Caffeine

Lumen

Was reading up on caffeine last night whilst browsing for energy gels.

The consensus seems to be that it helps performance if you don't drink it off the bike too much (i.e. avoid building a tolerance).

I do normally drink one or two of cups of coffee a day, but usually not before cycling - perhaps I should do the opposite and keep the boost for the bike.

Thoughts?

kenmc

Lumen wrote: »

Thoughts?

I'm fcuked so. Easily drink the best part of a litre a day in work, would have 2 of a weekend morning. Looks like I need to up my dose at weekends before cycling so. You can get insulated bidons, right?

Lumen

kenmc wrote: »

I'm fcuked so. Easily drink the best part of a litre a day in work, would have 2 of a weekend morning. Looks like I need to up my dose at weekends before cycling so. You can get insulated bidons, right?

That explains why you were shaking at the Christmas drinks. I'd assumed it was crystal meth.

niceonetom

I've only recently started to use these. I rarely drink coffee (jasmine tea ftw!) and with 100mg of caffeine I certainly feel the hit.

It also has a good selection of salts, which should help when it gets hotter and the sweat rate goes up. One thing I noted about it was that it has something like 1000% of the RDA of vitamin B12. What's that all about?

I suspect that, paired with a breakfast roll, zym could be a serious hangover combat weapon.

Lumen

niceonetom wrote: »

One thing I noted about it was that it has something like 1000% of the RDA of vitamin B12. What's that all about?

http://www.usingvitaminswisely.com/vitamin-b12-overdose.html

"The most alarming aspect of a vitamin B12 is that it has been linked with several types of cancers. Another factor against taking a megadose of B12 is that no research has been able to establish a safe upper limit of B12 consumption."

Not very scientific, but still.

edit...

The Marmite site says 100g contains "15.0μg (1500% RDA)". CRC says of the Zym "Vitamin B12 500 mcg" (per tablet?). What's a mcg? Microgramme? If so, that's 500x the RDA per Zym tablet.

OTOH, Calls to boost vitamin B12 RDA.

niceonetom

hmm, my brow is furrowed.

Ah no, I'm not playing that game. I'm sick of people who devide the world into two catagories; things that cause cancer, and things that cure it. S'all bollocks in'it.

Lumen

niceonetom wrote: »

Ah no, I'm not playing that game. I'm sick of people who devide the world into two catagories; things that cause cancer, and things that cure it. S'all bollocks in'it.

Fair enough.

Barname

niceonetom wrote: »

hmm, my brow is furrowed.

Ah no, I'm not playing that game. I'm sick of people who devide the world into two catagories; things that cause cancer, and things that cure it. S'all bollocks in'it.

original and funny... :pac:

kenmc

Lumen wrote: »

That explains why you were shaking at the Christmas drinks. I'd assumed it was crystal meth.

Saturday wasn't it? Yeah most probably UD'd.

Barname

Lumen wrote: »

Was reading up on caffeine last night whilst browsing for energy gels.

The consensus seems to be that it helps performance if you don't drink it off the bike too much (i.e. avoid building a tolerance).

I do normally drink one or two of cups of coffee a day, but usually not before cycling - perhaps I should do the opposite and keep the boost for the bike.

Thoughts?

thought....

why stop at caffeine so?

kenmc

niceonetom wrote: »

hmm, my brow is furrowed.

Ah no, I'm not playing that game. I'm sick of people who devide the world into two catagories; things that cause cancer, and things that cure it. S'all bollocks in'it.

Spot on. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

niceonetom

Lumen wrote: »

Fair enough.

Well, it'll all fall out again once the vit B12 gives me malignant cancer of the rectum.

Swings and roundabouts really.

I wonder how much B12 DirkVoodoo takes...

Lumen

niceonetom wrote: »

Well, it'll all fall out again once the vit B12 gives me malignant cancer of the rectum.

Since you mentioned arse cancer, I feel compelled to point out that processed pork products cause bowel polyps (precursors to AC), so your breakfast roll isn't helping. It's the nitrite preservatives, apparently.

I discovered the research on that just after returning from two months in Bologna, stuffing myself with the world's finest processed pork products on a daily basis.

Mind you, there's always an upside. The polyps can be shaved off with regular colonic exams, which might be of interest to some.

Seriously, I totally understand the "feck off about cancer" stuff. At one stage there was a theory that browned meat and even toast causes it. So basically, everything that tastes good.

Lumen

Barname wrote: »

thought....

why stop at caffeine so?

I would draw the line at anything likely to kill me when exercising hard. I assume caffeine is on the right side of that line.

niceonetom

niceonetom wrote: »

... I rarely drink coffee (jasmine tea ftw!) ...

^
Anti-oxidants. I'm fucking sorted. No worries. Bullet proof. Safe as houses.

niceonetom

Lumen wrote: »

Since you mentioned arse cancer, I feel compelled to point out that processed pork products cause bowel polyps (precursors to AC), so your breakfast roll isn't helping. It's the nitrite preservatives, apparently.

