Dublin Bus - Grange Castle depot

Victor

Is this a new proposal?

http://www.dublinbus.ie/projects/new_garage_development.asp

New Garage Development

Dublin Bus is proposing to develop a new modern Bus Depot on a 10-acre site at Grange Castle on the Adamstown / Newcastle Road adjacent to Grange Castle Business Park.


Artists Impression of new Garage

Due to an expanding population and in keeping with population projections for the South Dublin County Council area there is a vital need for a new modern bus depot in the Grange Castle area to service the Lucan, Clondalkin and Tallaght areas.

The development of the proposed depot at Grange Castle is in line with key public transport policies and objectives including the Regional Planning Guidelines, Transport 21 and the Dublin Transportation Office’s Platform for Change.

The planned depot will contain an operations building, workshop, stores and a service bay area for bus refuelling and washing. In addition, staff facilities will include a canteen and gym.

The depot will operate on a 24-hour basis and accommodate approximately 600 bus drivers and upwards of 150 support personnel including administration and engineering staff. Parking for up to 250 buses on-site is planned.

The site at Grange Castle was chosen as the preferred location by Dublin Bus to develop the depot due to the excellent road access available to existing population centres in Lucan, Clondalkin and Tallaght. In addition, future planned improvements to the road network such as the Outer Ring Road, along with the associated radial and orbital Quality Bus Corridors in these areas will provide the facility the opportunity to further increase public transport provision.


Site Overview

The proposed Depot will include:
* Operations / Administrative Building
* Workshop
* Stores
* Staff facilities including canteen and gym
* Service Bay including bus refuelling and wash facilities
* Staff car parking
* Bus parking facilities

http://www.dublinbus.ie/projects/planning.asp

Traffic Management

Dublin Bus has conducted a detailed traffic impact assessment study for the proposed new depot. The planned depot is designed to take advantage of the increased road infrastructure network in the local area. South Dublin County Council has currently planned to realign the Lucan and Adamstown road network, and works are planned for a new access road for the proposed garage. This will be aligned with the Nangor Road.

The traffic study team has been working in conjunction with South Dublin County Council to ensure that no traffic impacts will be associated with the development, and the depot will effectively take advantage of the upgrades in the roads network.


Planning and Environmental Standards

Dublin Bus takes a very proactive role with regard to its environmental and community responsibilities and a comprehensive assessment of the existing environment has been completed. During the construction phase, all best practice guidelines for construction management will be employed at the site.

Dublin Bus recognises the importance of reducing green house emissions and constantly reviews its processes to lessen impacts on the environment. It is recognised that buses contribute significantly less CO2 emissions than cars and are a superior environmentally friendly mode of transport. Total transport emissions for Ireland are 13.5 million tonnes, of which Dublin Bus accounts for just 0.7% of the total. The average peak loading for buses is over 90% and average emissions per bus passenger at 62g per kilometre is less than half of that of a car passenger at 128g per kilometre. Currently the Dublin Bus fleet is one of the youngest in Europe with an average age of 6 years. Since 2007 all new buses meet the latest Euro IV emissions standards and ongoing replacement will see the overall emissions of the Dublin Bus fleet fall with an ongoing benefit to the entire city.

Some highlights of the proposed measures to be taken to protect the environment during the garage operations include:

* Provision of storm water attenuation and retention / by-pass separators to eliminate the potential for water pollution.
* Strategic use of a combination of landscaping, excellence in building design and state of the art noise attenuation boundary treatment at sensitive locations in order to contain noise emissions from the site.
* Landscape planning to not only improve views around the site, but encourage biodiversity through planting of native shrubs and trees.
* Integration of renewable water systems to reduce water wastage
* A rainwater collection system with a retention tank sized to allow for up to 4 days of water use in urinals and wash down services.
* Mains water leak detection to ensure water is not wasted due to unchecked leakage of underground water supply pipes
* Heat recovery on Air Handling Systems
* Development of a mobility plan for employees in order to reduce traffic movements associated with the facility.
* Promotion of the waste management principles of Reduce, Recycle and Reuse at design, construction and operation phases of the development.

KC61

No it's been planned for about the past 5 years or so. Formal plans were released early last year or late 2007.

spareman

Thats was due to be completed Nov 2010, But it's been put on hold.

L1011

Would they consider closing and selling some of the city centre depots now that they're finally doing the sensible thing and putting depots on greenfield outside the city on high capacity roads (Outer Ring DC...). Obviously now is not the best time to be selling; but when/if theres another rise in the economy Ringsend and Donnybrook would be far better sold than used.

KC61

People tend to forget that buses run in both directions, and do not all start at the outer terminus. Some buses start and finish in the city centre and others at the outer terminus of the route. Therefore it is desirable to have the depot located either in between the termini or near (potentially) either end of the route.

Donnybrook is well placed as it is more or less a halfway point allowing reasonably quick access to either terminus - I would certainly countenance very strongly against selling the land at Donnybrook.

Victor

KC61 wrote: »

Donnybrook is well placed as it is more or less a halfway point allowing reasonably quick access to either terminus - I would certainly countenance very strongly against selling the land at Donnybrook.

Perhaps, but it could certainly do with additional use - if a new depot becomes available, move buses out of the back end of the site for two years and build something on it and store the buses in a "basement".

AlekSmart

Interesting thread and one which is nowhere near as cut and dried as might appear the case.

The Deloitte people are somewhat scathing in relation to Dublin Bus`s current super-depot Harristown.

They point to the location as being a definite problem vis a vis "Light" (Empty) running even though terminating Routes at or near a depot is operationally very efficient.

