London in a day. March 18th 2009

Steyr · 06-02-2009 10:38pm #1

Hi all, myself and Vulcan and a mate of mine are off spotting to London on March 18th going from Carnmore to Luton, were hoping to get in "lootin","The Row",and "LCY" all in the one day so who wants shots of what?

Im guesssing alot of A380 shots for the forum??

vulcan57 · 07-02-2009 9:51am

Steyr wrote: »

Im guesssing alot of A380 shots for the forum??

Hate to put a damper on it but, as far as I know, the three airlines that are using A380's into Heathrow all land in the morning. The landing rotation for runway 27L (the best runway for spotting) means that they will be landing there from 15.00 that week. Shame, I was hoping to see one, will just have to wait till the summer.

Should be a good day though all the same.

Foggy43 · 07-02-2009 7:02pm

There are currently 3 A380's per day at LHR and one other 3 times a week.

Singapore SQ322 in at 0545 and out as SQ317 at 1115
UAE EK001 in at 1135 and out as EK002 at 1345
Singapore SQ318 in at 1850 and out as SQ321 at 2205
and
Qantas Tues, Fri and Sat QF31 in at 0620 and out as QF32 at 1115

As vulcan57 says 27L, wind permitting, will be the evening landing runway.

tracker-man · 07-02-2009 10:37pm

Might go to Carnmore and see ye off beforehand

vulcan57 · 08-02-2009 4:21pm

tracker-man wrote: »

Might go to Carnmore and see ye off beforehand

Hope you are an early riser, our flight is the 07.15 to Luton. Shame you couldn't come with us.

Foggy43 · 17-03-2009 7:09pm

Last minute info!
The wind direction has changed today and is due to stay like this for a few days. An Easterly wind meaning at Heathrow landings on both 09R/09L and take offs from 09R.

I'm sure you will have a scanner with you tomorrow in case mother nature changes her mind again. If not you can PM me and I will text you of any changes. Previous like this the A380's have landed on 09R.

Steyr · 17-03-2009 7:49pm

Cheers Foggy, il get Vulcan to PM you, fancy meeting us?

combat5 · 17-03-2009 8:10pm

:eek: not the greats news you whant to hear the day before you go well you cant win them all i hope steyr ,my dad, and your mate have a good day

tracker-man · 17-03-2009 9:42pm

Well have fun, the skies will be blue, plenty of shots ( the photo type;) )

Fratton Fred · 17-03-2009 11:42pm

If it is aneasterly then I take it landings are over Windsor.

Which runway is which at LHR?

Davidth88 · 18-03-2009 1:23pm

09 l/r means the approach is from the west....

09 is the way the runway is pointing , ie 090 degrees.... east
27 is west.

09left is the northerly r/w 27left is the south runway.

If they are landing on the 09's then no easy place to spot/photograph that I know of, but then again its 12-13 years since I was spotting

on the 27's then Hatton Cross is your best place ( or used to be )

Put it this way , I remember when they were 28/10 ( magnetic drift and all that !)

Enjoy your day , have a pint in the Green Man ( if it's still there ) for me

Fratton Fred · 18-03-2009 3:50pm

Blimey, that's all a bit complex. I guess the problem with a westerly approach is that the M25 is about where you would want to be. Have you tried the carpark at the sailing club on the QE2 reservoir?

Davidth88 · 18-03-2009 4:00pm

Seems complex ... but no

Left and right are exactly that if you are approaching the runway then the left one is on your left :-)

They used to swap over left and right for landing/takeoffs around 14:30 to give the residents a break , no idea if they still do it.

No I didn't because to be honest when I was spotting at LHR we used to drive the perimeter rd , check cargo/biz, we would know which airliners we needed to see ( ie any new ones/unusual ones ) then go off. Rarely did we stay for long unless we knew something was due.

It was usually off to the ' hall ( Mildenhall ), or elsewhere.......

In those days the QUeens Building was still operational so you could go there , or on the car parks.

Foggy43 · 19-03-2009 12:03am

Davidth88 wrote: »

Seems complex ... but no

Left and right are exactly that if you are approaching the runway then the left one is on your left :-)

They used to swap over left and right for landing/takeoffs around 14:30 to give the residents a break , no idea if they still do it.

No I didn't because to be honest when I was spotting at LHR we used to drive the perimeter rd , check cargo/biz, we would know which airliners we needed to see ( ie any new ones/unusual ones ) then go off. Rarely did we stay for long unless we knew something was due.

It was usually off to the ' hall ( Mildenhall ), or elsewhere.......

In those days the QUeens Building was still operational so you could go there , or on the car parks.

Only on 27L and R is there a 1500 hours change over. Between 0430 and 0700 depending on congestion landing aircraft alternate between, depending on wind direction, 27L/R or 09L/R.

The Perimeter Road or Perry Track used to have places for enthusiasts to view but are gone now at the 09L/R end, due to T5. Things were made more difficult today due to this http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7950295.stm

Tenger · 19-03-2009 8:13am

Foggy43 wrote: »

There are currently 3 A380's per day at LHR and one other 3 times a week.

