Tractor on M7 near Monasterevin

ForiegnNational

Travelling towards Dublin on the M8 yesterday morning at about midday, I was surprised to see a tractor, trailer and large load of round bales travelling down the hard lane heading towards Portlaoise.

The tractor was around junction 16, was blue (New Holland?) and looked new, however, isn't this illegal under Irish road traffic laws, and if so, did anybody else see it and get it's registration number?

Tech3

ForiegnNational wrote: »

isn't this illegal under Irish road traffic laws,

If it was on the motorway then yes its illegal.

mikemac

It is not illegal!

Once it is capable of going over 50km per hour it can use the motorway. Modern tractors are well capable of meeting and exceeding this speed

Page 23 from rules of the road.ie shows a tractor can use a motorway.

But yes, it was probably going below that speed and having loose bales can cause several accidents at speed if they fall off. So best to stay off it

csd

Tractor or not, driving in the hard shoulder is illegal, so if that's what the OP meant by 'hard lane', then the driver was breaking the law.

csd

mikemac

I see, I was referring to motorway driving, not driving on the hard shoulder.

Mylow

mikemac wrote: »

It is not illegal!

Once it is capable of going over 50km per hour it can use the motorway. Modern tractors are well capable of meeting and exceeding this speed

Page 23 from rules of the road.ie shows a tractor can use a motorway.

But yes, it was probably going below that speed and having loose bales can cause several accidents at speed if they fall off. So best to stay off it

It is not classed as a tractor if it can do 50km/h

Was it running white diesel?????? I bet it was on Agri/marked diesel. Revenue should confiscate the tractor if it was driving at 50km/h and running on Agri Diesel. A tractor is defined as vehicle that cannot exceed speeds of 24mph (39km/h). If it exceeds these limits then its a commercial vehicle. You now have Tacho, driving hour limits etc.

I used to run a small business, i couldnt use agri diesel, I had to have van and trailer tested every year. Agri contractors and farmers expect to have their cake and eat it.

Best secure the load rather than endanger other road users.

NFD100

That is madness! No other country would allow tractors on Motorways (50kph or not). Where were the guards?

marmurr1916

There definitely needs to be some clarity regarding agricultural vehicles on motorways.

On the one hand, for tax purposes, they're not supposed to be capable of doing over 39km/h.

On the other hand, for Road Traffic Act purposes, they're supposed to travel at a speed of at least 50km/h on motorways, speeds which they're clearly capable of achieving.

The best way to resolve this problem is to insert a clause into the Road Traffic Act which states that tractors and other agricultural vehicles are defined for that Act's purposes in the same way as they're defined for tax purposes, i.e. as vehicles with a top speed of 39km/h.

This legal definition should then be used to ban them from all motorways.

Carawaystick

But there is no minimum speed limit on motorways. you just have to be able to go faster than 50.
There are 50,60,80,100 and 120 speed limit sections on our motorways. If you weren't able to go slower than 50 kmh, how would you deal with traffic lights on motorways?
Or stop at lay by's on motorways?

ardmacha

Vehicles entitled to any concessions as agricultural vehicles, e.g. use of green diesel, motor tax, no NCT etc should be prohibited from motorways.

veryangryman

Why are we even having this debate?

Illegal or not, the law is not enforced on the banned vehicles from Motorways. Witness the L plates on the M50 any day of week to check this out

busman

Post on Farming and Forestry forum from another point of view on same topic ;-)

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055488709

It was mentioned that the RSA are bringing out new rules for tractors in the next few weeks.

They published a report in July 2008 which addressed the issue of tractors on the motorway, use of red diesel etc ...
http://www.rsa.ie/publication/publication/upload/Agri%20Report%20JULY%202008.pdf

One of the suggested solutions was to impose a 40km/h speed limit on tractors and hence it would be illegal for them to travel on Motorways!

ardmacha

Enforcement is clearly a problem in this country, whatever the regulations. However enforceable regulations are a good start, tractors capable of 50kmh confuse the issue just as people are allowed to display L plates on their car even if they are not learner drivers.

