What's this supposed to be?

peasant

it shure aint what it's advertised at

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=1159209

they've got another conglomeration of bits and decals that's supposed to be a Porsche:

http://sportsandclassic2008.webzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=960241

Is it ???

Anan1

I think deep down the first one's a Beetle. I think the second one may be genuine-ish, though? Maybe not, if they built it 'from the ground up'?

Hifive

According to cartel its a Beetle,

UK One Star Vehicle Report
Vehicle Description
Registration SVG854N
Make VOLKSWAGEN
Model 1303
Description S BEETLE
Engine Capacity(cc) 1600
Year Manufactured
CO2 Emissions (g/Km)* Not Available
VRT Rate % ** Not Available

carchaeologist

Hmm,being a 1303,it would have the macpherson front struts,id like to see what setup is underneath it!Looks pretty ok?!

carchaeologist

For 57,500euro:eek: it would want to be genuine,the floor looks very beetle like,did the porsche have a similar pan layout?

PaulK_CCI

carchaeologist wrote: »

For 57,500euro:eek: it would want to be genuine,the floor looks very beetle like,did the porsche have a similar pan layout?

I would say it's a 356 recreation based on a Beetle floorpan. The fact that it is from 1970, sort of gives it away, since the 356 ran from 1949 until 1966. The speedster, which this car is trying hard to look like, ran from 1954 until 1959.
The picture of the engine bay shows a Type 1 (=vw) engine, and not a Porsche lump, most definitely not a Quad cam Carrera engine !!!

--amadeus--

General question - isn't it illegal under Trade Descriptions to advertise a replica as teh genuine article?

carlosfandango

I saw this dealer selling some vehicles at the Toys 4 Boys show in the RDS last year (or maybe it was TopGear?) and I thought they were being ambitious with their prices. I had seen this one and personally think it's a little OTT but whatever floats your boat.
They shouldn't be called Porsches, they are Kit Cars. I have nothing against Kit Cars, in fact there are some pretty amazing ones out there but a Dealer Shouldn't Be Allowed to call them Porsches. Right PaulK?

Here's a real Coupe for 24k stg -


A nice Speedster (but again a replica, this one an Apal) for less than 20k stg -


And finally, what a 356/912 engine should look like


CFD

--amadeus--

Hints in the small print:

By the advert
Welcome to the Porsche 356 Speedster from Tygan/SportandClassic Group

When I first read that I thought Tygan was part of thier group, especially since the best known 356 replicas are by Chesil. But a quick google brings up this

No mention in the 1st advert of it though. IMO opinion this is deliberately misleading, you'd need to be a little bit geeky to know and spot the difference on a preliminary inspection - less so for teh orange car but certainly the second one (no offence to the geeks here who rumbled it straight away!). This would be bad from a private seller, from a dealer I think it's pretty shocking.

carlosfandango

"This would be bad from a private seller, from a dealer I think it's pretty shocking"

Agreed

CFD

MercMad

The 356 is a replica, but unlike others it not fibre glass. It is a metal body and uses many original Porsche parts.

I have seen this car in the flesh and it is streets ahead of other kit cars.

I believe in the UK, where the car is made, if you use a certain number of original parts you can get it inspected and passed as a recreation as oppossed to a kit. I suppose this is what is done here.

Pricewise €57k was too much for it 12 months ago, and waaaaaaaaay too much nowdays, but if you dont ask you wont get !

--amadeus--

A lot of cars on the website now have pretty good cash discounts so I'm sure they are up for an offer.

On teh recreation / replica thing it's a pretty fine distinction but if Cartel says Beetle then legally it's a Beetle, right? Even so the advert description should - IMO - mention that it's not originally a Porsche.

PaulK_CCI

It's a grey area, because effectively the add DOES state that this car is from Tygan (which was taken over by Chesil), so they're not hiding it completely.

If you would be interested in a car like this, I would be pretty positive someone would do their homework and it would be pretty clear this is not a genuine 356 Speedster Carrera... Even though the price tag is high, a genuine Speedster "Carrera", if for sale at all (!!!) would be a good few multiples more of the current price tag, since a genuine "Fuhrman" quad-cam Carrera engine alone would be worth in excess of 100k !!!!

You can pick up fibreglass 'kits/recreations/replica's' for anything as little as 12-15k, but as MercMad says, there is a huge difference in build quality and finish. The cheap ones are plastic tubs, on a beetle pan, the more expensive ones are using genuine metal body parts, and have an incredibly high standard of finish, but ultimately it will always remain a replica/recreation based on an existing VW beetle chassis. The fact that they didn't bother to fit a 356/912 engine means that this car is indeed way overpriced for what it is.

green-blood

--amadeus-- wrote: »

A lot of cars on the website now have pretty good cash discounts so I'm sure they are up for an offer.

On teh recreation / replica thing it's a pretty fine distinction but if Cartel says Beetle then legally it's a Beetle, right? Even so the advert description should - IMO - mention that it's not originally a Porsche.

yeah but if it was advertised as a beetle, it wouldn't really be the truth