No Dolby Digital via HDMI

seanbirkhead

Can anyone tell me why Sky will not transmit Dolby Digital sound via the HDMI output on the HD box?

TheDriver

think its only new hdmi 1.3 does audio also, why not use a digital optical cable, presuming the skybox and your tv has this or better again, connect the opt cable to a surround system?

seanbirkhead

I have audio coming through the HDMI but it is only analogue.
I have used the digital optical out of the sky box connected to a digital input of the telly and this works fine when using SCART as the video input but of course SCART does not give me HD picture.
When using HDMI as the video input to the TV I get HD picture but the TV refuses to use the digital audio in as the audio input when it detects there is already audio on the HDMI connection.
You might say it is a restriction of the tv but there you go.... but I wouldn't have the problem if Sky were sending DD down the HDMI output as most other equipment does (XBOX, PS3 etc.)

I dont really want to but a seperate home theatre system as I am quite happy with the sound the TV can produce when it has a Dolby input.

watty

Audio on the HDMI is digital. Not analogue.

Unless a channel transmits Dolby digital you just have regular MP2 stereo. It's perfectly digital stereo. Most material on TV is Mono or Stereo.

Only films generally have Dolby Digital or 5.1.

seanbirkhead

watty wrote: »

Audio on the HDMI is digital. Not analogue.

Unless a channel transmits Dolby digital you just have regular MP2 stereo. It's perfectly digital stereo. Most material on TV is Mono or Stereo.

Only films generally have Dolby Digital or 5.1.

Apologies. I should have said "Digital stereo" is what I get using HDMI as apposed to "digital 3/2" that the tv would report with surround sound input via the digital audio in when using SCART as the video input..

JoeA3

You HAVE to use an optical cable from your SkyHD box to your Amp if you want DD5.1 audio. Only stereo is sent via HDMI, hdmi versions have got nothing to do with it, its a limitation of the SkyHD box itself.

I would have thought that without an Amp / Home Cinema, all you'd be hearing is stereo sound anyway, as that's all your TV is capable of outputting... although many TV's claim "virtual surround" or other such marketing bull, this is no way the same as proper 5.1 audio! In fact the speakers on most new flat panel TV's are poor enough.

On SkyHD, there's a reasonable amount of stuff in DD5.1, such as the big shows on Sky1 (Lost, etc), but it's mainly the movies and sport channels.

gtg60

Technically, there is no reason for HDMI to not carry 5.1 sound, they just haven't implemented it, like they've done nothing with the Ethernet connection, the USB ports, etc, etc :rolleyes:

mossym

at a guess, the reason for not implementing 5.1 over hdmi is to save themselves hassle.at a guess 95% of Sky HD users will be connecting straight to an tv and not using an amp. most tvs won't accept a 5.1 signal anyway, and the transmitter(the sky box) is supposed to read the EDID in the tv to tell whether to send 5.1 or not. from experience a lot of those edids aren't programmed anywhere near correctly, and having the user have control would probably have resulted in sky getting thousands of calls from customers complaining they couldn't get sound from their box.

watty

But almost nothing has surround content and only some premium content (SkyMovies & Box Office) has 5.1.

Also you really need a home cinema amp. TVs are barely good for stereo and hardly any are decent for 5.1 or SS.

It makes perfect sense what the Sky Box does given the content and user equipment.

It makes sense what HDMI does too, given the trend for a TV to be simply an HD monitor.

I don't beleive ANY TV, ever has had proper HiFi speakers.

mossym

watty wrote: »

But almost nothing has surround content and only some premium content (SkyMovies & Box Office) has 5.1.

Also you really need a home cinema amp. TVs are barely good for stereo and hardly any are decent for 5.1 or SS.

It makes perfect sense what the Sky Box does given the content and user equipment.

It makes sense what HDMI does too, given the trend for a TV to be simply an HD monitor.

I don't beleive ANY TV, ever has had proper HiFi speakers.

well it doesn't really make perfect sense...

it makes sense to only send stereo to a tv.

it doesn't make sense to limit your hdmi stream to stereo only. you then lmiit the functionallity of those who are not using a tv.

what the hd box should do is read the edid on the receiving unit(amp or tv) which will then tell it what it can decode 5.1 or just stereo, and then send that when available.

that would allow it to just send stereo to a tv, because as you say they can't do anything with 5.1( not entirely true, the psuedo surround algorithms in most tvs work better with 5.1 inputs rather than 2.0, but they still don't sound very good)

but it would also allow those with amps not to have to use a seperate optical cable for 5.1, even for the limited amount of programming that is there

what they did makes sense for tv, it doesn't make sense in general as there was a solution that would allow both what they have for tv and also 5.1 for amps.

that is ignoring the problems with reading edids, and if that is the reason i can sort of understand sky doing what they did, but apart form that it doesn't make sense to limit hdmi to stereo only, as hdmi can quite happily carry one or the other.
i'd agree with you if implementing 5.1 affected the stereo signals, but it doesn't. (again I'm ignoring the edid problems here, but having seen the results of the latest plugfests held around the world where all manufacturers of hdmi related equipment from ic's to box manufactureres come together and do mass testing, this is becoming much less of an issue

if it made sense to limit it to stereo, surely the ps3 and xbox360 would be limited to stereo only? they have much larger penetration into the home, will have far more units directly connected to tv's, but both of those correctly detect what the display/receiver can handle and send that.

and agreed, no tv ever had proper hifi speakers, which is all the more reason to make it easier to connect to an external amp, not more difficult by having to connect two cables

snaps

Im sure its a sky box limitation likes been said, Im sure my TM6900 outputs DD via HDMI, but i dont know this for sure as i dont have Dolby Digital amp/tv. Just know on the settings there is an output for Dolby Digital via hdmi!