Singapore SQ322 in at 0545 and out as SQ317 at 1115
UAE EK001 in at 1135 and out as EK002 at 1345
Singapore SQ318 in at 1850 and out as SQ321 at 2205
and
Qantas Tues, Fri and Sat QF31 in at 0620 and out as QF32 at 1115

The chance of getting 3 operators together is quite slim then. You would need outbound delays and the QF to come in early/on time. Am wondering how many can be handled at the one time. Have only ever seen the SQ and EK beside each other at T3.You can see them as you take off from 27L.

Am wondering will I see the SQ and EK together in JFK next week. EI use the gates beside the where EK board (A7)

vulcan57 · 19-03-2009 8:47am

Well, we had a pretty good day even if it did not go to plan, but you can't controll the weather so we did'nt even bother with LHR. We spent an hour and a half or so at LCY but seemed to be a bit dead for some reason, was'nt till we got back to central London that we could see aircraft flying over one after the other (including an Aer Arann ATR). Have some pictures that we will post later today. Already planning another trip for later in the year. Oh yeh! We saw an A380! just a speck high up in the sky above LCY on hold for LHR, but we saw one!!

Davidth88 · 19-03-2009 10:40am

Ohhhh tell all what happened , fog ?

London City is often quiet , I almost said to you not to waste your time and go and visit the IWM instead :-)

vulcan57 · 19-03-2009 12:57pm

Davidth88 wrote: »

Ohhhh tell all what happened , fog ?

London City is often quiet , I almost said to you not to waste your time and go and visit the IWM instead :-)

I've been there a few times before and it has been quite busy for a small air port.

Davidth88 · 19-03-2009 1:41pm

The only reason I said that was because I worked in Canary Wharf for a week and only saw departures every 30 mins or so.

What happened to the day , were you delayed getting to the Luton or something ?

Bit of a shame

Steyr · 19-03-2009 4:31pm

Davidth88 wrote: »

What happened to the day , were you delayed getting to the Luton or something ?

Bit of a shame

Nope infact Aer Arann delivered us 10mins ahead of schedule to Luton and back to Carnmore! Because the WX changed the Runways at LHR and because we dont drive we were hoping to have been hanging around at Myrtle Avenue but as the Runways changed we didnt know any of the other Spotting areas at LHR so didnt bother going out there after all, we did see the Queen though!

vulcan57 · 19-03-2009 8:31pm

Davidth88 wrote: »

Ohhhh tell all what happened , fog ?

London City is often quiet , I almost said to you not to waste your time and go and visit the IWM instead :-)

Just dug these out David. They are two of several that I took last June of aircraft jossling for take off.

Steyr · 19-03-2009 9:58pm

Bramble wrote: »

The chance of getting 3 operators together is quite slim then.

Not really, here's a post from yesterday from UKAR, they seem to be coming up alot like this on shots in any one day in one post from different posters:

http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=7455

Qantas,Emirates ( which we seen Orbiting ), and Singapore all present.

Davidth88 · 20-03-2009 6:53am

Ok I stand corrected

However Hs146's just don't float my boat for some reason... interestign looking biz in the first one though.

Where did you see The Queen ?

Steyr · 20-03-2009 1:40pm

Davidth88 wrote: »

Where did you see The Queen ?

Passed us by in a convoy through the Mall as we walked down it to Buckingham Palace.

Fratton Fred · 20-03-2009 2:30pm

Steyr wrote: »

Passed us by in a convoy through the Mall as we walked down it to Buckingham Palace.

In the big Roller surrounded by Police on Motorbikes?

It is quite impressive they way they whisk her through town.

Did ya get a photo?

Steyr · 20-03-2009 3:52pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

In the big Roller surrounded by Police on Motorbikes?

It is quite impressive they way they whisk her through town.

Did ya get a photo?

In a range rover, convoy was 2 police bikes and 3 Range Rovers lights on but no Sirens. Wish we had a shot but no, was funny though as we were saying to our mate "you might see the Queen you know" and a few minutes larter she passes by:pac:

Fratton Fred · 20-03-2009 4:48pm

They usually have about 6 to 8 bikes, 2 with Queenie and the rest going on and stopping the traffic, blocking roundabouts etc so the convoy never has to stop. No point being the Queen if you have to stop at traffic lights!

They're taking off on 09r (did I get that right?) at the moment, a few lads are at myrtle avenue with their cameras enjoying the sunshine!

vulcan57 · 20-03-2009 7:11pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

They're taking off on 09r (did I get that right?) at the moment, a few lads are at myrtle avenue with their cameras enjoying the sunshine!

After 3pm today (and all this week) they will be landing on 09R if the wind is still easterly, so you won't see too much at myrtle ave unless the wind has changed in which case landings will be on 27L. If that is the case they will get plenty of pics at Myrlte Ave (lucky beggers!)

Foggy43 · 20-03-2009 8:22pm

09L is strictly a landing runway. Has not been used for take off since Concorde's brief return following the Paris disaster.

09R is used for take off all day with landings allowed. The A380's will more than lightly land on 09R.

The 3pm changeover only applies to 27L/R and in high winds from the west it will be 27L for the duration.

