8% cut in fee's and allowances to GP's

RobFowl

Harney to cut health fees by up to 8%MARTIN WALL, Industry Correspondent

THE GOVERNMENT is to reduce fees paid to health service professionals by up to 8 per cent, Minister for Health Mary Harney announced last night.
The healthcare professionals concerned include GPs, dentists, optometrists, ophthalmologists and dispensing opticians who hold contracts with the Health Service Executive, as well as doctors and others who take smears under the national cervical screening programme, and psychiatrists who carry out work for mental health tribunals.
Ms Harney said she had not yet completed her deliberations in relation to fees paid to pharmacists.
The new fee reductions, which are being put in place under powers given to the Minister as part of legislation which also introduced the pension levy in February, will save the State an estimated €23 million in the remainder of this year and more than €38 million in a full year.
The Minister said she would be reducing by 8 per cent most fees and allowances paid to GPs in respect of medical card and GP visit card holders, the mother and infant care scheme and the primary childhood immunisation scheme.
She said these reductions would be expected to yield €20 million in the current year and €34 million in a full year.
However, in a move which is likely to lead to some controversy with doctors, the Government is to reduce again the fees paid for treating patients over 70 with a medical card, which were already cut back several months ago.
“In the case of medical card holders aged 70 years and over, the annual capitation fee is being reduced from €308.76 to €284.07. Prior to the budget in October 2008 the capitation fee for a person aged 70 and over holding a non-means-tested medical card was €640 per annum.
“This was reduced to €308.76 following Mr Eddie Sullivan’s report and the application of increases due under Towards 2016.
“However, given the deterioration in the economic situation since then, the Minister considers that the over-70s fee must be reduced by a further 8 per cent.
“The Minister has also decided to reduce by 8 per cent the special capitation payment of almost €974 per annum paid to GPs in respect of medical card holders aged 70 and over residing in private nursing homes.
“The new annual fee will be €899.83,” the Department of Health said.

RobFowl

The big thing here is she's cut the allowances ie the staff grants as well. This means that GP's have to pass on an 8% cut to their receptionists/nurses/managers or else take a more like 16% hit in terms of income (and remember this is gross income to include premises/heat/light/equipment not just take home pay).
This is the minister who wants to transfer more work into the community as well !!!!

tallaght01

I'd take 8% of your wages off you just for putting an apostrophe in "fees"

Vorsprung

That's clever.

Reduce payments to doctors for treating the over 70s, statistically the group in most need of healthcare. Also do this during a recession, when statistically people are most likely to suffer from ill-health.

Why don't the cut out all those clip board holders and remnants from the health boards who do nothing but play solitaire all day*!?!?!

*Source - Heard it on Joe Duffy one day

norrie rugger

bigjimthefirst wrote: »

That's clever.

Reduce payments to doctors for treating the over 70s, statistically the group in most need of healthcare. Also do this during a recession, when statistically people are most likely to suffer from ill-health.

Why don't the cut out all those clip board holders and remnants from the health boards who do nothing but play solitaire all day*!?!?!

*Source - Heard it on Joe Duffy one day

Why should doctor's be immune to a recession lads?

Loads of people are being hit badly. I doubt that I will get my bonus this year, pension levy on workers, job cuts.
TBH I see nothing wrong with professionals getting hit but, as usual, it is always the easy targets getting hit. Doctors, technicians, nurses etc. Where is the reduction in TD wages? Pay them per hour in session and see how many turn up for debate in future

greendom

tallaght01 wrote: »

I'd take 8% of your wages off you just for putting an apostrophe in "fees"

And another 8% for the one in GPs

RobFowl

greendom wrote: »

And another 8% for the one in GPs

Back to school for me

tallaght01

greendom wrote: »

And another 8% for the one in GPs

Doesn't an apostrophe suggest that there's a letter or letters missing between the two letters either side of the apostrophe? If so, GPs can have one, though I wouldn't use it.

Welcome to literacy 101, folks :P

norrie rugger

tallaght01 wrote: »

Doesn't an apostrophe suggest that there's a letter or letters missing between the two letters either side of the apostrophe? If so, GPs can have one, though I wouldn't use it.