Jasonw

Can somebody clarify this for me (in plain english - I'm not familiar with a lot of the terms you've been using).

I'm switching from Chorus UPC to Sky HD. the installer's coming tomorrow. I have an amp and 5.1 surround sound. I assumed that the Sky HD box would simply connect to the HDMI input on my amp and I would have Video and audio similar in quality to my Blu-ray player when watching a movie on the HD channel.

Are you telling me that if I want a 5.1 audio experience I need a different connection to the amp and if I connect using an optical cable will be video quality be the same as if I connected with a top quality HDMI cable?

gtg60

Connect the Sky HD box to your AMP for VIDEO, to pass AUDIO in Dolby Digital (5.1 surround sound) you must also connect it by an Optical cable or Coaxial cable.
You will need to adjust the settings on your AMP so it knows that you getting the Audio from the Optical/ Coaxial cable (that will be in the manual if you don't know how to do it)

Jasonw

thanks gtg60. I've just had the Sky installer around - he was scouting the place so he was sure he could run the cable. He didn't know how to connect up for DD 5.1 I need to go to Maplins in the morning to get the optical cable. is the other one a S VIDEO cable? I also need a wireless phone thingamajig.

fat-tony

Jasonw wrote: »

thanks gtg60. I've just had the Sky installer around - he was scouting the place so he was sure he could run the cable. He didn't know how to connect up for DD 5.1 I need to go to Maplins in the morning to get the optical cable. is the other one a S VIDEO cable? I also need a wireless phone thingamajig.

SKY installers normally just put up the dish, run the cables to the SKY box and connect it to the TV (usually by SCART) and they don't get involved in the AV amp connections.

The HD box will come with a HDMI cable (it's about 1 - 1.5m only) so if you've got a wall-mounted plasma or LCD you may need a longer one - but you mentioned a HDMI connection to your amp so it may be long enough if you've got them on a rack together. As gtg60 said the optical connection is for 5.1 DD audio as the SKY box only passes 2.0 audio on the HDMI. My AV amp is set to not pass audio to the TV on the HDMI connection and take the feed from the optical in instead. There's no S-video as far as I remember - just SCART and composite (and component on the older HD boxes).

gtg60

I'm assuming you already have a HDMI cable running from the AMP to your TV, so all you need do is connect the AMP to the Sky box with a HDMI cable, the supplied one should be fine unless (as fat-tony has stated) it is not long enough.
The only other cable you will need is an optical cable, Maplins aren't terribly cheap, expect to spend 20~25 euro there for a decent one (again make sure it is long enough to reach from the AMP to the Sky box.

I don't know what you mean about a wireless phone thing

Jasonw

will the amp not take the 2.0 audio automatically from the hdmi then? I've taken a quick look at the amp manual (Pioneer VSX-LX60) and can't find anywhere that says you can override the audio from the hdmi. I guess I'll mess around with it when it arrives.

Thanks for all the help

gtg60

Jasonw wrote: »

will the amp not take the 2.0 audio automatically from the hdmi then? I've taken a quick look at the amp manual (Pioneer VSX-LX60) and can't find anywhere that says you can override the audio from the hdmi. I guess I'll mess around with it when it arrives.

Oh, nice choice of AMP, how much did that set you back?
If you connect up the HDMI then it will get sound fine just not DD 5.1 for the movies and some of the better TV shows. Best bet is still to connect by Optical (or Coaxial as all recent Sky HD boxes have both), I have a Pio AMP too, it's a few years older and of similar spec (VSX-AX4Ai) and I can set it that way, a complicated bit of kit like that may take a while to figure out but I'm sure if you read the manual thoroughly and have a mess around you will figure it out.

If you can't you could always swap it for my working AMP :eek::rolleyes:

Jasonw

Thanks, I picked it up from RS in Belfast for £700. the challenge was finding one as everyone else seems to have stopped selling them. My guess is that Pioneer has withdrawn them as the only difference between them and the much more expensive LX-71 seems to be an extra HDMI input.

Anyway, thanks for the offer but I found the setting. For the record in case anyone in future is looking for it press the signal select button until 'digital' comes up. If you leave it on the default 'auto' setting it selects the first available signal in the following order - hdmi, digital, analog.

would there be a noticable difference in Video quality between S Video and HDMI do you reckon?

Oh and apologies to the OP for hijacking the thread

gtg60

Jasonw wrote: »

would there be a noticable difference in Video quality between S Video and HDMI do you reckon?

Oh yes, stick with HDMI.

watty

If the TV and box is any good, then for DVDs and Broadcast SD there is no difference between HDMI and S-Video.

In fact it's the sort of thing I would compare before buying to verify the quality.

If you have HD content, then use the HDMI for everything as long as the TV does proper aspect ratio switching and the box outputting doesn't mess up SD 4:3 or 16:9 on the HDMI.