Emigration - where to for IT jobs?

Zubes

Hi,

Where would be a good place be, to emigrate to for IT jobs i.e. software development? Is everywhere as crappy as here, or would moving to Australia or Canada (etc) have better opportunities?

Thanks,

AARRRGH

I think everywhere is a bit crappy at the moment, although I hear things are ok in France.

Xiney

Unless you are highly skilled, Canada will not accept you as an immigrant, especially not in these difficult economic times.

Rex Manning

was at an emigration type fair today and was speaking to guy about canada and IT jobs. He said vancouver is one of the better places for IT jobs as alot of big american companies have set up their as you can get a canadian visa a lot quicker than an US one. He said there was approx 2000 companies set up in vancouver (he mentioned microsoft and EA but i'm sure most of the companies will be tiny).

Most countries are going to be in the same state as ireland - there's always somewhere cheaper

jkmanc1974

Most of the UK and Europe seems to be in the same boat as far as I can see, have nearly 20 years experience in the IT and Telecoms industries yet there is not a thing out there.....

Brgds
Johnny

Dannyboy83

Where are you fellas looking?
What do you specialise in?

TBH, I've had plenty of offers, but haven't needed any, Thank God.

For bottom rung type jobs, like Tech Support, the market has dried up, but there still seem to be specialist positions out there.

Kenno90

Australia .but from what i heard they are now holding back on letting irish people in to work , or at least there much tougher on the whole working visa process

Dannyboy83

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Where are you fellas looking?
What do you specialise in?

TBH, I've had plenty of offers, but haven't needed any, Thank God.

For bottom rung type jobs, like Tech Support, the market has dried up, but there still seem to be specialist positions out there.

...erm, having just read the fake jobs thread, I think perhaps I can more easily explain the plentiful amount of advertisements coming my way.

jkmanc1974

Have been looking everywhere in Ireland and the UK Danny for the last 2 months, there is very little out there, however potentially have an opening in England so fingers crossed for that....

Brgds
Johnny

Ginger

Depending on your skill levels, experience, additional quals , Norway is doing ok.

http://www.finn.no/finn/job/fulltime/result?keyword=&EXTENT=&JOB_CATEGORY%2FCATEGORY=5409&category=s%F8k

floyd333

I've been looking around myself. I'm lucky that I'm in a secure job but I don't see myself there ling term. I've 11 years development experience (.net etc.)

Australia seems like a total dead end. Maybe Canada but it might be too cold. The Australian lifestyle seems more appealing. The Uk doesn't seem great and their salaries are very low.

This global recession is a bit of a pain. Life must go on. Work must get done. There must be good IT jobs somewhere. Maybe UAE, Saudi Ariba, Singapore etc...

CorkFenian

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Where are you fellas looking?
What do you specialise in?

TBH, I've had plenty of offers, but haven't needed any, Thank God.

For bottom rung type jobs, like Tech Support, the market has dried up, but there still seem to be specialist positions out there.

Do you mind me asking which area you work in??If you have had plenty of offers..You must be specialised high end...Myself I'm between two stools..Got some very good financial support experience, but finding it hard..Its very quiet...Promising myself to really skill up at the moment..

JJJJNR

I hear Holland is still very good, Finland and Sweden still good also..

I better learn Dutch.

Dannyboy83

CorkFenian wrote: »

Do you mind me asking which area you work in??If you have had plenty of offers..You must be specialised high end...Myself I'm between two stools..Got some very good financial support experience, but finding it hard..Its very quiet...Promising myself to really skill up at the moment..

Hi mate,
Sorry about that, see my above post.
I've been receiving plenty of offers, but never actually checked them!
For all I know, they may have been bunk.

C# .Net Developer - Dublin City Centre, €Competitive
VB6 Developer - Dublin, €Negotiable
Java Developers

Can I suggest you join up www.premiergroupuk.com

I seem to be receiving emails from them quite regularily

Eoin

Do you refer to advertisements as "offers"?

Xiney

Rex Manning wrote: »

was at an emigration type fair today and was speaking to guy about canada and IT jobs. He said vancouver is one of the better places for IT jobs as alot of big american companies have set up their as you can get a canadian visa a lot quicker than an US one. He said there was approx 2000 companies set up in vancouver (he mentioned microsoft and EA but i'm sure most of the companies will be tiny).

Most countries are going to be in the same state as ireland - there's always somewhere cheaper

Vancouver is experiencing huge layoffs in IT.