Mmmm, pork.

RobFowl

Lumen wrote: »

Since you mentioned arse cancer, I feel compelled to point out that processed pork products cause bowel polyps (precursors to AC), so your breakfast roll isn't helping. It's the nitrite preservatives, apparently.

I discovered the research on that just after returning from two months in Bologna, stuffing myself with the world's finest processed pork products on a daily basis.

Mind you, there's always an upside. The polyps can be shaved off with regular colonic exams, which might be of interest to some.

Seriously, I totally understand the "feck off about cancer" stuff. At one stage there was a theory that browned meat and even toast causes it. So basically, everything that tastes good.

Red meat and men unfortunately as well

TinyExplosions

niceonetom wrote: »

(jasmine tea ftw!) and with 100mg of caffeine I certainly feel the hit.

I knew you were a bloody fairy! It's Earl Grey ftw bucko!

niceonetom wrote: »

I suspect that, paired with a breakfast roll, zym could be a serious hangover combat weapon.

I love the name of that product... I find Nuun is a great hangover cure myself -wake up with the fuzzy mouth and neck a bidon with one tablet dissolved in, and you well on the road to recovery!

Signal_ rabbit

I used to use the Zym's until one day I tried the one with caffeine in one morning. My heart rate went through the roof and stayed really high for a couple of hours after even at rest. Just to be sure I tried them again a couple of weeks later with the same result. It's scary stuff.

I use the Nuun (non-caffeine) and find it great for shortish spins. Longer rides I use High5 carbo drinks.

Also agree the Nuuns are good for hangovers.

Caroline_ie

Tomorrow i will try Magnus Backstedt Coffee for breakie and fill my bidon with Zym ... will try it as a test :P

Lumen

Caroline_ie wrote: »

Tomorrow i will try Magnus Backstedt Coffee for breakie and fill my bidon with Zym ... will try it as a test :P

You're French, it won't do anything. One gallic shrug and you'll be as clean as Lance.

rottenhat

Lumen wrote: »

I do normally drink one or two of cups of coffee a day, but usually not before cycling - perhaps I should do the opposite and keep the boost for the bike.

Thoughts?

It's pretty common advice for people training for any of the epic randonnees (Paris-Brest-Paris, Boston-Montreal-Boston etc) to give up drinking coffee and tea at least 6-8 weeks beforehand so that you can get a decent boost from drinking coke or coffee on the ride. Obviously it can make a big difference forty or fifty hours into a ride. Not sure I'd be bothered doing without tea and coffee for anything less than that though.

Caroline_ie

Lumen wrote: »

You're French, it won't do anything. One gallic shrug and you'll be as clean as Lance.

Errrrr ... we let you guys win yesterday - ( that will be my answer to everything ... )

Caroline_ie

Red Bull (8.2 oz) = 80.0mg
Diet Coke = 45.6 mg
Coca-Cola Classic = 34.0 mg

ZYM = 100mg!

DirkVoodoo

I thought I read somewhere that caffeine was good for metabolising carbohydrate, making a short jab of espresso in the morning a good thing to have before a long cycle.

True?

concussion

It helps you switch to 'fat burning' earlier so you don't abruptly run out of energy when your carbohydrate stores run out, ie the bonk.

blorg

I drink a fair amount of coffee normally but can go without it indefinately with no ill-effects. Had 12 espressos before the W200 last year, was a bit late starting but it sure set me off with a bit of a burst.

Caroline_ie

blorg wrote: »

Had 12 espressos before the W200 last year, was a bit late starting but it sure set me off with a bit of a burst.

dave2pvd

Are these available in Ireland? Essential caffeination all in one handy little squeeze pack. Don't leave home without it.

Greyspoke

I used to mix my own solution of diet coke (caffeine without sugar) plus conventional energy drink powder (carbs and salts/minerals). It tasted a bit weird but seemed pretty effective!

rflynnr

blorg wrote: »

I drink a fair amount of coffee normally but can go without it indefinately with no ill-effects. Had 12 espressos before the W200 last year, was a bit late starting but it sure set me off with a bit of a burst.

12? Blorg - are you serious or indulging in hyperbole for effect? (I ask in part because as I've previously mentioned I'll be starting the W200 with only a few hours of sleep under my belt. If 12 espressos is a genuine option then maybe I'll be ok.)

rottenhat

Fiver says you'll be out before you even get to Sally Gap with stomach cramps, diarrhoea and heart palpitations....

blorg

rflynnr wrote: »

12? Blorg - are you serious or indulging in hyperbole for effect? (I ask in part because as I've previously mentioned I'll be starting the W200 with only a few hours of sleep under my belt. If 12 espressos is a genuine option then maybe I'll be ok.)

