VRT appeal

PCwiggum

Hi guys,

I plan to make a VRT appeal next week and I'm looking for some advice. I know there have been many threads on this subject in the past, but I'd like to explain my particular case, so if you have time please bare with me and I'll give as much detail as possible.

OK, so first up I planned to buy an X-Type Jag in Cargiant. I was planning on buying an '06 Sport version, done my figures using the VRT calculator etc. etc., no problems. Anyone who has dealt with Cargiant may already know that they will only hold a car for 24hours for their Irish customers, so of course on the day I went to hold the car it had already been sold. Luckily enough a new car came on the market, it was a year older, Sport Premium and a thousand pound dearer. The problem here was this version is not on the VRT website, so I rang my local VRT office in Dundalk and was given a bit of a run around before finally finding out if I went in in person they would give me a quote. So took the time of work, went to Dundalk for a quote, before my evening flight to the UK, and was told "err, Sport Premium isn't on our system, sure we'll go with the Sport version as long as the emissions are the same" and he gave a quote of EUR3683.

Next up, bought the car and arrived in the VRT first thing Monday morning armed with my bank draft for EUR3683. Of course the inevitable happened - "Sure this is a Sport PREMIUM, we'll have to contact Rosslare to get the right price". I just got a quote this evening for just shy of EUR4000, leaving me pretty annoyed as you can imagine.

OK, so thats that off me chest - here are the facts I intend presenting for my appeal...

1. Sunday Independant advert (dated 1st feb 09) for new 2.0D X-Type Limited edition at EUR29,400 - my 4 year old car is given an OMSP of 20K according to the revenue. (Not much depreciation there IMO).

2. Some facts and figures from Parkers website and VRT calculator...
Sport - UK new list price = £22517. OMSP 4 year old EUR18419
SE - UK new list price = £25517. OMSP 4 year old EUR18681
Sport Premium - UK new list price = £25695. OMSP 4 year old EUR20000
Sovereign - UK new list price = £28395. OMSP 4 year old EUR21892

As you can see above, my model is just under £200 dearer than an SE version for a new model in the UK, but a 4 year old car is valued at nearly EUR1500 more in Ireland.


I would also like to have some price comparisons to similar spec cars in Ireland but I haven't come across any yet.

I was also thinking of contacting an Irish Jaguar dealer for an estimate on my car, but I think it would be a bit cheeky of me especially in the current climate.

Finally, (if you're still with me), the most annoying thing for me was the time I wasted running up and down to the VRT office only to get a useless quotation - this is what is pushing me to appeal. Would it be a good idea to make a complaint about this in my appeal, or would I be better off keeping a lid on it?

I'm particularly interested in hearing from people who have made a successful appeal but everyone's views and advice is very much appreciated. Ta.

copacetic

I don't think giving UK prices will help your case at all, you need to get examples of actual similar cars here being cheaper that your OMSP even if they aren't the same spec. carzone ads, dealer websites etc, even pictures of cars with sticker prices etc.

EKRIUQ

€317 could be put down to difference in mileage and it's not a huge difference when it comes to VRT

Esel

Is it worth the hassle for €300 though?

bikki

esel wrote: »

Is it worth the hassle for €300 though?

Id say yes, look how many of us just pay the extra VRT and walk away, the goverment is already making god knows how much off a tax which we shouldnt be paying in the first place.

PCwiggum

esel wrote: »

Is it worth the hassle for €300 though?

€300 is better in my pocket than theirs - Anyway I think the original quote of €3683 is way off base, going by the new car price.

And as I said before, I was more annoyed about getting the run around when I tried to get a proper quotation - "Sorry we're too busy to give quotes over the phone, you'll have to quit work early, take a spin up from Drogheda to Dundalk and come in and see us in person, then we'll give you a quote that you could have got from the website but it will be totally useless when come in and try to pay"

Anan1

I had a similar situation in the middle of last year when I was thinking of importing a 2006 Forester 2.5XT auto, was being quoted VRT on an OMSP of €30,000. I ended up buying a brand new one here for €34,800. I'd appeal, you'll need as many details as possible of similar cars on sale here for less than their OMSP. Good luck.

jetfiremuck

I cleared a Discovery mpi which is a base 2.0 petrol Discovery last June before the change and was charged more VRT than what the full spec V8 or TDi was. I did the following.Printed off the Parker guides for new and used prices for my vehicle and the other Discoverys that were used on the ROS site. Four months later I got a refund of approx 48% of the VRT charged in a cheque. Provide as much data as you can. I was told by many "waste of time, It is what it is etc.etc. The appeal process is set up for that purpose. Good Luck.

PCwiggum

jetfiremuck wrote: »

I cleared a Discovery mpi which is a base 2.0 petrol Discovery last June before the change and was charged more VRT than what the full spec V8 or TDi was. I did the following.Printed off the Parker guides for new and used prices for my vehicle and the other Discoverys that were used on the ROS site. Four months later I got a refund of approx 48% of the VRT charged in a cheque. Provide as much data as you can. I was told by many "waste of time, It is what it is etc.etc. The appeal process is set up for that purpose. Good Luck.

Excellent, glad to hear that worked out for you. Parkers is brilliant for getting the type of information required - its such a pity we haven't anything to compare.

By anychance did you notice if they revised the vrt website, or was it left as is?

