Policing on the cheap; the reality

metman

PCSO boredom 'causing misconduct'


Twenty PCSOs were sacked by the Metropolitan Police in 2008

Boredom and a lack of motivation is causing some police community support officers (PCSOs) in London to commit criminal offences, a report has said.

PCSOs were responsible for the majority of cases of gross misconduct in the Metropolitan Police in 2008, despite making up only 20% of the workforce. Some felt akin to "glorified security guards", the force's HR director said. The role was created to put more uniformed police on streets and to take some duties away from other officers. The Police Federation has described the introduction of PCSOs as "policing on the cheap", while other critics have expressed concern that PCSOs have no power to arrest suspected criminals. Senior officers at Scotland Yard are to review the role of civilians in PCSO positions as a result of the report.

'Damaging culture'

In more than half of the 35 cases of gross misconduct against PCSOs in the Met in 2008, employees were sacked or reprimanded for offences such as drinking and driving or other motoring crimes. On other occasions, police computers were misused or there was inappropriate behaviour, while in one case, a false allegation was made by a PCSO. In all, 20 PCSOs were sacked, while there were formal reprimands for the other 15.

The role of PCSOs is to be reviewed in the wake of the report's findings Another 20 cases of less serious misconduct were recorded. Some PCSOs felt the scope of their roles was severely limited and they were not able to use all of their skills and experience as a result, said Martin Tiplady, the director of human resources at Scotland Yard.

"This led to feelings of boredom, reduced motivation and increased discipline activity," he added.

And there was a damaging "us and them" culture within the force between sworn-in officers and PCSOs, Mr Tiplady said in his report. Making recommendations about how the situation could be improved in future, he added: "Instances of discipline are less likely to be committed where there are mixed teams, strong consistent supervision, a variety of work and, crucially, where individuals and teams understand how they contribute to effective policing."

The force's watchdog, the Metropolitan Police Authority, is due to discuss the findings at a meeting on Thursday afternoon.

Source
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Finally the powers that be have no other option but to acknowledge that which police officers already knew; hiring poorly paid, poorly trained civilians and putting them in police uniforms with minimal policing powers is not an alternative to hiring/training sworn officers. However, will anything be done? Of course not. If you look at the recruitment site for the Police, very few forces are now recruiting for police officers, yet nearly every force is taking on PCSOs. The government would get rid of PCs tomorrow if they thought they could get away with it.....from their point of view police pensions cost too much money, and are an unnecessary expenditure....a view the Dáil shares evidently.

gilly0512

metman wrote: »

Finally the powers that be have no other option but to acknowledge that which police officers already knew; hiring poorly paid, poorly trained civilians and putting them in police uniforms with minimal policing powers is not an alternative to hiring/training sworn officers. However, will anything be done? Of course not. If you look at the recruitment site for the Police, very few forces are now recruiting for police officers, yet nearly every force is taking on PCSOs. The government would get rid of PCs tomorrow if they thought they could get away with it.....from their point of view police pensions cost too much money, and are an unnecessary expenditure....a view the Dáil shares evidently.

Metman what is the difference between PCSOs and Special Constables. My take on it is that PCSOs would be somewhat similar to our own Reserves in that they both have little or no powers, but don't Specials in the UK have pretty much full Police powers once trained, I even think that Specials can drive Police vehicles in some UK forces? Also would regulars have a better relationship with specials than say the PCSOs, or is there major distrust between the regular and all part-timers?

ScubaDave

Do they carry warrant cards on and/or off duty?

JonAnderton

"I'm bored at work so I'll drink and drive"..?????

I know their access to Crimint and CRIS has caused a few concerns on a borough my mate works in. When they started they only had 'write access' but they complained they couldn't 'research' their nominals so they got viewing access... and within days they were looking at all sorts of stuff they had no need to. And why they need job access to the internet is beyond me...

This video shows my favourite PCSO in the whole world...:rolleyes: (It's on a whole different subject, but watch til 4mins, his parting shot is brilliant!)