Welcome to literacy 101, folks :P

Between illiteracy and illegibility, of writing, I am amazed that anyone survives a trip to the doctor

sam34

norrie rugger wrote: »

Why should doctor's be immune to a recession lads?

they are already being hit, by various levies, raising of PRSI threshold etc.

RobFowl

norrie rugger wrote: »

Why should doctor's be immune to a recession lads?

The main point is that staff allowances are being cut ie a 20k a year receptionist is being expected to take an 8% cut as is a 40k a year nurse. Also GPs fee are a gross figure which is used to pay all the overheads of running a practice. These are fixed and so an 8% cut is gross will equate to a 10-16% cut in actual income. That as well as the income levies, health suppliment, etc.
All this at a time when current policy is for GP's to take on a higher workload.!
No one minds taking their fair share of the pain but this is taking the p*ss :mad:

greendom

tallaght01 wrote: »

Doesn't an apostrophe suggest that there's a letter or letters missing between the two letters either side of the apostrophe? If so, GPs can have one, though I wouldn't use it.

Welcome to literacy 101, folks :P

It can be used for a missing letter as in wouldn't for example. There's no missing letter in GPs as it's an abbreviation and stands in it's own right. The s is being used to indicate plural not belonging to (genetive). The use of the apostrophe would be correct if we were talking about the GP's surgery for example.

Here endeth the lesson

greendom

norrie rugger wrote: »

Why should doctor's be immune to a recession lads?

Or from the apostrophe s disease

norrie rugger

greendom wrote: »

Or from the apostrophe s disease

stupid PS3 text prediction

Vorsprung

norrie rugger wrote: »

Why should doctor's be immune to a recession lads?

Loads of people are being hit badly. I doubt that I will get my bonus this year, pension levy on workers, job cuts.
TBH I see nothing wrong with professionals getting hit but, as usual, it is always the easy targets getting hit. Doctors, technicians, nurses etc. Where is the reduction in TD wages? Pay them per hour in session and see how many turn up for debate in future

I suppose I'm taking it more this way - cuts are being made in front line services and don't seem, in any real and acute way, affecting the management structures, which is where I feel the cuts should be made. I have no problem taking the same hit as everyone else in these tough times. I even think I heard at a recent IMO meeting that the IMO were the only union not to protest against the pension levy.

norrie rugger

bigjimthefirst wrote: »

I suppose I'm taking it more this way - cuts are being made in front line services and don't seem, in any real and acute way, affecting the management structures, which is where I feel the cuts should be made. I have no problem taking the same hit as everyone else in these tough times. I even think I heard at a recent IMO meeting that the IMO were the only union not to protest against the pension levy.

Well the above point will only get complete agreement, from me.

Triangle

The entire Health Service needs drastic overhaul. The stories coming from people who work there are incredible, some of the stuff beggers belief.

I'd love to give FG's dutch idea a chance to see if it could improve things in the health service. At this time i give up on the current setup entirely.

tallaght01

post above by bobbb deleted for trolling.

bleg

story with the fees for pharmacists?

SomeDose

bleg wrote: »

story with the fees for pharmacists?

As far as I know, Harney has postponed a decision for a couple of weeks. By happy coincidence, this is about the same time it'll take to decide whether or not she needs pharmacies to cooperate with any distribution of anti-virals should swine flu take hold. Funny that.

Ausone

SomeDose wrote: »

As far as I know, Harney has postponed a decision for a couple of weeks. By happy coincidence, this is about the same time it'll take to decide whether or not she needs pharmacies to cooperate with any distribution of anti-virals should swine flu take hold. Funny that.

From the www.dohc.ie website

"The Minister has not yet completed her deliberations in relation to pharmacists because of the range and complexity of the various dispensing fees, mark-ups and re-imbursements which fall to be examined. However, it is expected that decisions with regard to Pharmacists will be made within the next two weeks."

Complexity....? It ain't rocket science.