I drink a lot of coffee, I would not recommend it to people who don't- each of these was a double and I had two before I took the photo

short circuit

http://blog.firstendurance.com/2008/05/caffeine-and-endurance/

Lumen

short circuit wrote: »

http://blog.firstendurance.com/2008/05/caffeine-and-endurance/

Excellent article.

This is good news for Blorg:

"research indicates that the body will respond to the withdrawal from caffeine experienced overnight as much as abstaining from caffeine over prolonged periods of time."

The most amusing bit was:

"Caffeine is not a banned substance, although a survey of 140 competitors at the 2005 Ironman Triathlon World Championships revealed only 72% of the athletes were aware of this. 89% of athletes indicated they planned on using caffeine either before or during competition."

I'm not sure of the order of the questions, but that could be interpreted as "17% thought they were illegally doping".

RobFowl

Lumen wrote: »

Excellent article.

This is good news for Blorg:

"research indicates that the body will respond to the withdrawal from caffeine experienced overnight as much as abstaining from caffeine over prolonged periods of time."

The most amusing bit was:

"Caffeine is not a banned substance, although a survey of 140 competitors at the 2005 Ironman Triathlon World Championships revealed only 72% of the athletes were aware of this. 89% of athletes indicated they planned on using caffeine either before or during competition."

I'm not sure of the order of the questions, but that could be interpreted as "17% thought they were illegally doping".

It was a banned substance above a certain threshold, this was revised 3 years or so ago but it remains a "monitored" substance.

12 expresso's would have got you a 3 month ban up to few years ago !

sy

blorg wrote: »

I drink a lot of coffee, I would not recommend it to people who don't- each of these was a double and I had two before I took the photo

Jesus blorg, how many pit stops that day? surely the diuretic effect can't be good for your state of hydration.

Not taking the piss

Raam

Whatever about the performance benefits of coffee, all I know is that everything in the world is WRONG until I've had my cup. In fact, that's why I hammer it into work on the commute, so I can get to my coffee fast. So yeah, I guess there is a performance benefit from coffee

concussion

short circuit wrote: »

http://blog.firstendurance.com/2008/05/caffeine-and-endurance/

Thanks for that Short Circuit, some very good stuff in that.

Here's a page some may find useful, it's a list of the caffeine content in a huge variety of drinks. They also do caffeine in food and sugar in drinks aswell as a 'Death by Caffeine' where you enter your body weight and choose a drink and it will tell you how much you need to consume to be killed by caffeine o/d

http://www.energyfiend.com/the-caffeine-database

kenmc

blorg wrote: »

I drink a fair amount of coffee normally but can go without it indefinately with no ill-effects. Had 12 espressos before the W200 last year, was a bit late starting but it sure set me off with a bit of a burst.

I'm exactly the same. Drink oodles of the stuff in work. Can go cold turkey no hassles whatsoever. Weekends I'd only have 1 or 2 cups in the morning, nothing throughout the day.

rottenhat

kenmc wrote: »

Can go cold turkey no hassles whatsoever.

Wish I could say the same. I have a wretched headache by eleven without the morning dose.

Caroline_ie

Drink Coffee to Recover

Researchers found that coffee can help boost your glycogen levels. The catch? You have to drink a lot of it.


Whether you're looking for an excuse to down another cup of joe, or legitimately want to recover from workouts faster, a study recently published in the Journal of Applied Physiology has good news for you. The only catch that you better really like coffee. A team of Australian researchers studying glycogen, your number-one fuel while cycling, found that downing five to six regular cups with carbohydrate-rich meal helps your body refuel faster.

For the study, a group of seven cyclists performed a two-day trial. On the first day they biked to exhaustion and ate a low-carb meal to deplete glycogen stores. The following day they again biked to exhaustion, but followed the workout with either a plain high-carb drink, or one with eight grams of caffeine for every kilogram of body weight (or 3.6 gram per pound). The test was repeated a second time with subject taking the opposite drink on the second day.

Results showed that after one hour, the cyclists showed no difference in recovery. After four hours, however, the caffeinated group's glycogen levels were 65 percent greater. The exact cause for the recovery boost is unknown, but the scientists believe it may come form the higher levels of glucose and insulin levels in the blood, caused by caffeine, which could help transport the glycogen.

The researchers recognize that most folks can't consume caffeine or coffee on the same level as their study and they say plans are underway to investigate smaller dosages. Not surprisingly, some of the test subject reported problems of jitteriness and insomnia. They also recommend average folks experiment with smaller amounts of caffeine to find what works best for the. For anyone looking to recreate the recovery gains of this study, the eight grams per kg of body weight come out to about 600 mg of caffeine for a 165-pound person. That's also the equivalent of nearly eight cans of Red Bull, four Monster Energy Drinks or two Starbucks Grande coffees.

For more help on bouncing back from a tough day in the saddle check out our Recovery Checklist and our favorite recovery drinks (including coffee, of course).