Irish and Proud

csd wrote: »

Tractor or not, driving in the hard shoulder is illegal, so if that's what the OP meant by 'hard lane', then the driver was breaking the law.

csd

Just let me re-phrase that...

Tractor (or not,) driving in the hard shoulder or any other part of a motorway is illegal, so if that's what the OP meant by 'hard lane', then the driver was breaking the law full stop.

Of course, the hard shoulder is not for driving in. I did read an old rule book which stated that a H/S on an all purpose road was generally for stationary vehicles, cyclists, and pedestrians. It also stated that if a slow moving vehicle (like a tractor etc) was causing a hold-up, then the said vehicle should make temporary use of the hard shoulder (once it's safe to do so) in order to let the traffic pass. I don't know what the rule is now.

On motorways, the H/S (should be called an emergency lane IMO) is for stopping in the case of an absolute emergency only. AFAIK, the H/S on motorways should also be used for acceleration from the emergency stop position. However, I don't know how safe that could be on the 2.5m H/S on the narrow median motorways.

Regards!

ForiegnNational

I had previously encountered a significant amount of ignorant commercial and aggricultural vehicles in my commuting around West Cork. Below is a transcription of an email I received to an enquiry I made as to the legality of this with the Department of Transport:

Use of agricultural and construction vehicles on Public Roads

There is no express law about holding up cars, etc behind a tractor (or other slow moving vehicle, construction plant, etc) so no particular offence is committed if the driver does not pull over but out of simple manners and courtesy a driver should pull over, when able, to let vehicles overtake and pass by.

However, there is an offence of driving without reasonable consideration (inconsiderate driving) which is a penalty point offence and a fixed charge offence offence since April 2006. The circumstances for the commission of that offence are not defined or limited to specific actions by a driver so potentially it could not be ruled out that, in a given set of circumstances, if the failure to permit traffic to pass was excessively unreasonable or so forth, a Garda could issue a fixed charge notice (€80/€120) and 2 penalty points would be incurred out of court on payment of the fixed charge or 4 penalty points would be incurred following conviction of that offence in court. I do not know if the holding up of a queue of traffic behind a tractor has ever given rise to prosecution of inconsiderate driving but potentially it could.

Use of agricultural tractors on public roads

The Road Safety Authority commissioned a report into the present law and practices regarding use of agricultural tractors on public roads and for quarry haulage etc and a detailed public consultation paper is published on www.rsa.ie . The issues that you refer to have surfaced in this consultation paper. The RSA are going to draw on the feedback received under the public consultation process and make recommendations for policy changes, if any, including any changes to road traffic law that are identified from the whole process.
<Name>
Department of Transport

Tech3

ForiegnNational wrote: »

I do not know if the holding up of a queue of traffic behind a tractor has ever given rise to prosecution of inconsiderate driving but potentially it could.

It has actually happened. A tractor was holding up around 20 cars last year on the main N60 road between claremorris and castlebar. Hes has a driving ban slapped on him for one year.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/road-ban-for-tractor-traffic-jam-farmer-1635180.html

I think any type of vehicle doing 50km on a motorway is absolutely dangerous. Its 70km/hr difference from normal moving traffic would easily cause an accident. Also large artic trucks should be limited to main roads and kept off local roads as much as possible. I guess it doesnt really matter as rules in this country dont seem to be ever enforced.

penexpers

Sure that's nothing. A few weeks ago I saw 2 cyclists on the M7 in between Naas and Newbridge.

mysterious

mikemac wrote: »

It is not illegal!

Once it is capable of going over 50km per hour it can use the motorway. Modern tractors are well capable of meeting and exceeding this speed

Page 23 from rules of the road.ie shows a tractor can use a motorway.

