Why can't I eat meat today?

dlofnep

My mother is fairly religious, as is my father. I was cooking up a fry-up and she said that I'm not supposed to eat meat today. As a devout atheist, I'm obviously snacking on a lovely fry-up as I write this - But I'm curious.. Where does this non-eating of meat originate from and what's it's significance?

Fanny Cradock

I'll certainly be eating meat.

Mr. Frost

dlofnep wrote: »

My mother is fairly religious, as is my father. I was cooking up a fry-up and she said that I'm not supposed to eat meat today. As a devout atheist, I'm obviously snacking on a lovely fry-up as I write this - But I'm curious.. Where does this non-eating of meat originate from and what's it's significance?

You're an atheist and yet you've no idea about the origins of Good Friday? Perhaps educate yourself then, maybe you can decide whether you're an atheist or not. :rolleyes:

AtomicHorror

Mr. Frost wrote: »

You're an atheist and yet you've no idea about the origins of Good Friday? Perhaps educate yourself then, maybe you can decide whether you're an atheist or not. :rolleyes:

That's silly. Should he read up on all the history and rituals associated with Zeus too? For that matter, have you got an in depth knowledge of every religion there has ever been? You're an atheist with respect to all of them.

dlofnep

Mr. Frost wrote: »

You're an atheist and yet you've no idea about the origins of Good Friday? Perhaps educate yourself then, maybe you can decide whether you're an atheist or not. :rolleyes:

I am educating myself - I'm asking a forum, educated on the principles of Christianity. Do you care to answer my question?

Tim_Murphy

Mr. Frost wrote: »

You're an atheist and yet you've no idea about the origins of Good Friday? Perhaps educate yourself then, maybe you can decide whether you're an atheist or not. :rolleyes:

What I wonder about it why we're allowed eat meat on any Friday nowadays? As Fr. Douglas once asked:
"What about eating meat on Friday, it used to be illegal, but now it's not? What about people who ate meat in the past? Where are they now?"

AtomicHorror

Never quite got the fish but not meat thing either, since there's no meaningful difference between them that I can see.

Tim_Murphy

AtomicHorror wrote: »

Never quite got the fish but not meat thing either, since there's no meaningful difference between them that I can see.

Fish make significantly less noise when they're killed so it's more humane to kill them.

PDN

I had a great fry this morning. In fact I've never seen the wee cafe so packed with punters. Good Friday must be a popular day for a fry.

Tim_Murphy

PDN wrote: »

I had a great fry this morning. In fact I've never seen the wee cafe so packed with punters. Good Friday must be a popular day for a fry.

Nothing like being told you shouldn't have something to make people want it.

dlofnep

PDN, you're the beacon of christian wisdom in this forum. Where did this rule originate? Surely if you're not adhering to it, my mother might be just a little old fashioned? Is it one of those old sayings that was made up, or is there some merit to it?

dlofnep

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

Nothing like being told you shouldn't have something to make people want it.

Tim, you're not allowed to buy me a new Ferrari. I forbid it.

Tim_Murphy

dlofnep wrote: »

PDN, you're the beacon of christian wisdom in this forum. Where did this rule originate? Surely if you're not adhering to it, my mother might be just a little old fashioned? Is it one of those old sayings that was made up, or is there some merit to it?

I thought it was more of a catholic thing than a general christian thing, but I could be wrong on that.

jimmycrackcorm

The story I was told about the fish for fridays was that in the 16th century the then pope owned the Roman fishing fleet and in order to boost business decreed that only fish could be eaten on fridays.

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

The Mad Hatter

PDN wrote: »

I had a great fry this morning. In fact I've never seen the wee cafe so packed with punters. Good Friday must be a popular day for a fry.

Holy Thursday's really popular for off licenses, too.

PDN

dlofnep wrote: »

PDN, you're the beacon of christian wisdom in this forum. Where did this rule originate? Surely if you're not adhering to it, my mother might be just a little old fashioned? Is it one of those old sayings that was made up, or is there some merit to it?

Flattery will get you everywhere in this forum, even if you are just taking the piss.

If your mother is a Catholic then she is adhering to Canon Law, which still states that certain days are fast days. The idea was that on fast days they should refrain from eating what was most expensive - which in most ages is red meat. So, sorry, but the stuff about the Pope owning a fishing fleet is just a rather quaint urban legend.

I am not a Catholic, and see the practice of observing fast days as unbiblical. So your dear old mum is unlikely to be swayed by anything a wicked heretic like me might have to say on the matter.

Slav

dlofnep wrote: »

My mother is fairly religious, as is my father. I was cooking up a fry-up and she said that I'm not supposed to eat meat today. As a devout atheist, I'm obviously snacking on a lovely fry-up as I write this - But I'm curious.. Where does this non-eating of meat originate from and what's it's significance?

Fasting is not unique to Christianity and one can see many references to it in Old Testament. Specifically Friday fasts among Christians are almost as old as the the New Testament scriptures. First time they are mentioned in Didache (which is dated late first or early second century) where it's prescribed to fast on Wednesdays and Fridays as opposite to Jews who fasted on Mondays and Thursdays. Wednesday is the day when Sanhedrin made a deal with Judas Iscariot and Friday is the day of crucifixion of Jesus Christ so the Christian were commemorating these days during the whole year.

Later only Fridays survived as a fasting day in Roman Church yet soon after Vatican II the rules were greatly relaxed so now only Good Friday is seen by many as the Friday fast.

Orthodox Christians are still fasting every Wednesday and Friday along with the other 4 fasts during the year. It's not just meats that are excluded but also dairy products, fish and alcohol (though some days are more strict then the others).

