Littering in Ireland

ForiegnNational

I'm sorry for the rather negative title, but I have to say as an outsider looking in, the general populace is absolutely ignorant of the beautiful country that we all live in.

Why am I raising this issue? (and I have nothing negative towards anybody, I am married into the country both heart and soul, but I'm just not from here!).

Can anybody explain to me why there is absolutely no self respect when it comes to rubbish and litter on the roads here. It's as if every passing car throws the contents of their bins out as they drive along.

I had family over, and taking them through the absolutely beautiful area of West Cork and Kerry, all I could see as a host was the human detritus spread along the road for mile after mile... WHY????

Fighting Irish

Every country has stupid people

peanuthead

Its not just Irish people who litter Ireland though...you're title is maybe limiting the blame there

Judgement Day

ForiegnNational wrote: »

I'm sorry for the rather negative title, but I have to say as an outsider looking in, the general populace is absolutely ignorant of the beautiful country that we all live in.

Why am I raising this issue? (and I have nothing negative towards anybody, I am married into the country both heart and soul, but I'm just not from here!).

Can anybody explain to me why there is absolutely no self respect when it comes to rubbish and litter on the roads here. It's as if every passing car throws the contents of their bins out as they drive along.

I had family over, and taking them through the absolutely beautiful area of West Cork and Kerry, all I could see as a host was the human detritus spread along the road for mile after mile... WHY????

The Irish don't hate Ireland that would involve expending energy, they are apathetic to it which means they ignore everything around them until it hits close to home. Have you seen the episode of the Simpsons where Springfield becomes so dirty that they load up the entire town on trucks and move it five miles up the road? Could say more but I won't as life is too short.....you want a clean, beautiful environment move abroad ... the Isle of Man is well looked after but too close to Calder Hall/Windscale/Sellafield for my liking.

Latchy

OP is only stating a fact that is common knowledge to most irish people and has being for many years , so no good blaming it on foreigners who may or may not have contributesd to the litter problem .It's being there for many years .

Judgement Day

peanuthead wrote: »

Its not just Irish people who litter Ireland though...you're title is maybe limiting the blame there

Yeah right, it's all those litter tourists who just travel to Ireland to dump their rubbish here. Next you'll be blaming 800 years of oppression!

professore

Latchy wrote: »

OP is only stating a fact that is common knowledge to most irish people and has being for many years , so no good blaming it on foreigners who may or may not have contributesd to the litter problem .It's being there for many years .

Yes when there was one foreigner per 100 square miles. The litter situation has improved a lot in recent years, it was much worse back in the 80's.

Latchy

professore wrote: »

Yes when there was one foreigner per 100 square miles. The litter situation has improved a lot in recent years, it was much worse back in the 80's.

Good to hear . I have seen in some british cities were there were similar litter problems , so they spent a lot of money tackling the probelm ,with cleaning starting in the early hrs and the difference was amazing .Not perfect but a hell of a difference as to what went before .

peanuthead

Judgement Day wrote: »

Yeah right, it's all those litter tourists who just travel to Ireland to dump their rubbish here. Next you'll be blaming 800 years of oppression!

because the only non-irish people in Ireland are tourists?

Oldtree

Was at a wedding in Enniskillen on saturday and the first thing i noticed was how clean it was, don't know why!

mike65

To get this back on topic and away from the usual sh1thawk nonsense, as bad as the OP thinks things are now its actually much cleaner, the days when every lay by was a tip head are now largely gone. That said if you spy a sign saying No Littering and look over the wall it'll prolly contain litter. There are fewer randomly abandoned cars as they seem to all end up in 'hot spots'. The dreaded striped plastic bag is now only spotted ocassionaly.

Some counties/local authorities seem worse than others, some sort of order must have been issued here in Waterford as all the approach roads are Spic and Span lately.

As to why the Irish throw litter down/go to some lengths to dump bags/furniture/cars, well good question. I put it down to some sort of collective unwillingness to take charge after independence and a post colonial attitude towards the seat of power even when elected freely by the people. Littering was getting one over on authourity and of course 'free'. Poor waste/sanitation infrastructure must also play a part.

Judgement Day

mike65 wrote: »

To get this back on topic and away from the usual sh1thawk nonsense, as bad as the OP thinks things are now its actually much cleaner, the days when every lay by was a tip head are now largely gone. That said if you spy a sign saying No Littering and look over the wall it'll prolly contain litter. There are fewer randomly abandoned cars as they seem to all end up in 'hot spots'. The dreaded striped plastic bag is now only spotted ocassionaly.

Some counties/local authorities seem worse than others, some sort of order must have been issued here in Waterford as all the approach roads are Spic and Span lately.

As to why the Irish throw litter down/go to some lengths to dump bags/furniture/cars, well good question. I put it down to some sort of collective unwillingness to take charge after independence and a post colonial attitude towards the seat of power even when elected freely by the people. Littering was getting one over on authourity and of course 'free'. Poor waste/sanitation infrastructure must also play a part.

