Creating Music - How do YOU do it?

ICN

Just wondering how everyone goes about making a track in their particular genre?

I'd be interested in seeing if there is any major difference in the mechanics between all the different styles or individuals.

What lessons have you learned along the way? What are the basics for getting the foundations down?

SURE.. You have to have an idea first.. That's a given.. but what I'd like you to share is your workflow.

What are your own personal golden rules?

What works for you?



I make Deep Tech - House.

Recently, I've changed my approach & have been focusing more on making the top melody / hook to begin with.

At the same time, I've got hundreds of "Shards" of Beats & Bass & have been struggling to find a hook for..

But the new strategy has come a cropper too.. I've got some really cool leads or sounds, leads - whatever you wish to call it.. but am struggling to get a groove going underneath.

So I've decided to go back & grab old projects & mix it all up.

You can really analyse it too much & get a major Block - Its great to be able to walk away & come back with fresh ears & a new perspective.

I'm not as productive as I could be.. But that's because I have not settled upon or found the correct approach yet.

A common symptom of electronic music.. Cough, Cough!!


I'd love to find out how you all approach the same process. :pac::pac:

road_2_damascus

Hi, I am in an equal but opposite position, I am a musician, well known where Im from, I play guitar and bass. I have always liked trance, progressive house, ambient etc. But I dont know where to begin if I were to try and create some tracks. Whats the basic set up requirements, software, etc. Cheers

PMI

For me it comes from a certain sound, whether it be a guitar, synth bass, trance synth or whatever....

that sound will trigger something and i will build on it.... one thing I try not to do is try to hard in the beginning, it should flow and the idea should come easy

i57dwun4yb1pt8

melody - sit a piano and use the octave from middle c in key of c .
just play and wait for something to come thru .

most times it will be a chorus cos its hooky - then record this and work out verse melody in a backward engineering sort of way .


or

guitar riff / chord sequence - and sing a melody on top -


ive found that just creating changing chord sequences is not good for melody writing - unles you loop it and sing over it repeatedly to find one.


once a chorus or verse chorus melody is taking shape , start thinking about a title and then lyrics for this title , fit the lyrics to the melody .

of course - its alot harder than this in reality - but this is my method evolved over the last year or so .


it seems to work better than just creating full backing then searching for a melody to fit it.

Neurojazz

Have to agree that making a chord change and then trying to find melody over the top a disaster also (unless planned).

I tend to tweak progressions once the loop is solid and everything is flowing... then it's *easy*

I've got a cure for writers block, taken seriously it works - i don't get blocks, pm me if interested - not for the meek.

henessjon

i work many ways

give me a piece of music i'll put lyrics and vocal to it...


sometimes I start with an idea musically chord progression or even garageband loops cobbled together and then put lyrics over it


mostly these days im concentrating on the story i want to tell and put music to it so the lyrics are first ,,,, usually this method the lyrics will be edited as you sing to the music ie (i wish you was holding me) would become (wish you was holding me) or even (i could have) >> (could've) to allow for timing and feel

ICN

DaDumTish wrote: »

most times it will be a chorus cos its hooky - then record this and work out verse melody in a backward engineering sort of way .


ive found that just creating changing chord sequences is not good for melody writing - unles you loop it and sing over it repeatedly to find one.


.

Reverse engineering - Love it.. But that can be difficult sometimes. Harder done than said.

Looping can really kill it for me I find. Stops making sense after a while. You begin to focus on one thing - Like - that kick becomes really annoying or that snare etc..

Kinda like saying a word over & over again.. Soon you dont know what your're saying at all! :pac:


I suppose you have to learn to move on after a while & realise that if something aint working, then you can always come back to it later.

At what point does one walk away? Thats what I've been doing (without realising it..) & actually when I come back I've got a different angle on it.. sometimes interesting.. sometimes not! :pac:

I've been going through old Reason tunes today. Its great.. its like my own private sample library.

ICN

Neurojazz wrote: »

..

I've got a cure for writers block, taken seriously it works - i don't get blocks, pm me if interested - not for the meek.

I'm intrigued.. Hopefully its a painless platonic method! LOL :pac:

Are you talking about meditation / thinking exercises etc.. ?

dav nagle

With songwriting I tend to write the chords first and then add a melody and lyrics. Within synth based production I like to create a nice beat these days and see what happens from there. The piano is a seriously melodic instrument, I nearly always start there after the beat and then add bass.

ICN

dav nagle wrote: »

With songwriting I tend to write the chords first and then add a melody and lyrics. Within synth based production I like to create a nice beat these days and see what happens from there. The piano is a seriously melodic instrument, I nearly always start there after the beat and then add bass.

Any tips for getting the bass down?

How do you make sure you get something decent, without exactly repeating what you did in the last song?

