Advice needed - tricky situation

happythirties

The crux of the problem is this: I'm a thirtysomething man who's been going out with a fantastic woman for the past two years. She's the woman for me - beautiful, great personality, caring, funny. She's a single mother with two kids from two previous relationships, which might bother some people but to me it doesn't matter, people might be quick to judge her based on her situation but I know the beautiful person that she is.
We see each other as often as we can, however it can be difficult at times. We don't live together, she has her house, i have mine. During the week she has her two kids, which i get on great with, but a lot of her time is obviously consumed with the school runs and all the usual things that mammies do to give their kids the best chance at life. I do my best to help whenever i can with helping her whenever i can with her kids, but i work a job during the week that involves working shifts which means that i try to catch up on my sleep away from her house because as we all know kids by nature won't be able to keep quiet... At the weekends the two kids go to their dad's, and my girlfriend goes to work for the weekend, working two twelve-hour shifts to pay her bills. We've been able to make the relationship work to some degree over the last two years, but i find that it's getting getting harder as the relationship gets more serious. It's like as if we can get to a certain point and then it gets hard to take it to the next level because of the complications in the relationship.
For example, we had planned to go out on Saturday night, given the fact that she had her first weekend off from work in ages and the kids were going to be at their dad's. We were going to make a weekend of it and were looking forward to it. I made casual plans to meet up with some friends and we were all going to have a great saturday night. Then her ex declared that he was going on a stag night on saturday and that was the end of our planned weekend, as she would have to keep her younger child for the weekend. She was gutted, as was I, but not surprised as this wasn't the first time her ex had pulled a stunt like that. Last thursday she then asked me would there be any chance if i would babysit her kid on the afforementioned saturday night so she could go out with the girls and enjoy her rare weekend night off. I refused, it didn't feel right to me that i would end up being at home on my own while she would be out with friends, and i wanted to meet up and catch up with my friends that i had arranged to meet up with that night, a lot of them i hadn't seen in months, while she sees her friends every week at work and during the week. However, i didn't have the heart to tell her at the time that i planned on going out on Saturday night. I only told her on Saturday afternoon, needless to say she wasn't impressed, and i can't blame her really, i didn't handle the situation very well, i let it develop into a real mess.
So i went out and enjoyed catching up with friends, she stayed at home on her own. I feel for her because she keeps getting used as a doormat by her ex, who seems to call the shots as regards when he takes his own son and everything has to suit him, he's only keep the kid for as long as necessary, not a minute longer.
Now we seem to have taken a step backwards today, she's told me by text that she'll be reluctant to ask me to do anything in future, which i told her was ridiculous as i'm more than willing to help with most things and want to make this relationship work, but i've always told her that i'm reluctant to get involved with dealing with the kid's dad's, that's her area as far as i'm concerned. I also don't want to lose touch with my friends, i'd like to meet up with them socially from time to time. A lot of them have moved in recent times to get jobs or go back to college and it's nice from time to time to all meet up and catch up. I'm not a big drinker, i don't go out much and most of the time would prefer to spend the night in with my girlfriend. But i guess this weekend everything clashed in a big way, and now we've taken another backward step.

Anybody got any opinions? they'd be greatly appreciated... thanks

Latchy

OP what's obious from reading your post is that more than anything else, it's your girlfriends children which is the issue and while some men might have offered to look after them ,the fact that you had plans yourself tells me you were right not to look after them on that particular night .If it had being an emergency type situation, then I am sure you ,girlfriend ( and the kids dad) would have gladly put the kids first .I think your girlfriend has to accept that as far as the kids are concerend ,you are not pig in the middle and you do have a life outside her .You could tell her that yes , you will look after the kids sometimes but not always on her terms and at short notice .

That_Guy

Wow you both seem to really live really busy lives.

If you want to spend a night together could you just organise a babysitter for a couple of hours. Sounds like you could both use a bit of time off to let off some steam.

After two years you've managed to make this relationship work so there's no reason that it shouldn't continue. It will be difficult with jobs and kids etc but it's close to the end of the school year now so you'll be able to spend some time with her and the kids during the summer months and have a little break.

Best of luck anyway.

Bottle_of_Smoke

She could have got a babysitter.

Though more importantly you both could have got one and went with your weekend as planned.

She seems a bit illogical. Wants you to cancel going out with friends to look after HER kids while SHE goes out.

Ask her to defend that. You were right to refuse.

smellslikeshoes

As has been mentioned above a babysitter would have been the best option.
To be honest though I am on her side here.

she had her first weekend off from work in ages

She asked you to look after her kids for one night, she spends the whole week looking after kids and the whole weekend working 12 hour days and in your own words she hasn't had a weekend off work in ages.