However when one consructs Harristown type depots on Greenfield sites one must accept that few ordinary mortals wish to visit them apart from Busworkers and the odd Anorak r two....

As KC61 points out Donnybrook Garage is in a VERY appropriate location for its current range of services and it would be shortsightedness of the highest degree to sell and move out to the sticks.

This has not prevented CIE Chairman Dr John Lynch from having to deal with a constant stream of Developer led snake-oil salesmen seeking to buy or otherwise accquire the Dublin 4 site.

Dr lynch recently identified one positive aspect of the current depression as the relative absence from his office of such smooth talking developers seeking to turn a fast buck.

That should not render such developments Impossible however as modern architectural techniques render it perfectly feasible to incorporate such facilities as Bus Garages into a wide range of complimentary developments

Possibly the first such scheme is currently underway at the Strand Street Hotel/Bus Interchange development which when open should provide a belated template for such facilities in the City Centre.

spareman

MYOB wrote: »

Would they consider closing and selling some of the city centre depots now that they're finally doing the sensible thing and putting depots on greenfield outside the city on high capacity roads (Outer Ring DC...). Obviously now is not the best time to be selling; but when/if theres another rise in the economy Ringsend and Donnybrook would be far better sold than used.

When Donnybrook garage was built it was a greenfield site, nothing but fields for miles.

L1011

spareman wrote: »

When Donnybrook garage was built it was a greenfield site, nothing but fields for miles.

It was also built by the DUTC (well, a predecessor) as a tram depot was it not? And in about 1870 something.

Its now far from greenfield.

Victor

MYOB wrote: »

Its now far from greenfield.

Virgin fields only 400-500m away in Belfield.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=donnybrook+dublin&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=29.440076,56.601563&ie=UTF8&ll=53.314647,-6.231995&spn=0.010204,0.043945&t=k&z=15 - the bus depot is where all the yellow bits are.

markpb

AlekSmart wrote: »

Possibly the first such scheme is currently underway at the Strand Street Hotel/Bus Interchange development which when open should provide a belated template for such facilities in the City Centre.

Is that still going ahead? If it's where I think it is, I haven't seen anything happen there for years.

If DB had their head screwed on, they'd have talked to some property developers about using basements of new buildings for small bus depots in addition to building large, overnight depots.

paulm17781

markpb wrote: »

Is that still going ahead? If it's where I think it is, I haven't seen anything happen there for years.

I saw something happening there quite recently, new boarding or something went up. Nothing major but some stuff has been done since it was initially announced.

AlekSmart

The Strand Street Interchange is indeed proceeding,well...in the sense of how such desireable infrastructure ever proceeds in Ireland.

All necessary permissions etc are in place and prepriatory site work in proceeding.

However since the facility is a form of PPP involving Dublin Bus having surface area use in a mixed Hotel/Commercial development we may have hit a bit of problem in that the original Hotel Operators appear to have stepped back a little in terms of time frame to opening.

The last thing Dublin Bus needs is for the Interchange to open in an otherwise vacant development.

The Jervis St Luas Stop is already entering Irish Folklore at a level which will soon see it beside Monto as a universally recognized location of ill-repute in Dublin.

Extending this "Zone" back towards the Lotts will provide VAST Public Order problems UNLESS the project is fully operational WITH Security and Management in place from Day One.

Presently I would rate those chances as 60/40 Against !

L1011

Victor wrote: »

Virgin fields only 400-500m away in Belfield.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=donnybrook+dublin&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=29.440076,56.601563&ie=UTF8&ll=53.314647,-6.231995&spn=0.010204,0.043945&t=k&z=15 - the bus depot is where all the yellow bits are.

The college campus doesn't really count as 'greenfield' despite being empty land; seeing as I would suspect they do have plans for most of it.

Carawaystick

The local Authorities in Dublin don't have a good track record acquiring land from third level institutions to provide much needed bus facilities for the general public - St Patricks College across from the cat and cage....

AlekSmart

I would suspect they do have plans for most of it.

AFAIAW a goodly amount of these plans relate to car-parking of one form or another,which I suppose, is much much different to Bus Parking...innit ??

Victor

Carawaystick wrote: »

The local Authorities in Dublin don't have a good track record acquiring land from third level institutions to provide much needed bus facilities for the general public - St Patricks College across from the cat and cage....

The college has a nice line of mature trees, so why not get rid of the Cat & Cage instead?

L1011

Victor wrote: »

The college has a nice line of mature trees, so why not get rid of the Cat & Cage instead?

Is it not a protected structure?

AlekSmart

Oddly enough,the situation at the C&C outbound is nowhere near as bad as it might seem.
There is little actual conflict here at peak times as MOST motorists can see the benefit of keeping things flowing,even if it means allowing a BUS to proceed ahead.

Essentially it`s a simple yellow-box and courtesy situation that WORKS.

Inbound however can be a bit iffy,but much of that is caused by the delusional insistance of retaining a line of on street parking which forced Buses to leave the inbound Bus lane as far back as the Ivy House,when they could continue all the way to the Gable end of the C&C before having to merge for the 10 Mtrs or so.

It s also worth noting that an Bord Gais constructed a substantial Gar Pipeline Transfer Station just behind St Pat`s wall which most certainly renders any changes on that side a non-runner........It`s called Planning.........Irish...oops sorry.....Zimbabwean Style !!! :eek:

dashcamdanny

Is this plan back on track now?

Dravokivich

I wouldn't expect so with the route tenders out at the moment. Have you heard any indication yourself?