And if you qualify for a visa in Canada it's quicker than the States. However, I'd wager very few people would qualify for economic migrant visas if their primary industry was IT. IT is not one of the "skilled workers" professions that qualify for work visas, and so your only other chance is to get an offer of employment before the visa - which is unlikely in this market since it would be much easier for a company to hire a Canadian for whom they don't have to jump through any hoops. Especially since the government would probably deny any application on the basis that there are Canadians available to do those jobs.



To be perfectly honest, unless your industry is Oil and Gas, thinking about going to Canada to work is dreaming. Also, Canada is tanking - it's just a few months behind. It'd be a waste of money to move over there for the same lack of work.

anladmór

im loling at people moving to australia(i mean people moving for anything other than a year out)

europe is fecked, nearly all are in a recession and some i think ireland,spain etc. are in depression. they need to join europe together properly so we can work together during this crisis. eu would have much larger budget than americans so that could stimulate european economy.

floyd333

Xiney wrote: »

Vancouver is experiencing huge layoffs in IT.

And if you qualify for a visa in Canada it's quicker than the States. However, I'd wager very few people would qualify for economic migrant visas if their primary industry was IT. IT is not one of the "skilled workers" professions that qualify for work visas, and so your only other chance is to get an offer of employment before the visa - which is unlikely in this market since it would be much easier for a company to hire a Canadian for whom they don't have to jump through any hoops. Especially since the government would probably deny any application on the basis that there are Canadians available to do those jobs.

The list of qualifying professions is a bit longer:

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/apply-who-instructions.asp#list

Xiney

But they will only recruit people for the other occupations on the list if there aren't enough in Canada.

Right now, there are. More than enough.

Dannyboy83

eoin wrote: »

Do you refer to advertisements as "offers"?

When I say job offer, I'm talking about people ringing my phone or contacting me directly by email. i.e. singling me out in order to compete for the job. This is still happening on an irregular basis, so I assumed there was a lot of work out there still for white collar workers.

But I put my cv into British, Australian, American, Canadain databases a long time ago, which explains a lot.

The above 'advertisements' were simply a selection of jobs in Ireland, which I assumed were real, but most likely were not.

---

There was recently a similar post about this on another forum I visit.

Bad signs, they will:

* Withhold their phone numbers,
* Be more interested in where you used to work than the job they're calling about
* Ask you who else you're interviewing for.
* Ask for references before they've even got you an interview
* Be unable to answer questions about the job like salary.
* Want to know what the last contract paid

If they are genuine, they will have read your CV before they call, have a job spec for the position they're calling about and they'll get straight to the point about the job without all the bullshting around. They won't withhold their phone number the first time they call.

Also, if you get the job, IME at least, you know almost striaght away.

And on a different forum I visit, there was a thread about jobs from hell.
One of the jobs was recruitment.
I was asking one of the people about false job in recruitment

DAN
So thats a yes then mate?

What would be the ratio of real jobs to fake jobs?

5:1 or lower

It's a definite yes Dan. When I did it we were targetted to have 40 adverts placed a week, didn't matter how many jobs (if any) were availabel.

Sometimes you didn't have any jobs at all so would get candidates and put them forward for jobs that companies were advertising openly in the newspaper.

Not all companies are like this but I bet more are than aren't.

ednwireland

anladmór wrote: »

im loling at people moving to australia(i mean people moving for anything other than a year out)

europe is fecked, nearly all are in a recession and some i think ireland,spain etc. are in depression. they need to join europe together properly so we can work together during this crisis. eu would have much larger budget than americans so that could stimulate european economy.

if you think australia is better (well i guess it couldnt be any worse tha here)
plenty of threads on how hard its getting to get a job in oz

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055496201
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055492422

might open your eyes to it getting bad everywhere

anladmór

i agree with you. i find it funny the waives that are moving there.

A_SN

AARRRGH wrote: »

I think everywhere is a bit crappy at the moment, although I hear things are ok in France.

And to think I moved from France last year to find an IT job in Ireland. Which I never ****ing found. Damnit...

This being said, glad to see it's not just me who's going about looking for a job wrong. But damnit, how am I supposed to survive with no job and no welfare benefits? (haven't lived in Ireland for long enough for that).

doolox

In the past when men were men and dinosaurs roamed the earth..... you had emigration, Ireland's social safety valve.
We were a poor, unskilled, at times naive lot but were willing to work hard and could make it if we went to the U.S or the U.K and got a job.
This no longer applies.
Wages in the U.K have not taken into account the falling value of Sterling, in comparison to the Euro they are not great.
The U.S is in deep depression. No jobs there.
Australia featured on the radio recently with one-year visa holders not getting any work.
Go to the middle East at anything and you will be competing with Indians and Philipinos for the manual jobs, no easy money there unless you have 3rd level skills in high demand, not many of those left now.
If I was young I'd stay away from any debt now. I'd make no long-term commitments (mortgages) or enter any long-term relationships etc.
But then I am not young. Each person will have to find their own personal solution to this new uncertainty, banks will have to offer flexible repayment options on their mortgages, developers may offer rent/buy schemes over longer terms etc. Houses may become cheaper and simpler as economists find ways to make them so.