They are not your kids but you obviously care about this woman and it wouldn't have been too big a deal for you to reschedule going out with your friends so she could have her rare night out.

cafecolour

The kids should unarguably be first priority. It sounds like the dad is an ass towards his own kids, which sucks for her, but she needs to do her best to minimize their suffering because of it (and it sounds like she does).

You aren't going to make their father be a better dad. You CAN step up and be more of a father figure for kids - it's what dating a woman with kids entails. Though that does not necessarily mean watching the kids for her while she goes out - you'd have to be pretty established to be on that level.

But, yes, there are professional babysitters. Don't count on the ex, arrange one for a weekday night you are both free, and have proper dates.

Pub07

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

As has been mentioned above a babysitter would have been the best option.
To be honest though I am on her side here.

She asked you to look after her kids for one night, she spends the whole week looking after kids and the whole weekend working 12 hour days and in your own words she hasn't had a weekend off work in ages.

They are not your kids but you obviously care about this woman and it wouldn't have been too big a deal for you to reschedule going out with your friends so she could have her rare night out.

Eh, the OP said he hadn't met some of these friends in months. It's not a matter of simply rescheduling, when you get a bit older and you've gone your separate ways and some friends are living in different parts of the country it often happens that circumstances dictate that you will see them maybe twice or three times a year, if even that. It would be ridiculous for OP to pass up the chance to meet his friends that he doesn't see very often to mind his gf's kids while she goes on a night out with her friends that she sees every day.

Shivers26

I agree with what others have said - best to have a babysitter on standby. It just means that nights out can be guaranteed and there are always plenty of teenagers looking to make some cash - surely she has some neighbour or relative who would be interested.

Just from the perspective of an ex-single mother - you are going to find it difficult to move your relationship forward if you dont make an effort with the kids. Im not saying you have to be a free babysitting service but you seem somewhat apathetic when referring to them. What if you want to move in with their mother at some point? How do you get on with them generally? Just something to think about.

Oh The Humanity

Then her ex declared that he was going on a stag night on saturday and that was the end of our planned weekend

She should have run amok on him there and then and not allowed this. Too short notice, outrageous and the answer to him should have been a big fat NO WAY.

The ex doesn't get to dictate what goes on at weekends. The arrangement is he has them at weekends. If he wants to go on some last minute stag then HE finds a babysitter.

I wouldn't stand for this. Your girlfriend can be a martyr all she likes but she neednt expect you to start being one. They are not your kids. Yes you love her but that doesn't mean they are now your problem. Its nice if you want to pitch in but its totally voluntary on your behalf and she should be grateful for any help you do give instead of trying to use you as a stopgap babysitter when she hasn't the nous to stand up to the ex.

If she cant stand up to her ex then I would caution you. This will be how its going to be. The kids dictating everything you do and the ex suddenly springing last minute no shows on the two of you. Just as you get serious too, he sounds like a sh1t stirrer to me.

Tell her very clearly, if he wants to go out at weekends HE finds the baby sitter. The ex is manipulating things and he should not be allowed. Boundaries have to be set very clearly here going forward.

Aside from the fact that I can't for the life of me understand why you can't organise a babysitter between the two of you, if this really is the woman for you then her children AND her ex will be part of your life so you'll have to cope with them ... if she's the woman for you then these will be your (step) children too, this is your family. I'm wondering if it's hard to get to the next level because one (or both) of you can't fathom this.

You seem like a good guy but you can't see the difference between a night out with her friends and seeing them at work and you clearly underestimated what this meant to her.

You could have sacrificed or re-scheduled your "casual" arrangements and made a HUGE difference to her but you said "no" and, as is the case with most people, it will be difficult for her to ask for something again.

And anyone saying that this is her own fault for not standing up to her ex presumably has no experience of managing child access rights with utter asses.

legend73

OP you said it yourself brother, you made a mess of it. In the grand scheme you can get out more often then her. If you were in a committed relationship you would have stepped up for ONE night to allow her to have some fun. You missed out on some big points and some passionate stuff when she came home to show you her gratitude.

I know you felt a bit odd about it, but you weren't being a door mat you were being a hero, but guess what now youre a zero! Next Public Holiday organise a baby sitter and take her out for a special day.

Lollipops23

Much as i am for a step dad bonding with the kids, it's not his place to be the on call babysitter. he had made plans to see his friends and didn't want to cancel at the drop of a hat.
it seems to me that the girlfriend was taking her annoyance and anger at their dad letting everyone down out on the OP.
OP i'm not sure what to do here, but it seems like it may be time to discuss the nature and future of the relationship; you don't want her feeling like she can't ask for a favour but you don't to be treated like the babysitter either.

