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Ireland introducing blasphemy law - help

  • 29-04-2009 7:09am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 82 ✭✭ amadain17


    The Irish government is trying to introduce a blasphemy law that states : “A person who publishes or utters blasphemous matter shall be guilty of an offence and shall be liable upon conviction on indictment to a fine not exceeding €100,000.”
    “Blasphemous matter” is defined as matter “that is grossly abusive or insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion, thereby causing outrage among a substantial number of the adherents of that religion; and he or she intends, by the publication of the matter concerned, to cause such outrage.”

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/fro ... 99892.html

    Wonder if teaching evolution or indeed any science would be construed as blasphemy now. It seems to me that a substantial number of people believe that the world is 4500 years old, was created in 7 days and takes pride of place in the centre of the universe. Does teaching people that all of the above is wrong and scientifically proven so constitute blasphemy since this knowledge is "insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion" i.e. the creation myth?


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,255 ✭✭✭ getz


    amadain17 wrote: »
    The Irish government is trying to introduce a blasphemy law that states : “A person who publishes or utters blasphemous matter shall be guilty of an offence and shall be liable upon conviction on indictment to a fine not exceeding €100,000.”
    “Blasphemous matter” is defined as matter “that is grossly abusive or insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion, thereby causing outrage among a substantial number of the adherents of that religion; and he or she intends, by the publication of the matter concerned, to cause such outrage.”

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/fro ... 99892.html

    Wonder if teaching evolution or indeed any science would be construed as blasphemy now. It seems to me that a substantial number of people believe that the world is 4500 years old, was created in 7 days and takes pride of place in the centre of the universe. Does teaching people that all of the above is wrong and scientifically proven so constitute blasphemy since this knowledge is "insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion" i.e. the creation myth?
    blasphemy--written or spoken insult directed against, religious belief or sacred things with deliberate intent to outrage believers-i will start [;i hate the church of rome] the religiuos police in ireland will now pay me a visit


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 27 Jimmy Bennett


    What's this all about? I wouldn't be surprised if this was an old law that we were letting go, but introducing it in 2009? So does 'f*#k the pope' qualify?


  • Registered Users Posts: 82 ✭✭ amadain17


    I was hoping to rally support against this. Get people contacting their local imbecile (sorry typo I meant to type local representative politician) to let them know that there is an opposing voice to this. Is this the best forum for this?


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,292 Mod ✭✭✭✭ robindch


    amadain17 wrote: »
    Is this the best forum for this?
    The Atheists and Agnostic forum is probably a better bet:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=614


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 27 Jimmy Bennett


    I maintain that, within reason, we all have the right to offend whoever we like. Just because a group says they don't like what someone says, doen't mean they have the right to have it outlawed. I'd have no problem with legislation on 'incitement to hatred' but the word 'blasphemy' leaves a very sour taste. It's archaic and it seem to imply that what is blasphemed against is divine. I missed the oireachtas yeterday. Did anyone oppose it?

    What'll happen to Tommy Tiernan for example? Whether you like him or not, if a few catholics take issue with him should he now be criminalised for waht he says? This is Ireland, not Iran.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭ normar


    I wrote the following letter to Minister Dermot Ahern. I strongly urge every person (and not just athiests) who values freedom of speech as a vital part of democracy, to do the same. ..........Micnor.


    Dermot Ahern TD,
    Minister for Justice, Equality
    & Law Reform,

    Dear Minister,

    I am writing to appeal to you not to proceed with the intended legislation that would make the notion of Blasphemous Libel a criminal offence.

    I am making this appeal as an atheist. As such, I am a person who is secure in the knowledge that the rational by which I live my life, and the scientific knowledge that underpins my values and beliefs, will when publicly expressed, almost certainly be deemed by someone to be deeply offensive. This will put me firmly in the category of suspected criminal.

    The right to freedom of speech is an absolute essential in a free and healthy Democracy. I cannot accept that there can be any “sacred” areas where the right to freedom of speech is to be curtailed and diminished. A limited Freedom of Speech is no freedom at all but a mockery, for it puts one person above that of another.