As a nation we will get through this recession as our grandparents got through the one in the 30's.

Hopefully we won't have a world war to "solve" this down-turn. Hopefully the world will stick together on this and work out some solution.

IT can be used to solve a lot of problems but the big problem is getting paid for it. How often have people downloaded or used software and not paid for it? A similar problem exists for music and film, enforcing payment and having a viable business model.
It probably means that people will have to shift from pure IT development ( coding) into support and training ordiinary people like myself to use this stuff. This is hard grinding work and probably not attractive to the abstract-thinking people who get into IT in the first place.

BostonB

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

When I say job offer, I'm talking about people ringing my phone or contacting me directly by email. i.e. singling me out in order to compete for the job. This is still happening on an irregular basis....

Agencies do this even if you're not a good match for a position, or if they have positions that may come up. They even bring people in to the agency for interview too. But unless its a company themselves contacting you, I'd be very skeptical of agencies "offers" as you call them. In my experience most agencies jobs are not real, unless you are actually sitting in the company (not the agency) having an interview. Even then you might realise they sent you the wrong job.

Dannyboy83

BostonB wrote: »

Agencies do this even if you're not a good match for a position, or if they have positions that may come up. They even bring people in to the agency for interview too. But unless its a company themselves contacting you, I'd be very skeptical of agencies "offers" as you call them. In my experience most agencies jobs are not real, unless you are actually sitting in the company (not the agency) having an interview. Even then you might realise they sent you the wrong job.

Fair comment mate, no dispute.

none

Ginger wrote: »

Depending on your skill levels, experience, additional quals , Norway is doing ok.

http://www.finn.no/finn/job/fulltime/result?keyword=&EXTENT=&JOB_CATEGORY%2FCATEGORY=5409&category=s%F8k

Don't you need to be fluent in Norwegian? I got an email from those places a few months back which I replied to. They then said the job required a good command of Norwegian which I obviously never had. When I was there I got an impression they were normally OK with English but I guess I was wrong. The site you gave doesn't seem to have an English interface either.

Ginger

When I moved here, I only had yes and no in Norwegian. Depending on the type of place you are going and the level you are at, it can be a requirement or not. For me its not, I am based in Stavanger which is oil based so lots of foreign companies.

English will get you by but it helps to begin understanding it ..

Moonstar

doolox wrote: »

...
IT can be used to solve a lot of problems but the big problem is getting paid for it. How often have people downloaded or used software and not paid for it? A similar problem exists for music and film, enforcing payment and having a viable business model.
...

True, but there are alternative business models such as advertising funded which don't require direct customer payments. Also some micro-payment portals such as for the mobile software market still seem to do well.

none

Cheers, Ginger Out of curiosity, checked a few sites I could find (below) and probably less than 5% ads are in English which is not quite encouraging.

http://www.nav.no
http://www.jobb24.no
http://www.stepstone.no
http://norway.jobs.com

But there do seem to be more positions advertised over there (don't know how real they are). By the way, you stay there because of money or something else? I mean, I'm not interested in "something else" but I wouldn't mind knowing how the Norwegian net income is comparing to the Irish.

Ginger

Net take home is significantly better than it was in Ireland despite the fact that I am paying 45% tax and that isnt the highest tax bracket here.

Dannyboy83

Ginger wrote: »

Net take home is significantly better than it was in Ireland despite the fact that I am paying 45% tax and that isnt the highest tax bracket here.

I've heard similar stories of Germany from my sister.

Lower wages, higher taxes, but incomparablly better cost of living.........meaning much better quality of life.

zod

dubai .. quick

MrJones

anladmór wrote: »

im loling at people moving to australia(i mean people moving for anything other than a year out)

europe is fecked, nearly all are in a recession and some i think ireland,spain etc. are in depression. they need to join europe together properly so we can work together during this crisis. eu would have much larger budget than americans so that could stimulate european economy.

Why are you laughing at people moving to Australia? Lack of jobs as well or?

qwertz

Care to elaborate why you think Dubai is a good option at present?

zod wrote: »

dubai .. quick

vinus

thank you very much for this links we hope more