Also it has to be pointed out that dietary restrictions are not the only and not the main part of fasting.

philologos

The point of abstaining from red meat, as it was considered a luxury at the time when the rule was instituted, but fish was considered the common food of the time. I think it's slightly archaic. By doing away with red meat, it was considered that you were making a sacrifice of sorts.

Slav

Jakkass wrote: »

The point of abstaining from red meat, as it was considered a luxury at the time when the rule was instituted, but fish was considered the common food of the time. I think it's slightly archaic. By doing away with red meat, it was considered that you were making a sacrifice of sorts.

I think there are few problems with it. First of all, red meat was not necessarily a luxury; in fact it was quite the opposite for nomad tribes where they might have plenty of meat and dairy but plant food was available to them mostly by trade. Second, fish appeared in on fast table not that long ago and is still not acceptable during fasting in Orthodox Christianity. Third, and most important, saying that fasting is just a sacrifice would be oversimplifying the things for there is almsgiving for that kind of sacrifice and therefore there would not be a need for fasts at all.

philologos

Slav: I'm not saying I adopt this understanding. I'm merely saying that is the understanding in Catholicism or so I thought. I'm free to be corrected.

dlofnep

PDN wrote: »

Flattery will get you everywhere in this forum, even if you are just taking the piss.

If your mother is a Catholic then she is adhering to Canon Law, which still states that certain days are fast days. The idea was that on fast days they should refrain from eating what was most expensive - which in most ages is red meat. So, sorry, but the stuff about the Pope owning a fishing fleet is just a rather quaint urban legend.

I am not a Catholic, and see the practice of observing fast days as unbiblical. So your dear old mum is unlikely to be swayed by anything a wicked heretic like me might have to say on the matter.

For once, dlofnep was being serious

Thanks, appreciated.

kelly1

Some info here.

Zombrex

Mr. Frost wrote: »

You're an atheist and yet you've no idea about the origins of Good Friday? Perhaps educate yourself then, maybe you can decide whether you're an atheist or not. :rolleyes:

I will be quite impressed if the knowledge of why some Christians don't eat meat on Good Friday converts him from atheism to Christianity ....

Akrasia

AtomicHorror wrote: »

Never quite got the fish but not meat thing either, since there's no meaningful difference between them that I can see.

Yeah, I'm always asking people this. I've got some great answers

"because fish don't have any internal organs"

"Because fish don't have any brain"

"because fish don't have a soul"

The first two are just blatantly false, the third is interesting because it implies that other kinds of animals do have a soul..

I presume the real reason why fish is not considered a meat is down to some kind of translation error somewhere down the line (like most ludicrous things in religion) but it still does not fail to amuse me to watch catholics scratching their heads and wondering about something they've done all their life but never ever thought about.

krudler

Just another Catholic superstition, or its to show how Jesus gave up his morning fry to save our souls, or something, he must have been dying with a hangover though from all the wine drinking he did, no soakage the next morning

Nodin

I remember meeting two "student" types on a good friday. Yer man, being away from home asks me what he can get for a decent feed for 2 pound. I said that sausages would fill the gap. He says "Good man...." and then hesitates....whats wrong, sez I..."herself won't eat meat on the Good Friday" sez he, nodding towards the live-in Girlfriend...

Phototoxin

fish is not warm blooded ergo not an animal (its a fish - odd logic!) ergo you can bypass the point of the day due to uber-traditional catholic lawyering!

postcynical

Phototoxin wrote: »

fish is not warm blooded ergo not an animal (its a fish - odd logic!) ergo you can bypass the point of the day due to uber-traditional catholic lawyering!

Interesting. I suppose if mammal replaced animal it might be scientifically valid. What is the point of the day that you would thus bypass?

postcynical

kelly1 wrote: »

Some info here.

Interesting link Kelly1, thanks. I wish I had more Protestant friends...:pac:*

kelly's link wrote:

Note that in following these disciplines designed to make one mindful of Christ's sacrifice, to put the world into perspective, and to discipline the body, true charity trumps every other law; Catholics are not Pharisees. In other words, if you are asked to a sit-down dinner at a Protestant's house on Friday, and the host, unaware of Catholic practices, has worked hard to prepare a huge roast beef, eat the beef and shut up (unless you believe this person, upon learning of the discipline, would, say, see your having eaten the meat as a sign of Catholic weakness or hypocrisy and it would cause scandal or something. In other words, weigh the situation and show the Love of Christ).

*as long as they don't offer me the soup

Phototoxin

What is the point of the day that you would thus bypass?

To be depriving yourself of protein.

postcynical

Phototoxin wrote: »

To be depriving yourself of protein.

Your other posts seem to be quite earnest. Anyway kelly1's links have satisfied my 'hunger' in this thread. But I thought the fish not being a mammal interpretation was quite clever, if substantiated - Who says Catholics are stupid:)

Black Swan

Had a honey baked ham. It was Good Friday and Easter. Does this make me a bad person worthy of punishment in the afterlife?

faceman

Blue_Lagoon wrote: »

Had a honey baked ham. It was Good Friday and Easter. Does this make me a bad person worthy of punishment in the afterlife?

Only if it was imported ham.

the tradition of not eating meat or consuming alcohol was to make a sacrific given the sacrific Christ made on good Friday.

Its more a spiritual/will power thing really. You dont win brownie points for doing it or not doing it. You dont break any laws, religious or otherwise, for doing it or not doing. Regardless of one's spiritual beliefs it is humbling to be able to exercise any type of sacrifice when you consider those in the world who have no choice but to do without.

Eurodsl

1 Timothy 4:3
Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.