Kids on school buses can now be tracked by parents thanks to GPS tickets.

Run_to_da_hills

In the UK a new satellite system has been launched which will allow parents and teachers to keep closer tabs on schoolchildren.

A special chip is fitted in a card which is then swiped by schoolchildren as they board and alight the school bus.

Parents will then be able to log on to a secure website to ensure their child has made it safely to school.

Iarnrod Eireann, Dublin Bus and Luas are rolling out a similar ticket that can be monitored by GPS when registered, its call the smart card :P

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1172531/Pupils-school-buses-tracked-parents-thanks-GPS-tickets.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/scienceandtechnology/technology/technologynews/5205662/Children-tracked-by-sat-nav-to-stop-bad-behaviour.html

Victor

O_o scary, the Daily Mail.

Run_to_da_hills, genuine concerns about privacy and personal safety are all well and good, but obsessing about them is a bit too much. Most of the time children are at greater risk of harm is when they are with either their (a) class mates or (b) parents and other family members and not when they are dealing with strangers.

Regarding privacy, you can still pay cash.

Run_to_da_hills

Victor wrote: »

O_o scary, the Daily Mail.

Run_to_da_hills, genuine concerns about privacy and personal safety are all well and good, but obsessing about them is a bit too much. Most of the time children are at greater risk of harm is when they are with either their (a) class mates or (b) parents and other family members and not when they are dealing with strangers.

Regarding privacy, you can still pay cash.

This still wont stop bullying, which is probably the worst fears of any kid. All the can do is round up those that have been travelling on the same bus.

Davy

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

This still wont stop bullying, which is probably the worst fears of any kid. All the can do is round up those that have been travelling on the same bus.

Wont stop them leaving the ticket on the seat, or sticking it with chewing gum to the seat

Run_to_da_hills

Davy wrote: »

Wont stop them leaving the ticket on the seat, or sticking it with chewing gum to the seat

I presume they will also have live cctv on these experimental busses. :P

amacachi

Did you banned from the Conspiracy Theories forum or something rtdh?

Run_to_da_hills

amacachi wrote: »

Did you banned from the Conspiracy Theories forum or something rtdh?

This isn't a conspiracy. :pac:

I could also see an advantage of having registered smart cards, it will sort out much of the thuggery on the red line.

godtabh

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

This isn't a conspiracy. :pac:

I could also see an advantage of having registered smart cards, it will sort out much of the thuggery on the red line.

How?

Cash fares are unlikely to be ever done away with and if whats said is true the people responcible dont bother paying any way.

But maybe there could be a shift in thinking from these people. They could get a registered smart card and make it easier for the gardai to deal with them. Oh wait this is the real world

Run_to_da_hills

kearnsr wrote: »

How?

Cash fares are unlikely to be ever done away with and if whats said is true the people responsible don't bother paying any way.

Luas will no doubt follow the London system and make cash an unattractive alternative, they will offer huge incentives for the public to move over to smart card, cash discounts, transferability between other transit networks etc. Who would want to pay cash if it is going to cost up 50% more.

kearnsr wrote: »

But maybe there could be a shift in thinking from these people. They could get a registered smart card and make it easier for the Gardai to deal with them. Oh wait this is the real world

It will keep them from hanging around ticket vending machines at Luas stops, registered smart cards can be topped up almost anywhere including on line and from your mobile.

bk

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Luas will no doubt follow the London system and make cash an unattractive alternative, they will offer huge incentives for the public to move over to smart card, cash discounts, transferability between other transit networks etc. Who would want to pay cash if it is going to cost up 50% more.

But you still will have unregistered smart cards, that can't be tracked, just like in London and on the Luas.

BTW in the bus scheme, the GPS isn't in the tickets, the GPS is in the bus, not at all different to the GPS tracking that many private bus companies and eventually DB will have.

What is extra here is that when the child uses their smart card to get on and off the bus, it registers that they have done so and allows the parents to see this and the buses current location.

Run_to_da_hills

bk wrote: »

But you still will have unregistered smart cards, that can't be tracked, just like in London and on the Luas..

Unregistered smartcards have their "disadvantages" the are no different to any current ticket if lost or stolen. For those living in London there is a poster campaign to get Londoners to register their cards. It depicts an oyster card in the shape of a safe with the caption, "Keep your money where its safe, register our Oyster card"

bk wrote: »

BTW in the bus scheme, the GPS isn't in the tickets, the GPS is in the bus, not at all different to the GPS tracking that many private bus companies and eventually DB will have..

All busses using WIFI or GPS tracking use GSM, the data is simply received from the touch pad is transmitted live through the network.

bk wrote: »

What is extra here is that when the child uses their smart card to get on and off the bus, it registers that they have done so and allows the parents to see this and the buses current location.

This same mapping service is currently being offered through Google using a standard 3G mobile phone.

godtabh

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Luas will no doubt follow the London system and make cash an unattractive alternative, they will offer huge incentives for the public to move over to smart card, cash discounts, transferability between other transit networks etc. Who would want to pay cash if it is going to cost up 50% more. It will keep them from hanging around ticket vending machines at Luas stops, registered smart cards can be topped up almost anywhere including on line and from your mobile.

How does a registered smart card keep them from hanging around a ticket machine?

London has a **** load of vending machines in each station. Vending machines wont be done away with

Run_to_da_hills

kearnsr wrote: »

How does a registered smart card keep them from hanging around a ticket machine?