Helix

i generally get about 64 bars in and die on my arse tbh

mike65

Problem avoided by not writing songs.

ICN

mike65 wrote: »

Problem avoided by not writing songs.

HaHa!

Neurojazz

ICN wrote: »

I'm intrigued.. Hopefully its a painless platonic method! LOL :pac:

Are you talking about meditation / thinking exercises etc.. ?

No, just lots of mental pain lol, none of that fluffy bull - it really works

ICN

Neurojazz wrote: »

No, just lots of mental pain lol, none of that fluffy bull - it really works

I'm still intrigued - I'll have to feign writers block & give you a shout then!

RealEstateKing

people talking about making music this way brings up so many bad memories.

I stopped listening to and making electronic music the day I realised that it is absolutely impossible to have an inspired musical idea while sitting in front of a computer with a mouse in your hand, EQing bass drums, and quantising synth leads, before youve even written a song.

Its a hopelessly limited and frustrating way to make music, like trying to make love to a beautiful woman by building a robot and programming the perfect shag into it and getting him to do it for you.

Get a guitar or a piano, get the **** away from the computer and go express yourself. Sing your heart out, play your heart out, play live, sing along with people, and dont ever quantise a hi-hat again. For all our sakes.

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers, even the so-called masters of the art: Orbital, Leftfield or whatever, it's all just Shampoo-Ad music at the end of the day.

Neurojazz

Eat Static - Implant

That's a bunch of guitarists, drummers etc... making some decent electronic music that is very well made and feels free, inspired etc.. - there are things out there... just usually not in mainstream view.

ICN

RealEstateKing wrote: »

people talking about making music this way brings up so many bad memories.

I stopped listening to and making electronic music the day I realised that it is absolutely impossible to have an inspired musical idea while sitting in front of a computer with a mouse in your hand, EQing bass drums, and quantising synth leads, before youve even written a song.

Its a hopelessly limited and frustrating way to make music, like trying to make love to a beautiful woman by building a robot and programming the perfect shag into it and getting him to do it for you.

Get a guitar or a piano, get the **** away from the computer and go express yourself. Sing your heart out, play your heart out, play live, sing along with people, and dont ever quantise a hi-hat again. For all our sakes.

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers, even the so-called masters of the art: Orbital, Leftfield or whatever, it's all just Shampoo-Ad music at the end of the day.

Check out this - Trentemøller: The Last Resort

http://www.imeem.com/artists/trentemoller/playlist/m3kqpQGC/the-last-resort-album/

Great album. Proof that you can make a successful robot

There's been lots of great electronic stuff.

Dont forget AFX, Boards of Canada and a "rake" of others..


No-one ever talks about the rigid "Man-Music".

It's just as bad & definitely exists in the same strata as bad electronic music.

ICN

Neurojazz wrote: »

Eat Static - Implant

That's a bunch of guitarists, drummers etc... making some decent electronic music that is very well made and feels free, inspired etc.. - there are things out there... just usually not in mainstream view.

You'll be talking about the Ozrics next :rolleyes: :pac:

All those Guys are unsung heroes.. and will probably stay that way too.

Unfortunately.

RealEstateKing

Nothing against electronics per se, just the idea of sitting in front of a computer on your own to make music sounds like its unlikely to lead to deep passionate music, and it rarely does. Most of the stuff you mentioned is nice in the background, but its hardly inspired or particularly moving.

ICN

RealEstateKing wrote: »

Nothing against electronics per se, just the idea of sitting in front of a computer on your own to make music sounds like its unlikely to lead to deep passionate music, and it rarely does. Most of the stuff you mentioned is nice in the background, but its hardly inspired or particularly moving.

Shame you feel like that.. Good music is good music - no matter what it is or how its made.



As my Dad always says (AND it really annoys me..)


"We'll have to agree to disagree - I'm right & you're wrong.."


Sounds like a potential signature

Neurojazz

RealEstateKing wrote: »

Nothing against electronics per se, just the idea of sitting in front of a computer on your own to make music sounds like its unlikely to lead to deep passionate music, and it rarely does. Most of the stuff you mentioned is nice in the background, but its hardly inspired or particularly moving.

To be honest, it's a whole different thing - i do both worlds, and jamming/live music, creating parts with the whole band entity feeding back off each other... can understand that, But the computer part has it's own little magic areas and can be inspiring/deep if crafted that way - there's crap and good stuff in both camps, and the electronic/computer thing is still in its infancy.... there are many tools in that realm that require much mastery and require just as much concentration to master as guitar/bass etc.... depends on how far you push yourself and what tools you have.

Also, dance music appeals to a different sort of social group (i'm no expert), and some or the music may not appear to mean much - or have depth, but ask an avid fan and you'd see the same sort of enthusiasm as a rocker going mental in a pub, or a hippy hugging his hawkwind custom bong etc...

