Road Positioning. Cat C

Waymaster

Did anyone who did or is doing Rigid truck lessons find positioning a problem? I can't get the positioning passing parked cars and other obstacles on narrow roads correct. Im not leaving enough room. If I concentrate specially on it its fine but when you've got other cars oncoming etc. to concentrate on I tend to drift too close.

sweetbubbly

Waymaster you are not alone! I teach on rigid and artic trucks, and its a very common problem on Cat C beginners.

From experience, I'd imagine you could be too preoccupied with staying within the central white line on the road. Its something I've had to drill into many a pupil. If you're on a wide road, and the cars are parked on your side, as long as the oncoming vehicles have enough space on their side don't be afraid to take a bit of their side of the road, cars will naturally steer away from a truck. The biggest problem is knowing when to take some of "their" road, and when not to be a bully. There's a fine line between what I call "gentle persuasion" and downright bullying!

Where are you doing your test? If I know the area I might be able to give you an example of what roads its appropiate to do this.

The other thing that maybe is causing the problem is that you're probably driving a car a little while now and are very familiar with the width of it, this could also be sucking you back into the parked cars. From what you've said I'd imagine you've had no more than 2/3 lessons. So you're not yet used to using your mirrors confidently. So I wouldn't worry about it too much, it will become natural to you as time goes on. Once you are able to use your mirrors more, staying out it will be easy. The other thing you could do is when you're in your car try and imagine its about 2ft wider than it actually is, that should help with the staying out a bit more. Practice makes perfect. If you want any advice, please feel free to PM me.

Waymaster

Exactly what im told. Im trying to stay within the white line when its just not possible tp do safely. Its a mental thing I suppose from driving cars. Yes I've been trying the leaving extra clearance and it works great in conjunction with regularly checking the left mirror. Nice reply thanks!

Wishbone Ash

For those unaccustomed to driving large vehicles, their higher seating position can give the impression that they are too far over to the other side but frequently there is plenty of room for oncoming traffic.

As sweetbubbly has said, gentle persuasion is usually needed as many car drivers seem to assume that they are entitled to 50% of the road despite being much smaller.

Zith

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

As sweetbubbly has said, gentle persuasion is usually needed as many car drivers seem to assume that they are entitled to 50% of the road despite being much smaller.

Are there extra rules of the road for cat C? (geniune question, have never seen any) Always thought you have to try keep as left as possible and only cross a white line as a last resort? Surely if the situation warrants crossing the line then you should yield to oncoming traffic as the obstruction is on your side of the road, rather than persuading traffic to move over on their own side of the road?

Fair enough there has to be some leeway in all rules but in my mind being entitled to 50% of the road is justified because the rules tell everyone to stick to their own side and yield if you can't.

Waymaster

Well thats where gentle persuasion and bullying comes into it. Unfortunately on a deserted city street a truck can sometimes not even fit into 50% of the road.

Now if you added parked cars to the equation and sat your ground till oncoming cars passed.

1. It would annoy impatient car drivers behind you if you have to stop every few seconds (who are usually impatient as it is)

2. You could easily cause an accident from moving in and out between blockages by hitting something with your tail swing etc. The simple matter is trucks are to big and dangerous to be swerving in and out past parked cars.

3. You would make little or no progress around cities.

If the gap is too tight and you risk being a bully to other drivers you stop but if you can borrow:D a bit of the road without inconvenience then go for it.

Wishbone Ash

Zith wrote: »

Are there extra rules of the road for cat C? (geniune question, have never seen any) Always thought you have to try keep as left as possible and only cross a white line as a last resort?

As Waymaster has said, if one were to drive a truck in the manner you describe, one wouldn't get anywhere and fail a test on 'progress'.

Many roads have a camber leaning towards the nearside. Therefore a high sided vehicle will easily collide with all sorts of obstacles such posts, poles, lights, bus-stops etc. which are poorly placed especially in urban settings. (Dublin Bus have a habit of placing bus stop signs at the very edge of footpaths which must be frustrating for their drivers when bringing a bus to a stop there).

Even in rural areas many roads have ESB/Eircom poles and overhanging tree branches which can damage rearview mirrors. Many roads have soft margins or ditches which make it dangerous to utilise the edge of the road with a heavy vehicle.

For these reasons, it's often necessary to move out over the centre line. Except in exceptional circumstances, no one is expecting car drivers to stop but merely move over to the edge of their side of the road and allow both drivers to get on with it.

(I'm not sure if it's still the case but when I did the truck tests, it was an automatic failure to allow a side mirror to collide with any obstacle.)

Zith wrote:

in my mind being entitled to 50% of the road is justified because the rules tell everyone to stick to their own side and yield if you can't.

The ROTR is not a legal document but merely a lay-man's guide to courteous and safe driving and aimed generally at car drivers.

I could be pedantic and argue that a moped and bicycle are also entitled to 50% of roadspace but I'm sure you would not be impressed if impeded behind one because they insisted on utilising more space.

In certain situations it is appropriate for a driver of a small vehicle to yield to a larger vehicle even though the driver of the smaller vehicle may have right of way. An example would be meeting a heavily laden truck travelling uphill on a narrow road. Suppose the truck driver has a parked vehicle on his side of the road. It is much easier for the car travelling downhill to slow up for a few seconds and allow the truck to maintain momentum rather than having to bring it to a stop and start of through the many gears all over again. The other driver can more easily resume his journey and catch up on the few seconds lost.

A bit of common courtesy and everyone's a winner!

Zith

Thanks for the replies. Interesting to hear the different perspective. I agree completely on the common courtesy. Unfortunately not every driver (big or small vehicle) views it like that.