See - I knew that 800 years of oppression would rear its ugly head!

Incidentally, we have plenty of litter and grafitti to spare over here in DG if you feel that something is missing in Waterford.

Macha

There is research that shows many Irish people see the environment as something "out there" and not belonging to them. In other words, Irish people don't take ownership of their environment and see it as something that someone else should look after.

Personally, I'd link this into a very strong trend in recent years against communality and sharing. For example, private cars are preferred over public transport and owning your own back garden is preferable to having a communal play area/park. (I know there are loads of other issues involved in housing/planning)

djpbarry

I've changed the title of the thread as it was unnecessarily provocative.

Now let's keep the discussion on-topic please, the topic being the general problem of litter in Ireland.

Oldtree

I passed a lay-by between Partry and Westport where a stone seat and table has been errected by local people with a view that is fantastic. Sadly there was the obligatory broken childs toy with a number of bags of rubbish. those days are not quite gone yet. I have no idea how to prevent this happening other than trying to instill a sence of civic pride in my children.

ForiegnNational

djpbarry wrote: »

I've changed the title of the thread as it was unnecessarily provocative.

Now let's keep the discussion on-topic please, the topic being the general problem of litter in Ireland.

I'm sorry for the provocative nature of the title, but it was on purpose. Am I the only person that finds the absolute disregard for the environment that is endemic here unacceptable?

Nowhere else in Europe have I met such consistently high levels of litter strewn throughout the country. I accept that towns and cities throughout Europe have litter problems, but only Ireland seems to accept the level of detritus on the country roads as acceptable.

The excuse "There are always ignorant people" is true of anywhere in Europe, why is it seemingly endemic here? There is SO much going for Ireland and it is the native Irish NOT the visitors who treat it so badly.

The one benefit of the death of the Tiger economy has been the almost 90% drop in breakfast litter (coffee cups, builders breakfast roll wrappers, lucozade and coke bottles) along the country lanes, but even then it is still more consistently noticeable than in any other country I have lived in or visited.

djpbarry

ForiegnNational wrote: »

...it is the native Irish NOT the visitors who treat it so badly.

I suppose you have something to back that up? If not, then I advise you to withdraw the remark and refrain from making similar claims.

Judgement Day

djpbarry wrote: »

I suppose you have something to back that up? If not, then I advise you to withdraw the remark and refrain from making similar claims.

In fairness I think that ForeignNational is correct unless you are suggesting that Ireland only became a littered country since we experienced immigration?

mike65

And its no accident that for decades any local environmental group you might find was nearly always formed by a foreigner appalled at the state of the countryside.

Here's a classic styled discovery

djpbarry

Judgement Day wrote: »

In fairness I think that ForeignNational is correct unless you are suggesting that Ireland only became a littered country since we experienced immigration?

So every Irish person is guilty of littering while every non-Irish person is not? Does litter not exist outside of Ireland?

robtri

[quote=ForiegnNational;60119082

Nowhere else in Europe have I met such consistently high levels of litter strewn throughout the country. I accept that towns and cities throughout Europe have litter problems, but only Ireland seems to accept the level of detritus on the country roads as acceptable.

.[/quote]
No Offence, but you mustn't have seen much of Europe, littering is a huge problem europe wide, the uk and scotland for example are heavily littered in parts as well and has very serious issues with fly tipping...
we are not alone on this and are improving all the time,

djpbarry wrote: »

So every Irish person is guilty of littering while every non-Irish person is not? Does litter not exist outside of Ireland?

agreed

netwhizkid

mike65 wrote: »

And its no accident that for decades any local environmental group you might find was nearly always formed by a foreigner appalled at the state of the countryside.

Here's a classic styled discovery

I came across a "heap" like this recently and the best part of was there was someone adding to the pile of a certain nomadic ethnic minority in Ireland who certain makes of vans. Best part was I caught his number plate and reported him to the council litter section and they would be following it up. It is typical once a small bit gets dumped it immediately attracts company straight away.

example a, a friend of mine parked a tractor and trailer in a rather stupid place over a weekend once only to come back on a Monday morning to find his trailer jammed with half the towns rubbish, it cost him a nice penny to dispose of and what he was saving in Diesel by not driving half way back across the county cost him 10x a the dump.

example b, a few years Kerry Co. Council with some political cajoling opened a free dump in my area as there was no Rubbish collection lorries or Recycling facilities in the area and a Rubbish amnesty was given to prevent people dumping in rivers and in heaps like the photo. Usually it was once every two years with local council workers manning it. Anyway it was opened once without supervision and not only was there cars but lorries from anything up to 100mls away. The council yard it was in was so filled that it took two or three lorries drawing fulltime to the dump almost a week to clear it as it was so abused by outsiders. Scavengers also came and when I visited it to throw off an old bed and other junk out of the garage it reminded me of some Calcutta scene. Needless to say we haven't had a rubbish amnesty since.