I stop and speak to people doing this every day... I've never had a problem when I explain why I'm speaking to them... Obviously his interpersonal skills need a little... improvement.

And people complain we're abusing Sec 44...

Eru

In fairness Jon that was obviously organised to get exactly that reaction from someone in uniform. He was pretty much ambushed. I presume that show was aired with a distinct one sided angle?

Still it also shows that the guy had no power and little knowledge or his powers. Oh and I agree with him, you shouldnt be allowed ram a camera in someones face.

JonAnderton

Even more reason why he should have been professional then...;) that was my point

If you're dealing with a bloke with a camera, you got to assume 1) it's turned on and 2) it's going to be thrown up on youtube/facebook (unless you're the TSG in Soho of course)

Paulzx

The lack of judgement shown by that PCSO is ridiculous. whether he was provoked or not is irellevant. When someone shoves a camera in your face you smile and say nothing.

Telling him to shut up has made the journo's day.

I certainly wouldn't like to be depending on that guy when things get tough

gilly0512

JonAnderton wrote: »

Even more reason why he should have been professional then...;) that was my point

If you're dealing with a bloke with a camera, you got to assume 1) it's turned on and 2) it's going to be thrown up on youtube/facebook (unless you're the TSG in Soho of course)

Jon sorry for asking the same question again, but what are the differences between PCSOs and Special Constables? Also in the clip you attached, both of those men were PCSOs, so unlike our Reserves they are obviously allowed to patrol on their own?

Eru

gilly2308 wrote: »

Jon sorry for asking the same question again, but what are the differences between PCSOs and Special Constables? Also in the clip you attached, both of those men were PCSOs, so unlike our Reserves they are obviously allowed to patrol on their own?

They are civilian neighbourhood watch like the ones you see in the states. Civvies patrol with uniforms, tshirts or whatever and if they see crime they ring it in and record details as evidence.

In the states its a neighbourhood thing done on a voluntary basis so really just neighbours looking out for their areas. In the UK its a government initiative with uniforms, radios and rosters.

JonAnderton

gilly2308 wrote: »

Jon sorry for asking the same question again, but what are the differences between PCSOs and Special Constables? Also in the clip you attached, both of those men were PCSOs, so unlike our Reserves they are obviously allowed to patrol on their own?

PCSO's aren't really just civillans in uniform (although they're close to it). They are fully paid up members of the Met's "Extended Police Family" and are officially police staff (which means, once in, are entitled to apply for any other civilian posts in the job, appropriate to their pay grade) and their job ID is that of a civilian staff member. They were intorduced to increase the number of 'uniforms' on the street and came in around the same time as Safer Neighbourhoods.

Although they didn't have the ability to report crimes, people could 'approach' them with community concerns and the idea was that they would pend all their time out on patrol as they wouldn't have any of the 'paperwork' or custody procedures to deal with.

They have the power to detain anyone for up to 30 minutes (in order for a constable to arrive) to either search or arrest, etc and a lot of new legislation is being designed to include them, in particular antisocial behaviour legislation, so powers that before were empowered to contables, are being given to PCSO's as well, such as issuing certain fixed penalty tickets.

Full list of their powers contained here

http://www.respect.gov.uk/members/article.aspx?id=8210

PCSO's are supposed to patrol on their own but are usually seen, congregating in groups of three, four or five on street corners or canteens...

They were originally all assigned to neighbourhood teams, security patrols in Westminster or Transport for London. Met traffic wardens all became PCSO's. Now, they're appearing in victim care units and there was an attempt to make all station reception officers PCSO's which I think is being rolled out. The rumor was that all job civilians would eventually come under the PCSO umbrella.

Met ones don't carry any officer safety kit and carry just a hi viz jacket (often poncho rolled on their belt kit??). BTP ones successfully lobbied and got permission to carry handcuffs which lead to Met one's moan on about wanting all sorts of stuff.