    I gave up all belief in things superstitious and irrational as a young man. I wish to express to you my horror at the idea that someone who still adheres to beliefs which are utterly unverifiable, utterly untestable and which constitute an assault on my critical faculties, can use these “personal beliefs” as a basis to make me a criminal for expressing mine.

    This is especially so because I base my ideas on the rational, on facts which are verifiable, testable and which in the light of future knowledge can be amended to encompass a greater understanding of life. No religious belief will ever entertain this principle and nor can it, for I believe that greater understanding and knowledge is the death knell of superstition.

    As a consequence I fear that your proposed legislation will in time and soon at that, make criminals of those of us who defend the rational.

    .
    .
    .
    .
    .


  • Registered Users Posts: 76 ✭✭ Mr. Gruff


    If this gets passed, I'm emigrating.
    Who's with me?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭ O'Coonassa


    So does 'f*#k the pope' qualify?

    Why on Earth would you want the pope's babies?

    I think it does qualify if it's intended to offend.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 29 Free Speech IE


    Long-time lurker, first-time poster...

    I was absolutely gobsmacked when Ahern came out with his proposal re the blasphemous libel legislation. I am currently involved in trying to bring together like-minded people to fight the proposal. A group of us are hosting a public meeting in Waterford this Thursday, 21st May. Further meetings across the country are to follow. If anybody from the legal profession is interested in speaking at the Waterford event, please get in touch. The details are as follows:

    BLASPHEMY IS A VICTIMLESS CRIME

    PUBLIC MEETING

    VENUE: THE TOWER HOTEL, WATERFORD CITY
    DATE: THURSDAY 21st MAY
    TIME: 8 -10pm


    A public meeting will be held in The Tower Hotel, Waterford City, to oppose the Government’s proposed revival of the blasphemy laws.

    The meeting was planned on a new Irish website - http://blasphemy.ie - which also includes examples of material that could become illegal if the new law is passed.

    The Waterford meeting is the first of several to be held around the country, organised by Atheist Ireland, an advocacy group for an ethical and secular Ireland.

    Speakers will include:

    Michael Nugent, chair of Atheist Ireland and co-author of I Keano

    Barry Grant, Waterford resident and writer/videomaker.

    Other speakers to be confirmed.


    Local politicians will be invited, including Deputy Brendan Kenneally, Chairman of the Select Joint Committee for Justice, as will Deputy Brian O'Shea, also a member of said committee.

    “Most Irish people, regardless of their religious beliefs, do not want this law to be passed” said Barry Grant. “This meeting will give Waterford people an opportunity to voice their opinions.”

    Further information:

    [email protected]

    Campaign website: http://blasphemy.ie


  • Registered Users Posts: 518 ✭✭✭ imokyrok


    PUBLIC MEETING - BLASPHEMY IS A VICTIMLESS CRIME
    VENUE: WYNN’S HOTEL, ABBEY STREET, DUBLIN
    DATE: MONDAY 25th MAY TIME: 8-10pm

    The Dublin meeting is the second of several to be held around the country, organised by Atheist Ireland, an advocacy group for an ethical and secular Ireland. Speakers will include:
    Michael Nugent, chair of Atheist Ireland and co-author of the play I Keano
    Ian O’Doherty, columnist with Independent newspapers
    Other speakers to be confirmed.
    Local politicians will be invited.

    http://blasphemy.ie/


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 33 mrodub


    I just finished a video on the law i will make another part soon as I do not cover all its effects and i have not made all the arguments against i really just responded to some of the pro arguments but I need to present arguments of the against side now anyway let me know what you think.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FT66IfxOAfY


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,864 ✭✭✭ JuliusCaesar


    Anyone been arrested yet? ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 21 shannasaed


    This law is indeed blasphemy...as it has shown its ugly face in times past when the immoral majority want to oppose & exalt their own throne against Gods...
    therefore they have denied that God is their judge also... of such matters & of their laws.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,355 ✭✭✭ Belfast


    Blasphemy


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