London has a **** load of vending machines in each station. Vending machines wont be done away with

There will be a less dependence on them, people will not need the same "assistance" that is offered by these thugs. Have you seen the amount of CCTV that is pointing down at the TFL vending machines? They are so accurate that they can put faces to tickets that are being sold / topped up.

godtabh

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

There will be a less dependence on them, people will not need the same "assistance" that is offered by these thugs. Have you seen the amount of CCTV that is pointing down at the TFL vending machines? They are so accurate that they can put faces to tickets that are being sold / topped up.

Do you not understand the point that the luas is an open system and these people are not likely to buy ticekts be it prepaid registered or what ever.

CCTV is only of use if they actually get arrested

Run_to_da_hills

kearnsr wrote: »

Do you not understand the point that the luas is an open system and these people are not likely to buy ticekts be it prepaid registered or what ever.

Unfortunitally it is the judicial system that is to blame, these thugs are out on the streets again as soon as they are caught and convicted. These repeat offenders are well known to CIE and the Gardai.

KevR

bk wrote: »

But you still will have unregistered smart cards, that can't be tracked, just like in London and on the Luas.

I have an unregistered Oyster Card and at the ticket machines I can view a history of all the journeys I have made with my Oyster Card. I like this feature.

But it does show that they are storing these journey details and I'm sure, if they really wanted to, they could put a face on an unregistered Oyster Card user by going back and viewing CCTV footage of when they swiped through a ticket barrier.

With over 3 million people using just* the London Underground everyday; over a billion journeys per year, it's obviously not possible for them to go putting faces on everyone and storing it on file for no good reason. Add in the millions more that everyday use buses, the London Overground, DLR and national rail trains - and the thought of them monitoring people's movements doesn't seem possible.

Run_to_da_hills

KevR wrote: »

I have an unregistered Oyster Card and at the ticket machines I can view a history of all the journeys I have made with my Oyster Card. I like this feature.

But it does show that they are storing these journey details and I'm sure, if they really wanted to, they could put a face on an unregistered Oyster Card user by going back and viewing CCTV footage of when they swiped through a ticket barrier.

With over 3 million people using just* the London Underground everyday; over a billion journeys per year, it's obviously not possible for them to go putting faces on everyone and storing it on file for no good reason. Add in the millions more that everyday use buses, the London Overground, DLR and national rail trains - and the thought of them monitoring people's movements doesn't seem possible.

If there was another "atrocity" it would not take TFL and the Metropolitan Police much to chase up transit records through any given point in a given time. Space is cheap these days and it is not like as if they are storing CCTV on film roll. Its all digitalized now and stored on servers and can be accessed in seconds.

I had an issue with TFL over not tagging out of Liverpool st, (Yet the barriers let me through) I insisted in a print out, itemized details on a strip about a foot long went back for a year and included bus, rail and underground records timed to the second. All they have to do is type in those exact times into their CCTV system and they will get faces.

sdanseo

I can only imagine the worry this will cause when (not if) it breaks down. Some parent will log on, the GPS thingy will say the kids boarded at 9am but never got to school and chinese whispers wil ensue that the bus in in fact in a ditch, on fire, exploding. Imagine the trouble!

godtabh

KevR wrote: »

.

But it does show that they are storing these journey details

Dublin Bus (and I think Irish Rail) do this to for passenger data which can help form new routes, indicate where additonal services are required, travel patterns etc.

NewDubliner

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

In the UK a new satellite system has been launched which will allow parents and teachers to keep closer tabs on schoolchildren.

It's the bus that's tracked not the ticket. If the kid forgets to swipe the card on disembarkation, the system will show the kid is still on the bus.

Singapore allows employers access to data about use of transport smart cards, they can tell when an employee entered an underground station & cross check excuses for lateness....

Run_to_da_hills

NewDubliner wrote: »

It's the bus that's tracked not the ticket. If the kid forgets to swipe the card on disembarkation, the system will show the kid is still on the bus.....

I am aware of that, the weakness of the LRT bus service is that there is no need to tag out when disembarking. A flat rate is charged on all journeys. Maybe something that DB could look into. What is missed by the ETag will be picked up on CCTV monitors. All Enviro 400 & 500 series busses have at 7 CCTV cams on board two of which monitors the entrance / exit.

NewDubliner wrote: »

Singapore allows employers access to data about use of transport smart cards, they can tell when an employee entered an underground station & cross check excuses for lateness....

Something that we could probably expect here but I can imagine so called data protection would protect the employee from abuse as It could encourage the stalking of female employees.

NewDubliner

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

What is missed by the ETag will be picked up on CCTV monitors. All Enviro 400 & 500 series busses have at 7 CCTV cams on board two of which monitors the entrance / exit.

Ah yes, good old facial recognition. And, we could make the camera images accessible on the parents cellphones?

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Something that we could probably expect here but I can imagine so called data protection would protect the employee from abuse as It could encourage the stalking of female employees.

If the ticket is a subsidised travel pass, the employer may have rights on the data and it's OK as long as the data is not abused.

Run_to_da_hills

NewDubliner wrote: »

Ah yes, good old facial recognition. And, we could make the camera images accessible on the parents cellphones?

If the ticket is a subsidized travel pass, the employer may have rights on the data and it's OK as long as the data is not abused.

Just like many company cars that have GPS tagging employeese have no choice with the sstem even after hours, they will probably do the same for those availing of free transport on disability so that they can watch their movements and make sure that they are not screwing the system.

bk

NewDubliner wrote: »

If the ticket is a subsidised travel pass, the employer may have rights on the data and it's OK as long as the data is not abused.

Not under Irish Data Protection laws.

NewDubliner

bk wrote: »

Not under Irish Data Protection laws.

How so?