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Massive hole in roof - Can I put that in BER?

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  • 10-03-2009 12:18pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭


    Hey, as the title says, half the roof is missing! How do I put that in the software? There is also an "extension" which has a corrigated iron roof, how do I do that?


Comments

  • Subscribers Posts: 41,563 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    engrish? wrote: »
    Hey, as the title says, half the roof is missing! How do I put that in the software? There is also an "extension" which has a corrigated iron roof, how do I do that?

    if half the roof is missing, then i would consider the walls of this room / rooms to be external walls... in effect its creating an outside space.

    if you can see the construction, then calculate the u value...


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    if half the roof is missing, then i would consider the walls of this room / rooms to be external walls... in effect its creating an outside space.

    if you can see the construction, then calculate the u value...


    Thanks for that. Two other things I'm curios of?

    1) Two of the "doors" are basically pieces of old doors banged together and nailed to the walls. Is there any way of adding this to the system? How would you input them?

    2) There is no heating system, nothing bar a fireplace. Do I just input zero in all fields relating to heating and hot water?

    Thanks


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    engrish? wrote: »
    Hey, as the title says, half the roof is missing! How do I put that in the software? There is also an "extension" which has a corrigated iron roof, how do I do that?

    You don't.
    You put it down as 'building incomplete, no meaningful evaluation possible'


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    Gurgle wrote: »
    You don't.
    You put it down as 'building incomplete, no meaningful evaluation possible'


    What? Where? Then there is no point in the dimensions etc. This is a house build in the 40's which has become dilapidated over time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    engrish? wrote: »
    What? Where? Then there is no point in the dimensions etc. This is a house build in the 40's which has become dilapidated over time.


    As in do I only put that in on the comments section and forget about the rest?


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  • Subscribers Posts: 41,563 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    gurgle is trying to say you dont do an assessment on it...

    i do not agree..

    if the dwelling is being sold as a habitable dwelling, it needs an assessment.

    If the dwelling is missing half a roof, is it being considered habitable by the vending solicitor??


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    Gurgle wrote: »
    You don't.
    You put it down as 'building incomplete, no meaningful evaluation possible'


    I rang the SEI and they agreed. They said however that there is no way of publishing any rating for it. Now my client will have no rating and the sale of his property will be held up. SEI said to send them an email requesting in writing that an inhabitable property does not require a BER cert. I have heard that this can take 6 weeks for a response....

    I am also peeved that I have put all of the usual work into this and now can not provide my client with anything, therefore I can not charge a fee.

    Has anyone dealt with this before?


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    If the dwelling is missing half a roof, is it being considered habitable by the vending solicitor??

    I myself would not really consider this property to be habitable, but I understood it to be sold as a habitable property. I got the instruction directly from the client and I only saw the hole (and lack of operating doors) when I got to the property.


  • Subscribers Posts: 41,563 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    engrish? wrote: »
    I myself would not really consider this property to be habitable, but I understood it to be sold as a habitable property. I got the instruction directly from the client and I only saw the hole (and lack of operating doors) when I got to the property.

    therefore i would still charge the client for your time and let him/her go after their solicitor for re compensation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,477 ✭✭✭topcatcbr


    Id agree if there is a large hole in the roof then it would not be habitable (by humans) and would not therefore require a Cert.

    I would charge for a site visit and opinion.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14 nodenrg


    If the property is as you have described its rating is going to be off the bottom of the scale. Would it not be reasonable to do the analysis as best you can ensuring it gets a G? - I'm sure you could be waiting a while for that letter from SEI!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,389 ✭✭✭Carlow52


    Charge for your site visit and leave it at that: AFAIK u are liable for the quality of the cert and this sounds like a potential minefield.

    I would wonder about this:
    I am also peeved that I have put all of the usual work into this and now can not provide my client with anything, therefore I can not charge a fee.
    .

    Did your professional judgement should have alerted you to the fact that this was a non-runner?.

    Even if DEAP somehow allows u to shoehorn it into the program, you still have the right, and even the responsibility, to say: not doing this.

    Dont forget that the client and his solicitor want a cert for a sale and if the manure hits the fan afterwards they will just look to you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    Carlow52 wrote: »
    Charge for your site visit and leave it at that: AFAIK u are liable for the quality of the cert and this sounds like a potential minefield.

    I would wonder about this:

    .

    Did your professional judgement should have alerted you to the fact that this was a non-runner?.

    Even if DEAP somehow allows u to shoehorn it into the program, you still have the right, and even the responsibility, to say: not doing this.

    Dont forget that the client and his solicitor want a cert for a sale and if the manure hits the fan afterwards they will just look to you.

    Hey,

    I contacted the solicitor and the SEI. I wrote a letter stating that the property was unhabitable and had this backed up with an emailed response from SEI. Solicitor was happy.

    As I was saying, I didn't know about the hole in the roof until I got to the first floor to do the floor plans! My time, travel etc had already been used up by then.

    In the end I charged a nominal fee to cover that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    nodenrg wrote: »
    If the property is as you have described its rating is going to be off the bottom of the scale. Would it not be reasonable to do the analysis as best you can ensuring it gets a G? - I'm sure you could be waiting a while for that letter from SEI!


    You probably could but I don't like the idea of messing with the software to get a result that I think a property should have. I thought about it and it just seemed wrong to do. Glad I came on here and got some other opinions though!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,489 ✭✭✭No6


    engrish? wrote: »
    I rang the SEI and they agreed. They said however that there is no way of publishing any rating for it. Now my client will have no rating and the sale of his property will be held up. SEI said to send them an email requesting in writing that an inhabitable property does not require a BER cert. I have heard that this can take 6 weeks for a response....

    I am also peeved that I have put all of the usual work into this and now can not provide my client with anything, therefore I can not charge a fee.

    Has anyone dealt with this before?

    I havn't actually dealt with it as such but I have asked SEI the question on derlict houses, which this one sounds like and I have had it confrimed that they do not require a BER cert as they are not habitable. They will require one after they have been renovated and prior to first occupation. I have posted this in the BER assessors association private forum in the Official SEI responses section.


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭engrish?


    No6 wrote: »
    I havn't actually dealt with it as such but I have asked SEI the question on derlict houses, which this one sounds like and I have had it confrimed that they do not require a BER cert as they are not habitable. They will require one after they have been renovated and prior to first occupation. I have posted this in the BER assessors association private forum in the Official SEI responses section.


    Pretty much the same, this is the response I got;

    Thank you for your email.

    While there is no explicit exemption for "derelict" or "uninhabitable" residential buildings, the term "dwellings" for the purpose of the Regulations is defined as "a building...which is used or suitable for use as a dwelling". For example, if an abandoned cottage is not currently in use and is not inhabitable it would be meaningless to look for a BER. Effectively the purchaser is buying a site for development which may or may not include the current structure or part of it. When a dwelling within the meaning of the Regs is planned or constructed the BER requirement kicks in whether prior to occupation or on offer to sell or let.


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