Pub07

Deleted User wrote: »

You seem like a good guy but you can't see the difference between a night out with her friends and seeing them at work and you clearly underestimated what this meant to her.

You could have sacrificed or re-scheduled your "casual" arrangements and made a HUGE difference to her but you said "no" and, as is the case with most people, it will be difficult for her to ask for something again.

And anyone saying that this is her own fault for not standing up to her ex presumably has no experience of managing child access rights with utter asses.

What? Why should OP sit in and mind her kids when he is supposed to be meeting some friends that he hasn't seen in months. That is just ridiculous. If he was seeing these friends every weekend it'd be reasonable to stay and mind in and mind the kids for her for a night but when it comes to friends you that you only see a couple of times a year it's not reasonable. I have some friends I see twice a year, if that, and it would be completely out of the question for me to change plans at the last minute and sit in and mind my gf's kids (if she had any ) while she went off out with her friends from work.

bluecell99

Its not up to the original poster to look after other people's children.Sounds as if he has been more than accommodating up to now and he is piggy in the middle.Different scenario if you were married and you adopted them but you are not.The girlfriend is gonna have to tackle the father's and stop being treated like a doormat by thnem.Otherwise time for the legal eagles to become involved if he is playing silly beggars.

Seems also that work ,work,work is getting the way of everything and you dont get much time for yourselves.You gotta look at this big time and make changes or hard to see how the relationship can progress.

Pub07

Pub07 wrote: »

Why should OP sit in and mind her kids when he is supposed to be meeting some friends that he hasn't seen in months. That is just ridiculous.

Because that wasn't the case originally? Because THEY "had planned to go out on the Saturday night, given the fact that she had her first weekend off from work in ages"? Because he "made casual plans to meet up with some friends"? Because "she was gutted"? Because he loves her and "could have let her go out with the girls and enjoy her rare weekend night off"?

Anyway, I'm not necessarily saying he should have done it, but he could have. It's not possible (for us) to measure who's night out was more important (but understandably posters are falling on one side or the other) but even the OP knows he let her down ... he didn't have the heart (i.e. "balls") to tell her until the last possible moment he was going out anyway. First it was all casual but NOW it's all ... friends "i hadn't seen in months". No skin off our noses but, like the other poster said, he could have been a "hero" but now he's a "zero".

And how some people are getting from her asking this HUGE favour to him being an on-call babysitter expected to look after other people's kids is beyond me.

In any case, the more I read his post the more I think that one night really isn't the problem, particularly if the possibility of him minding the kids while she goes out doesn't "feel right" to him. Maybe he needs to explain to her exacly what the "most things" he's willing to help with is, so she knows what she can realistically expect from him.

Oh The Humanity

And anyone saying that this is her own fault for not standing up to her ex presumably has no experience of managing child access rights with utter asses.

None thankfully, I wouldn't wish it on anyone either.

BUT OP is not/was not married to a$$hole ex, its not his fault, not his problem, not his cross to bear. The woman needs to understand this, she can't be flipping into sulks because OP refuses to plug the gaps caused by the ex.

The problem here IS the ex. OP said he calls the shots and she keeps getting used as a doormat. Understandably the woman is frustrated at the situation but she cant expect OP to now start dancing to the ex'es tune too. Its bad enough one person being beholden to his nonsense but it doesn't help matters if OP lies down and dies with the Mother either.

What sort of a signal would it send out if OP was to suddenly hop, skip and jump on every whimsey and caprice of the ex....? It would mean that OP has become nothing more than a glorified babysitter.

Its bad enough that she has to put up with it but shes their Mother and threw in her lot with him at some stage unfortunately kids came from that and the clock cannot be turned back. But there is no reason OP should have to suffer too.

Nickibaby*

OP I can see why your girlfriend is annoyed at you! Fair enough it is not your place to look after your girlfriends children BUT you said that you would and at the last second cancelled - not very nice of you.

You are off at weekends while she is at work, I am sure you meet up with your friends then. If she is somebody you care about I think you should have helped her out, especially since she hasn't been out in months.

On other occassions yous really should try get a babysitter so the two of you can go out together.

If you are going to be part of her life, you are inevitably part of her childrens lives.

Oh The Humanity

Nickibaby* wrote: »

OP I can see why your girlfriend is annoyed at you! Fair enough it is not your place to look after your girlfriends children BUT you said that you would and at the last second cancelled - not very nice of you.

No, he didn't promise to look after the kids. Read it again.