Does anyone actually think that pharmacies can be excluded from the distribution of anti-virals during an epidemic?

RobFowl

Well GP's are supposed to be the first point of contact and she f**ked us up the ass :mad:

AmcD

The HSE must be thanking their lucky stars for swine flu. I have never seen such rapid mobilisation into action. With all the flurry of hourly update faxes and emails, you could be forgiven for thinking that this virus originated in some slurry pit in Offaly.
Why can't they apply all this enthusiasm to their daily problems?

As usual all the radio ads tell people to contact their GP straight away. This time they even added "don't be shy about coming forward". Would those be the same Gps who took an 8% cut in GMS payments, staff subsidies, vaccination payments, antenatal care payments (oh and that 8% pension levy too on the GMS pension). Never mind, we will just continue to absorb anything the HSE throws at us.

Next month at our practice meeting I expect to find out what kind of paycuts we have to take to keep the practice afloat. We never had many private patients to subsidise the GMS patients, but now there are less and less private patients. Scary times.

bleg

SomeDose wrote: »

As far as I know, Harney has postponed a decision for a couple of weeks. By happy coincidence, this is about the same time it'll take to decide whether or not she needs pharmacies to cooperate with any distribution of anti-virals should swine flu take hold. Funny that.

great news for us looking for a pre reg too!:rolleyes:

nobody will be holding any interviews until this blows over. so much for her doing everything in her power to ensure a speedy resolution to the lack of pre reg places...

jeepers

bleg wrote: »

great news for us looking for a pre reg too!:rolleyes:

nobody will be holding any interviews until this blows over. so much for her doing everything in her power to ensure a speedy resolution to the lack of pre reg places...

This isn't going to blow over. The emergency bill legislates for adjustments (downwards) on an annual basis. The pharmacies that remain in business after this round of cuts will be too fearful of what the next round will bring to do anything that increases costs.

A locum used to be able to pick and choose their hours for good pay; now owner-pharmacists are working every hour god sends, only taking time-off when essential. Locum fees have dropped 30-40% and are still falling.

drzhivago

jeepers wrote: »

This isn't going to blow over. The emergency bill legislates for adjustments (downwards) on an annual basis. The pharmacies that remain in business after this round of cuts will be too fearful of what the next round will bring to do anything that increases costs.
.

You might b right
They did this in Canada a few years ago
Cut the fees 20% told everyone to get on with it

following year cut 10% and said same, but do you know what, it worked, they streamlined a lot

Difficult here with small practices though

jeepers

drzhivago wrote: »

You might b right
They did this in Canada a few years ago
Cut the fees 20% told everyone to get on with it

following year cut 10% and said same, but do you know what, it worked, they streamlined a lot

Difficult here with small practices though

I think percentages can be misleading; last the HSE tried to reduce the wholesale margin by 8%; this represented 30% of a typical community pharmacies income.

The HSE lost a court case on the issue but then suddenly a bill is passed that voids all health contracts and legislates for an 8% drop in fees. Pharmacies fear that there will be an 8% drop in fees and the wholesale margin will be reduced again equalling a 38% drop in income. Even pharmacists with a viable long-term future could go out of business in this scenario, funding/credit just isn't available. Hence no work for pre-reg's or locums.

DrIndy

It is really shocking how bad and how badly managed the entire healthcare system is!

Its stunning watching these issues pop up on this forum and it has been a real eye-opener for me.

The only people who actually win are the wealthy on high level VHI.

Broad

Not sure if even the wealthy on "high-level VHI" win - I suppose only win if they get really ill and manage to use the services they have paid an outrageous mount of money for, and don't die.

Sorry for bring stupid, but what is the "trolling" mentioned in this thread?

DrIndy

Trolling is someone posting something contentious for the sole purpose of getting other people on the forum enraged. Its antisocial to the forum overall so gets deleted and in exceptional and persistent circumstances a ban may be given.

We have a few members here who semi-troll but because it brings out healthy debate that a number of people on the forum enjoy engaging in - we are much more tolerant here of it than most of boards.

Ausone

Trolling is blasphemous libel for the internet!