I quoted the Eat Static reference because to me it was the album that 'induced' me into dance music.... i had been through the guitar based stuff and found that the electronic music really appealed to me and set a benchmark which only after 15 years i'm feeling i'm getting on top of.

To be totally honest? - totally different worlds - both have depths and shallows.

dav nagle

ICN wrote: »

Any tips for getting the bass down?

How do you make sure you get something decent, without exactly repeating what you did in the last song?

I think the sound of the bass is very important, warm, compressed, fat. Change the variation, record some bass on the off beat or using vey tight penciled in notes. It really is very subjective but the sound of the bass has to suite the track so spend time choosing the right sound. Less is more with bass and very tight editing is essential. I am just ranting really.

JonathanAnon

RealEstateKing wrote: »

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers, even the so-called masters of the art: Orbital, Leftfield or whatever, it's all just Shampoo-Ad music at the end of the day.

I would agree with you mostly, but if you dont have a live band at hand to help work on the arrangement of a song, it can be really helpful to have those intsruments on hand 24/7.

Also for realising the song, and working out if it is actually any good or not, modern PCs can produce high quality demos (as opposed to a digital/analog recorder or whatever). I used PCs for the last ten years doing this sort of stuff, and it wasnt always this easy. I remember being limited to two audio tracks..

Helix

RealEstateKing wrote: »

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers

hans zimmer?

disssco

RealEstateKing wrote: »

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers, even the so-called masters of the art: Orbital, Leftfield or whatever, it's all just Shampoo-Ad music at the end of the day.

Absolute tosh, go listen to Sasha and Digweed's Northern Exposure mix volume one disc one. Then tell me that there is no musically inspired electronic music.

mike65

Helix wrote: »

hans zimmer?

He said inspired!

Anyone who is not gripped by the Blade Runner Esper soundtrack is dead.

condra

RealEstateKing wrote: »

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers

Hogwash

ICN

What can of bleedin' worms.. LOL

:pac: :pac: :pac: :pac:

ZV Yoda

Interesting thread...

RealEstateKing wrote: »

people talking about making music this way brings up so many bad memories.

I stopped listening to and making electronic music the day I realised that it is absolutely impossible to have an inspired musical idea while sitting in front of a computer with a mouse in your hand, EQing bass drums, and quantising synth leads, before youve even written a song.

Its a hopelessly limited and frustrating way to make music, like trying to make love to a beautiful woman by building a robot and programming the perfect shag into it and getting him to do it for you.

Get a guitar or a piano, get the **** away from the computer and go express yourself. Sing your heart out, play your heart out, play live, sing along with people, and dont ever quantise a hi-hat again. For all our sakes.

Notice that nobody has ever made a musically inspired album using sequencers, samplers, synths and computers, even the so-called masters of the art: Orbital, Leftfield or whatever, it's all just Shampoo-Ad music at the end of the day.

Mike Oldfield's "Tubular Bells" anybody?... (it was used as the theme for the film "The Exorcist"). That's an inspired piece of music.

Music & music creation will always evolve. Back in the 50s, I’m sure the establishment thought that those fancy new fangled electric guitars weren’t real instruments… and so it goes…

There are no rules for creating music – you just do whatever works for you. Agreed there aren’t as many sequencer inspired masterpieces, but to be fair, mainstream electronic music has only been around for (say) 20 years. Traditional pop/rock music has been here since the early 50s (i.e. almost 60 years). So, on balance, based on volume alone, you’d expect less electronic masterpieces.

Funny you should mention Leftfield though… I bought their 1st album "Leftism" when it was released in the mid 90s. I still listen to it regularly. Leftism was probably the album that changed my mind about electronic music.

Another one of my other fave albums is No Roots by Faithless. I bought it last year (by mistake actually - I had always assumed Faithless were just for pill popping 15 years olds). I was amazed that they play “real” instruments. I love the production on that album & I think it’s a great example of how dance & "conventional" music can be combined.
Granted, you won’t find me jamming any Leftfield / Prodigy / Massive Attack / Moby / Faithless tracks when I'm playing drums or guitar, but it’s just a different type of music.

i57dwun4yb1pt8

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Music & music creation will always evolve. Back in the 50s, I’m sure the establishment thought that those fancy new fangled electric guitars weren’t real instruments… and so it goes…

There are no rules for creating music – you just do whatever works for you. Agreed there aren’t as many sequencer inspired masterpieces, but to be fair, mainstream electronic music has only been around for (say) 20 years. Traditional pop/rock music has been here since the early 50s (i.e. almost 60 years). So, on balance, based on volume alone, you’d expect less electronic masterpieces.

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apart from dj's ;-)

i dont care how fast you can blend one record into another or make scratching patterns
they aint creating music , and if they cant play an instrument - they aint musicians -