Some advice please

damien1211

I currently have a limited company that is insolvent, I have managed to pay all my debts other that the revenue that are owed around 30K. This amount is the remained of a settlement that is owed to the revenue due to a fraud committed by one of our ex employees. I've contacted a few accountants on how to wind-up the company but there looking for around 7 to 15K to wind it up. We have no asset or liabilities and no money due from debtors. Problem is we do not have the money left to pay an accountant.

Is there any possible way I do this myself as I can seem to get info from the CRO.

Your advice would be greatly appreciated as I currently do not know where to turn confused:

jnh

the revenue have to approve a company being wound up. its doubtful they will let it through if you owe them 30k

Kinetic^

Contact the revenue today & explain the situation. The longer you leave it,the more interest & penalties will increase.

damien1211

Thank you for the quick replys, I've had a chat with someone that worked for the revenue, they told me that the revenue will look for a liquidator but the problem is that I have not got the fund to pay one and I don't understand that process myelf.

conor2949

You really do need the services of a liquidator.

If you've paid all the other creditors and not paid the Revenue then it can become awkward.

The revenue rank in priority amongst the preferential creditors.

Without knowing the full facts, it could be viewed that you've made preferential payments to some creditors who may not have been entitled to those funds (as the revenue may rank in preference to them)

Its a complex area and it really does need the input of a professional.

If you want to PM me i'll give you a few names/contacts who might be able to help u out.

damien1211

Thanks Conor2949, I've just been told contact the revenue and let them know that we cannot make any payment and leave the ball in there court, once I've done this I been told to file nil return's until the company closed by Revenue/CRO not sure if the above is the right road as I need a fresh start to get myself going again. I'm Nervous about talking with anyone as I do not have the fund to pay them. I know I can appoint a liquidator myselk who does not need to be an accountant but just not sure what the process is. I don't want to burden anyone with my probems, Id just likd to be able to fix them. Any protect my young family and any little income I can generate to keep myself going.

conor2949

A forced strike-off by the CRO could create future problems for you if you wanted to be a director of Irish companies in future. Revenue could seek to have you restricted as a company director.

I can appreciate your difficulties and I applaud you for trying to get them sorted. At least you are being pro-active in trying to sort things out.

conor2949

Damien,

Just to clarify for you.

Anybody can act as liquidator to the company as long as

1) they are not an officer of the company (this means that as a director you cannot act as liquidator of your own company)

2) the liquidator has not acted in a professional capacity for the company/directors previously. (i.e. they are creating indepedence)

There is no requirement for them to have any formal qualifications whatsoever.

Hope this clarifies for you

Conor

damien1211

Thanks for that Conor, It's an amazing help to get some understanding of this. If I appoint a liquidator myself do you know if there's any set process I need to follow. Do I just tell the revenue that I have appointed a liquidator and get the liquidator to arrange a meeting with the revenue.

DO you know if there are any forms or declaration that need to be made by us (director/secretary) of the company.

Thankyou

Damien.

conor2949

Damien,

the process that you would be invoking would be a Creditors Voluntary Liquidation

A creditors meeting would be scheduled and notice to attend circulated to all creditors

A shareholders meeting will be held where a liquidator will be appointed prior to creditors meeting

Then creditors meeting held, where a directors statement of affairs will be presented and the company liquidator can be approved by creditors or the creditors make their own nomination of a liquidator and it goes to a formal vote.

the liquidator then will have alot of administrative notices to issue to state bodies, odce, revenue, banks,solicitors, utility providers, etc.

Creditors claims will be advertised for in papers and in writing to known creditors.

To wind up a company, clearance is required from Revenue.

As soon as a liquidator is appointed, they assume the control of the companys assets and liabilities. In effect, its no longer your company.

The liquidator submits various notices to the CRO and ODCE notifying them that he has been appointed as liquidator, etc.

Just a brief outline above and there is alot more to each point than i have included.

Conor

damien1211

Hi Conor, Thanks for the info I should be able to get the first steps sorted out myself. I'll let you know how I get on.

Thnaks Damien

dbran

Hi

Guys. Beware as there are potentially serious issues here!!!!

From my reading of this it is unlikely that any liquidator will ever be appointed as a result of this creditor's meeting as there are currently no funds to pay them. Only the revenue as the sole creditor will be left out of pocket.

As they are a preferential creditor, what you have done by paying off everyone else ahead of the revenue is illegal. Any accountant getting involved in such a scheme as this could find themselves severely repremanded by their institute.

A liquidator once appointed (by the revenue) can sue you as former director personally to recover any or all the money you caused to be iillegally distributed and can report your conduct to the ODCE where you may be prosecuted or banned from being a director of any other irish companies.

You must seek legal advise before you proceed.

The only real solution is to agree to pay off the revenue somehow or come to an arrangement with them. All other options carry some risk.

Hope this helps and sorry in advance to be so forthright on this

DB

damien1211

I have contact about 10 different accounts on this and was give pricing ranging form €6k to €15K. when I asked what they would do for the money only 2 of them gave me any sort of details of what they were doing hence this post.

In the last few weeks I been in direct contact with the ODCE who were dealing with the prosecution of my old accountant due to fraud, they were amazingly helpful and offered enormus detail. I then returned to several of the accountants with the information I had gathered asking is this the process you would follow the answer being yes right across the price range 6K to 15K. So now what I managed to do is bring my bill down to under 2K and have started the proceedings myself. Once the process is complete I will post the a to Z in boards for all to use if they wish - may take 6 to 12 months for final completion.

What I will say to anyone winding up company / dealing with a liquidation talk to as many prople as possible including the ODCE they will help with info if they have time. Plus the number one go to several accountant before you decide what path you want to take and demant to know what there doing for there money as not all liquidations are the same. I'm also not saying the it's a walk in the park winding up a company yourself but at least you in controll. A good accountant will work with you, all the others will spout the same old stuff and frighten you into forking out 15K at a time when you most vunerable.

Again talk directly to the ODCE there fair and do a great job when there allowed to. Knowledge is the key.