector. I've seen people use 4:3 dell projectors that are for offices and not the home and the pic quality is terrible .
You mightnt have to spend the money on the pc, but projector yes.

BigMoose

I realise this is completely OT, but my 780G mb with onboard ATI HD3200 card (and I've had other ATI cards for less than €50) display HDMI perfectly. CCC gives 720p or 1080p @50hz or 1080i @25 and the picture looks fantastic on my LCD TV. I agree that at 60Hz it's almost unwatchable with the odd stutters etc. I have had major trouble with 1080p@50 (never with 720p@50) and used to use powerstripe to solve, but recent releases of CCC have handled 1080p@50 fine.

watty

For HDTV with a real decent 1920x1080 50p projector/TV playing DVD or BD the problems seem to be at an end.

For 1080i or 576i many PC deinterlacers, TVs and Projectors leave a lot to be desired. The ideal is a display that can natively write alternate lines or Progressive and strobe back light at 50Hz and not de-interlace in SW/HW at all, which is always a compromise.

I'd personally like a 1920x1200 as then you can use 1152 lines for doubled 576i regular SD. Or a 1080 screen with "over scan" option to crop 36 lines top & bottom, which is only 18 lines top & bottom of source, less than overscan of many CRTs and some LCD/Plasma SD sets.

Some TV sets / graphics cards can do these higher quality SD modes and decently do 1080i on the 1080p screen too.

snaps

watty wrote: »

You need CoreAVC or similar MPEG4 H.264 codec
Viewing application that can automatically use it or let you select it.

DVB viewer I think does work. BUT ONLY if you add/configure a suitable MPEG4 H.264 codec.

Watty your a star man, ive the DTT tests clearing on my laptop with a USB wintv HVR900 using the core avc codecs. Great this for PVRing now! I never thought my cheapo USB stick would work with mpeg4.

watty

I'd guess not on Windows 7 though

snaps

No windows 7! Infact all my machines i have, ive knocked back to XP! Thanks once again.

dowtchaboy

Just to let ya'all know - had a poke around in France last week in the hypermarkets.
Cheapest DTT box was about €25 and cheapest HD box was €50.
Tried out my USB stick DTT receiver but got nothing (except analogue) - maybe coverage did not extend to the rural seaside locations where I tried it.