The only hope of getting photo's of 09R is from Terminal 5's multi storey car park. You cant use the top level as there is a high fence blocking the view. You should get a view of landing aircraft but they can be few and far between. You will not get better than Myrtle Ave and 27L landings. Westerly winds not expected till Monday.

vulcan57 · 20-03-2009 10:38pm

Foggy43 wrote: »

09L is strictly a landing runway. Has not been used for take off since Concorde's brief return following the Paris disaster.

09R is used for take off all day with landings allowed. The A380's will more than lightly land on 09R.

The 3pm changeover only applies to 27L/R and in high winds from the west it will be 27L for the duration.

The only hope of getting photo's of 09R is from Terminal 5's multi storey car park. You cant use the top level as there is a high fence blocking the view. You should get a view of landing aircraft but they can be few and far between. You will not get better than Myrtle Ave and 27L landings. Westerly winds not expected till Monday.

I'm sorry my friend, but you are totally confusing me. Everything Ive read, and the times I've been there, there has been one runway for landings and one runway for take off's which makes total sense for safety when you've got an aircraft landing and taking off every 90 secs. If 27L is being used for landings at any particular time then 27R would be used for take-offs. These schedules are for the presumed westerly-ish winds, if the winds turn easterly then the same runways will be used for the same purpose but in the oppersite direction, hence 09R (opersite of 27L) for landings and 09L (opersite of 27R) for take-offs. How is it that the A380's are more than likely to land on 09R? Does this mean that it will land with the wind most of the time instead of into it? and does this mean that if 27L is the alloted landing runway that morning that all landing aircraft have to be put on hold while the A380 lands on that runway in the opersite direction? The 3pm change over only applies to 27L/R because they give the landing runways in the schedule with the other being the take off runway.

vulcan57 · 21-03-2009 12:22pm

OK, Foggy, Just found out the reason for the A380s and R/W 09R. Its because not all taxiways are cleared for A380s and its easier for them to taxi when landing on 09R. I'm not saying you don't know what you're tlking about just find it confusing. Anyway thats one questioned answered.

Foggy43 · 21-03-2009 5:35pm

Lets see if I can explain this a little better!

With winds from the west all aircraft will land and take off from 27L/R. As you are aware normally one will be used for landings and the other for take offs until 3pm when there will be a runway changeover.
With winds from the east 09L is a landing runway only. Why? I do not know. No changeover. 09R is used for both landing and take offs and we agree the A380's use 09L for landing.

On the 27L/R the A380 has been instructed in the past to land on the take off runway. Only if the landing separation cannot be kept and prevent a go-around. It is an accepted norm there will be on average 3 go-arounds a day as separation cannot be kept.

Today it has been 27L/R. Wind speed this morning was zero and so was the temperature.

vulcan57 · 21-03-2009 6:30pm

Foggy43 wrote: »

Lets see if I can explain this a little better!

With winds from the west all aircraft will land and take off from 27L/R. As you are aware normally one will be used for landings and the other for take offs until 3pm when there will be a runway changeover.
With winds from the east 09L is a landing runway only. Why? I do not know. No changeover. 09R is used for both landing and take offs and we agree the A380's use 09L for landing.

On the 27L/R the A380 has been instructed in the past to land on the take off runway. Only if the landing separation cannot be kept and prevent a go-around. It is an accepted norm there will be on average 3 go-arounds a day as separation cannot be kept.

Today it has been 27L/R. Wind speed this morning was zero and so was the temperature.

I see what you are saying now, on easterly ops there are no alternations. Apparently, there are plans afoot to make both runways dual use, ie. both landing and take off to increase usage by up to 10% (is that right?). Thanks for the clarification. I will be bearing this in mind for my next visits in July.

Foggy43 · 21-03-2009 7:56pm

I have heard of these plans. A while ago now. There was even talk of using the same steep approach to land as used in LCY.

At the moment surviving this economic downturn is the main issue at Heathrow.

Fratton Fred · 23-03-2009 10:37am

I know this is off topic Foggy, but what are the general thoughts reagrding the sell off of three airports? I'm not surprised at Hgatwick, but I thought they would keep hold of Stansted.

Foggy43 · 23-03-2009 4:37pm

There isn't any talk of this around LHR. Well not on the shop floor. Everyone is far more concerned about surviving this depression. It would appear the media are the only ones discussing it.

Word now is that most airlines will ground 10% of their fleet.

Fratton Fred · 23-03-2009 4:55pm

Foggy43 wrote: »

There isn't any talk of this around LHR. Well not on the shop floor. Everyone is far more concerned about surviving this depression. It would appear the media are the only ones discussing it.

Word now is that most airlines will ground 10% of their fleet.

That is a lot of planes.

BMI have cut one of their flights on the DUB/LHR route and I see they have also cut LHR - Bradford (Why any would want to fly that is beyond me though).

I know they were talking about flying empty planes out of Heathrow though to preserve the slots, not sure how necessary that may be. Apparantly Lufthansa may use some BMI slots for themselves and their new route from LHR to Malpensa.

London in a day. March 18th 2009

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