ForiegnNational

djpbarry wrote: »

I suppose you have something to back that up? If not, then I advise you to withdraw the remark and refrain from making similar claims.

I hardly think the following (within 1/2 a mile of my house), was brought over and dumped by foreigners...

I have traveled quite extensively throughout Europe and excluding urban areas, the sheer amount of fly tipping and illegal dumping (be honest, how many of you have seen black plastic bags of rubbish beside the roads recently), here shows a lack of respect for the countryside.

mike65

Just a word on bulging black sacks, the council litter pickers will often leave these in situ for later collection when they are having a tidying up blitz so you may be looking at items that are not dumped.

maniac101

ForiegnNational wrote: »

I hardly think the following (within 1/2 a mile of my house), was brought over and dumped by foreigners...

I think you're missing the point here. You see, when you post something like this....

The excuse "There are always ignorant people" is true of anywhere in Europe, why is it seemingly endemic here?

... you're inferring that Irish people are more ignorant than all others. When you make such an inference using a pseudonym like "ForeignNational" then this will appear to some (myself included) to be a trifle condecending, not to mention the "r" word. These kinds of comments have no place on the Green Issues forum, IMHO. Here are a few other comments from you that seem a little impolite, assuming you're not Irish and most of the readers here are:

the general populace is absolutely ignorant of the beautiful country that we all live in

every passing car throws the contents of their bins out as they drive along

Am I the only person that finds the absolute disregard for the environment that is endemic here unacceptable?

Sure, we have a problem with litter in Ireland. Unlike other countries I know of, we also large numbers of volunteers who take it upon themselves to do something about it by organising cleanups in their spare time. I would suggest that you might be better served by joining them in your locality than deliberately provoking the readers of a Green Issues forum.

ForiegnNational

maniac101 wrote: »

Unlike other countries I know of, we also large numbers of volunteers who take it upon themselves to do something about it by organising cleanups in their spare time. I would suggest that you might be better served by joining them in your locality than deliberately provoking the readers of a Green Issues forum.

My intention was only to foster debate amongst like-minded people, and I am one of those people "who take it upon themselves to do something about it by organising cleanups in their spare time". This is why it infuriates me so much that I just have to go back and back and clean up the same stretch of roadway every few weeks (to be honest, the original post was posted as a rant shortly after returning from such a foray).

It just infuriates me (and my Irish wife who has lived in the same locality for all her life), that with so much natural beauty going for Ireland, so many (not in any way all) people treat the countryside as a simple dumping ground for unwanted domestic and consumable waste.

Jim Martin

Derek Mooney's prog on Radio 1:

"4th September 2004
On this week's show Tom Cavanagh of The Irish Business against Litter Campaign exposes Ireland's cleanest and dirtiest cities and towns. "

Nay still be available on the "listen again" facility.

doolox

I know a few lanes around here that are blackspots for dumping.
Lynches Lane. Tandys Lane. Rugged Lane and Somerton Lane at the Strawberry beds between lower and upper Road.
It seems that if people come across a stretch of road with no houses or pedestrians on it they will take the opportunity to dump.
Also a bring bank in our local Tesco's had to be deactivated because of the amount of illegal stuff being dumped around it. The existing bottle banks in nearby sports complexes suffer the same problem, people dumping unlisted stuff beside the allowed glass etc......
There should be cameras beside these sites and the people caught should be fined heavily, but forgot, This is Ireland the people caught won't have a license or number plate so can't be easily traced and the powers that be won't bother when there are easier targets around...........

djpbarry

On the general subject of dumping...

I've just popped down to the basement in my building to empty the bins and low-and-behold, what do I see:

Not the first time I've seen something like this. How can anyone think that putting a set of drawers in a recycling bin is acceptable?

Kool&TheGang

Decided to take a stroll on Portmarnock beach last Sunday at around 8pm. Most of the day trippers were gone or heading home from a day out in the sunshine. You should have seen the state of the place - empty vodka bottles, beer cans, sandwich wrappers, nappies...unbelievable. Mission aborted.

Granted there were not enough bins to cope, but a little bit of dignity sees you placing your rubbish in a plastic bag and finding a home for it...

Morlar

I think that one part of the problem is the absense of any sense of civic pride - schools & parents & the media in general do not seem to instill any sense of civic/national pride or responsibility in younger people.

Another part of the problem would be the enforcement of the laws.

People do not have any respect for the laws on littering in Ireland. They think that the chances of getting caught are about minus .00001 percent and if you are caught there will be no meaningful deterrent. Also the fact that most councils will trip up over themselves to hire more traffic wardens in order to make money off motorists while litter piles up and blows around in the wind.

Another factor is rubbish collection which is not frequent enough and the lack of litterbins at places where large numbers of people are bound to congregate.