Car-dealer

Simple Procedure for Appeal:

1. see carzone and autotrader and other sites for prices of same car, same make and model, same year, similar mileage.

2. work out the lower end prices

3. print off list of these

4. work out the rough average price for your car in Ireland: does it come in below the OMSP?

5. Very important: remember to write that "these market prices are Aksing Prices, and are not end of sale agreed prices, which tend to be 10% lower" i.e. car is advertised at €10,000 and punter will go in and say I have €9000 will you take that, dealer says yes.

6. put your case together in a letter, with evidence of the above, and state very clearly that the VRT system has overestimated your OMSP and thus your VRT payable.

7. Yes do this: claim €100 for lost interest on your money and time used to execute your appeal due to the incorrect VRT rate.

Be very clear and be very direct!

lastly, Ive set up my company and import cars direct from the UK for customers and offer similar prices to cargiant, but I look after everything, from buying to transport to vrt -- I could have saved you all this hassle.

Will have new website and details up and running shortly - although the mods on this site dont allow advertising, so just saying before you drop your biscuit in your tea!

Lastly: stats are about 80% of those that appeal win! also, everyone should appeal, the system is over charging, but this is also one of the most paraxdoxical things Ive ever said as the whole system is one big fraud!

PCwiggum

Car-dealer wrote: »

Simple Procedure for Appeal:

1. see carzone and autotrader and other sites for prices of same car, same make and model, same year, similar mileage.

2. work out the lower end prices

3. print off list of these

4. work out the rough average price for your car in Ireland: does it come in below the OMSP?

5. Very important: remember to write that "these market prices are Aksing Prices, and are not end of sale agreed prices, which tend to be 10% lower" i.e. car is advertised at €10,000 and punter will go in and say I have €9000 will you take that, dealer says yes.

6. put your case together in a letter, with evidence of the above, and state very clearly that the VRT system has overestimated your OMSP and thus your VRT payable.

7. Yes do this: claim €100 for lost interest on your money and time used to execute your appeal due to the incorrect VRT rate.

Be very clear and be very direct!

lastly, Ive set up my company and import cars direct from the UK for customers and offer similar prices to cargiant, but I look after everything, from buying to transport to vrt -- I could have saved you all this hassle.

Will have new website and details up and running shortly - although the mods on this site dont allow advertising, so just saying before you drop your biscuit in your tea!

Lastly: stats are about 80% of those that appeal win! also, everyone should appeal, the system is over charging, but this is also one of the most paraxdoxical things Ive ever said as the whole system is one big fraud!

Thanks for that - very informative. I've already started to compile my list and its working out about €3000 lower than the OMSP on average, but that's just based on asking price - I'll rememer to stress this as you say above. Thanks again, I'll look out for you again next time I'm in the market.

mickey mac

I have had some dealings with the VRT office in Dundalk, and it amazed me how they managed to assemble such a group of brainless individuals in one office, it's like every day is their first, none of them can answer a question by themselves, they just shout around the office on the off chance that someone knows the answer, so there's no point trying to keep your business private! and if you do get an answer from them, make sure it's in writing, cause they also suffer from selective amnesia!

Also OP you probably picked a bad week to visit them, cause I'd say they are busy trying to figure out what pension levy means, I'm sure if they shout the question enough, someone will explain it to them.

HAMMERCURRENT

Good luck with your appeal, the vrt valuation seems very high alright.

ollie68

esel wrote: »

Is it worth the hassle for €300 though?

Its well for some that 300 euro seems so little .If you are being told a certain quote I think it should stay at that quote or be less .

kuro_man

Whether you appeal or not (and I think you should) you should also submit a complaint to the National Consumer Agency www.consumerconnect.ie

I have complained to them before that the current VRT process makes price comparison impossible as VRT amount (and therefore, total cost of the car) cannot be guaranteed until you present the car and/or appear the decision. The is technically in breach on EU consumer legislation. They recently forced the airlines to quote final prices on their websites for this very reason, so why not cars.

The National Consumer Agency replied by email and said I have a valid point that deserves investigation. Haven't heard anthing since, but the more the point is raised with them, the more likely they will do something.

PCwiggum

kuro_man wrote: »

Whether you appeal or not (and I think you should) you should also submit a complaint to the National Consumer Agency www.consumerconnect.ie

I have complained to them before that the current VRT process makes price comparison impossible as VRT amount (and therefore, total cost of the car) cannot be guaranteed until you present the car and/or appear the decision. The is technically in breach on EU consumer legislation. They recently forced the airlines to quote final prices on their websites for this very reason, so why not cars.

The National Consumer Agency replied by email and said I have a valid point that deserves investigation. Haven't heard anthing since, but the more the point is raised with them, the more likely they will do something.

Yep, I'll definately appeal, based on the advice here all I need to do is a little bit of research, put my facts and figures together in a letter and wait to see what comes of it (hopefully I'll be a few quid better off).

Good advice about the National Consumer Agency, I'll do my best to add a bit of weight to your original complaint. - You try to do the right thing by getting a decent quotation before making your purchase, only to be given false information.

Skyuser

Question :
Lets say a car has two vrt options with two differnt emissions. One with 20% and one with 28%. Could someone just print off the 20% option from website and hand into vrt office with cheque or will the person check to see what emissions the car has?

Esel

The VRO will take the emissions figure from the V5.