But yes, it was probably going below that speed and having loose bales can cause several accidents at speed if they fall off. So best to stay off it

lol at the laws, then whats the point in havin the law for tractors??

tractors still go verey slow and are a hazard on motorways?



WHO CAME UP WITH THAT LAW?

mysterious

penexpers wrote: »

Sure that's nothing. A few weeks ago I saw 2 cyclists on the M7 in between Naas and Newbridge.

At any rate they might even set up a market on the motorway now


But noooooooooooooooooooooooo, the gardai like to catch anyone going 120k/p/h on the 100k/p/h motorway unclassified sections:rolleyes:

Only in Ireland, only in ireland.........

corktina

Carawaystick wrote: »

But there is no minimum speed limit on motorways. you just have to be able to go faster than 50.
There are 50,60,80,100 and 120 speed limit sections on our motorways. If you weren't able to go slower than 50 kmh, how would you deal with traffic lights on motorways?
Or stop at lay by's on motorways?

ive not come across traffic lights on a motorway, but i have come across laybys both signed as such and not, but still used desite "Garda only" signs

Any vehicle at 50k on a motorway is a hazard...i think a minimum cruising speed of maybe 60 or 80 k should be made law.

Zoney

mysterious wrote: »

At any rate they might even set up a market on the motorway now


But noooooooooooooooooooooooo, the gardai like to catch anyone going 120k/p/h on the 100k/p/h motorway unclassified sections:rolleyes:

Only in Ireland, only in ireland.........

Don't they mostly catch people doing *over* 120 km/h on 100 km/h roads?

Carawaystick

corktina wrote: »

ive not come across traffic lights on a motorway, but i have come across laybys both signed as such and not, but still used desite "Garda only" signs

Any vehicle at 50k on a motorway is a hazard...i think a minimum cruising speed of maybe 60 or 80 k should be made law.

There's traffic lights on the M50 mainline southbound before the port tunnel entrance/N1 slip; there's traffic lights on the slip onto the M50 from the Coolock/Santry junction; there's Traffic lights on the junction between the new and old M1 east of Dublin Airport. Then there's traffic lights on the M50/M1/N32 junction; and at toll booths on the M1,M4,M8


What if the motorway speed limit on the motorway is 50 km/h? or 60 km/h
My only penalty points are for travelling at 81km/h on a motorway. and it wasn't a temporary limit reduction.

How would double deck busses travel on motorways if the imit was 80? even coaches or hgv's would struggle to comply with the law if they can only travel at one single speed on motorways.

mysterious

Zoney wrote: »

Don't they mostly catch people doing *over* 120 km/h on 100 km/h roads?

Yeah sure, I was just saying that slow hazard vehicles are more of a concern on motorways going 50kmh a hazard even. But of course it's ok by law apparently:rolleyes: Given the fact when you have gardai at checkpoints for people doing the proper speed limit of 120kph on waiting to be 120kph section of motorway. As it's against the law.

You missed my point.

mysterious

penexpers wrote: »

Sure that's nothing. A few weeks ago I saw 2 cyclists on the M7 in between Naas and Newbridge.

Thats is open public sucicide....... That motorway carries 55,000 cars a day.

And there were bikes on it. ROFL. I have to laugh purely for the fact, it just would NOT happen in other countries. I'm sure you would get well penalised for that.

corktina

Carawaystick wrote: »

There's traffic lights on the M50 mainline
How would double deck busses travel on motorways if the imit was 80? even coaches or hgv's would struggle to comply with the law if they can only travel at one single speed on motorways.

thats why i inserted the word "cruising":cool:

donvito99

mysterious wrote: »

Thats is open public sucicide....... That motorway carries 55,000 cars a day.

And there were bikes on it. ROFL. I have to laugh purely for the fact, it just would NOT happen in other countries. I'm sure you would get well penalised for that.

Happens in Italy and Spain all the time.