Last thursday she then asked me would there be any chance if i would babysit her kid on the afforementioned saturday night so she could go out with the girls and enjoy her rare weekend night off. I refused

happythirties

wow, i've really opened up a hornet's nest with this one...!

Thanks very much for all your advice and opinions guys and gals. I have to clear up one or two things up that were not made clear in the original post:

1. I don't have a problem babysitting her kids while she goes out, i've done it a few times. But i don't want it to become too regular an occurance either.

2. I said it was her first weekend off work in a good while, not that she hasn't been able to go out pubbing and clubbing during that time, which she has been doing, mostly with me and various friends of ours. We'd often even go out on a saturday night after she finished her 12 hour shift, not because i insist that she goes out on saturday night, but becuase she likes going out at the weekends and wants to go out. needless to say we wouldn't go too mental though with her having work on sunday morning though! And when i said she sees her friends every day i meant that she sees some friends on a daily basis, more friends and work colleagues on a weekly basis etc etc like us all.

3. The situation with her younger son is a bit tricky, she molly-coddles him a good bit because she feels guilty about the break-up with her ex regarding how it might impact on the child's happiness and wellbeing (she's told me this). She doesn't really want to change this, and being the soft and caring person she is she likes giving him loads of attention. As a consequence, at the moment, the child is over-dependent on her for attention and affection. And as a consequence, using a babysitter that the child isn't familair with might be problematic. My girlfriend's mother would normally oblige, but she's away for two weeks. She's been brilliant.

I just really want to know was i out of order telling her that i wouldn't babysit for her and then turn around and go out myself with my friends that i hadn't seen in a while?

Thanks for ye're help, i couldn't fit everthing into the original post mostly due to it being a complicated situation and i was tired :P

Pub07

Deleted User wrote: »

Because that wasn't the case originally? Because THEY "had planned to go out on the Saturday night, given the fact that she had her first weekend off from work in ages"? Because he "made casual plans to meet up with some friends"? Because "she was gutted"? Because he loves her and "could have let her go out with the girls and enjoy her rare weekend night off"?

They had planned to go out to where they would be meeting friends of the OP who he rarely sees. Is what she wants supposed to be the priority every single time in their relationship no matter how unreasonable? He'd have to be a right doormat to put her every whim ahead of his own plans. Fact is, his night out was much more important as he was seeing friends he rarely sees, whereas as she was meeting up with work pals. I know myself if I missed a night out with one of my friends from the other end of the country or who live abroad, it could be 6 months to a year before I see them again and I presume thats the same for other people who have friends living far away.

Anyway, I'm not necessarily saying he should have done it, but he could have. It's not possible (for us) to measure who's night out was more important (but understandably posters are falling on one side or the other) but even the OP knows he let her down ... he didn't have the heart (i.e. "balls") to tell her until the last possible moment he was going out anyway. First it was all casual but NOW it's all ... friends "i hadn't seen in months". No skin off our noses but, like the other poster said, he could have been a "hero" but now he's a "zero".

Where did he say he left it til last possible moment to tell her? He said she asked him and he refused. He didn't let her down, she was making a very unreasonable request and it was a bit much for her to be getting her knickers in a twist when he said no. If he had've said yes to her he wouldn't have been a 'hero' he would have been a doormat, passing up his plans to meet friends he rarely sees and sitting in minding her kids (which are her responsibility) like a twat while while she's off on the lock.

In any case, the more I read his post the more I think that one night really isn't the problem, particularly if the possibility of him minding the kids while she goes out doesn't "feel right" to him. Maybe he needs to explain to her exacly what the "most things" he's willing to help with is, so she knows what she can realistically expect from him.

Your right, it probably isn't just this one night that is the problem. If she regularly gets bitchy cos he won't let himself be pussywhipped into a fool she might have to find a loser who will put up with her unreasonable requests. Although imo this incident was a once off case of wires getting crossed and there's no big problem.

Pub07

So I see OP says it isn't the case that she rarely goes out. She's often gone out in the recent past, that makes her request even more unreasonable.

Duras

happythirties wrote: »

... people might be quick to judge her based on her situation but I know the beautiful person that she is...

why don't you pretend that you're one of those people for a change... I have only two words for you my friend:
- drop
- her

Nickibaby*

Oh The Humanity wrote: »

No, he didn't promise to look after the kids. Read it again.

Oopsie my apologies :P I reread it there the part where he didn't tell her till the Saturday afternoon was to do with him going out not him babysitting! Sorry only had an hours sleep last night!

Well in that case I don't think OP had anything to be sorry about no reason for the girlfriend to get into a strop about looking after her own kids. She sounds like she goes out more than most mothers I know. In future organise a babysitter like others have suggested.