Their uniform is designed to be different to a constables in the colour, badge, identification badges and cap band altough, much to our annoyance, they usually got their hands on MetVest covers and jackets with officers style badges. This has hopefully been sorted out with the new corporate clothing badge. They have their own vehicle fleet which has Police Support markings and different livery to normal police vehicles to avoid confusion but are always seen in marked police vehicles for whatever reason.

Specials, on the other hand are voluntary (non paid) people who work a few shifts a month and when on duty, have all the powers, equipment, uniform and permissions as regular officers. They have warrant cards denoting they are special constables. Specials can patrol on their own or with regulars or other specials. Some boroughs have their own Specials vehicles but they can patrol in normal police vehicles as they are, regular police, when on duty.

It used to be that a certain route into the job was to be a special first as it would give you some exposure and experience of the job. People now are being told that the ONLY route in is to be a PCSO first!

Interestinly, SCD6, economic crime, have recruited civilian accountants as Specials to assist them. They have all the qualifications from their private lives, combined with the powers and permissions of regular police.. A very clever idea.

Oh, PCSO's get about £25,000 a year...

Specials don't.

gilly0512

JonAnderton wrote: »

PCSO's aren't really just civillans in uniform (although they're close to it). They are fully paid up members of the Met's "Extended Police Family" and are officially police staff (which means, once in, are entitled to apply for any other civilian posts in the job, appropriate to their pay grade) and their job ID is that of a civilian staff member. They were intorduced to increase the number of 'uniforms' on the street and came in around the same time as Safer Neighbourhoods.

Specials, on the other hand are voluntary (non paid) people who work a few shifts a month and when on duty, have all the powers, equipment, uniform and permissions as regular officers. They have warrant cards denoting they are special constables. Specials can patrol on their own or with regulars or other specials. Some boroughs have their own Specials vehicles but they can patrol in normal police vehicles as they are, regular police, when on duty.

It used to be that a certain route into the job was to be a special first as it would give you some exposure and experience of the job. People now are being told that the ONLY route in is to be a PCSO first!

Interestinly, SCD6, economic crime, have recruited civilian accountants as Specials to assist them. They have all the qualifications from their private lives, combined with the powers and permissions of regular police.. A very clever idea.

Oh, PCSO's get about £25,000 a year...

Specials don't.

Jon thanks for that extremely detailed synopsis on PCSOs and Specials, although after reading over it twice, I'm still none the wiser as to why PCSO's are required at all. As you say they were brought in specifically for neighbourhood policing, but since they now seem to be getting more powers as they go along, and £25,000 a year to boot, why not just hire more Police full stop, and more specials for neighbourhood policing? Finally are the PCSOs just a Met concept?

metman

gilly2308 wrote: »

why not just hire more Police full stop, and more specials for neighbourhood policing?

Because they only get 3 weeks training, don't get a police pension and can be sacked more easily than a Constable. The government can say its put more 'police' on the beat, can say its recruiting higher numbers of ethnic minorities (a big percentage of PCSOs are black and visible ethnic minority groups) yet at a fraction of the cost it'd take to do the same with actual police officers.

Finally are the PCSOs just a Met concept?

Are you kidding? Every force in England and Wales has them and PSNI are looking to introduce them too.

fortuneteller

I hope that clown in the video was sacked,He couldnt even speak english properly,sadly here we have the same problem here.I saw an asian female in rathmines a few weeks ago, she was wearing a garda uniform,not alone could she not speak english properly,she was grossly over weight.What the hell are the gardai at letting someone like that through the training system.:eek:

Terrontress

As a PCSO is not a sworn constable, it is not illegal to impersonate them as it is with a Police Officer! I think that this is a massive security issue.

I've watched fly on the wall documentaries which have shown PCSOs taking part in dawn raids at the homes of welfare fraudsters. Carrying boxes of documents is hardly ensuring "Community Safety".

JonAnderton

Terrontress wrote: »

As a PCSO is not a sworn constable, it is not illegal to impersonate them as it is with a Police Officer! I think that this is a massive security issue.

I've watched fly on the wall documentaries which have shown PCSOs taking part in dawn raids at the homes of welfare fraudsters. Carrying boxes of documents is hardly ensuring "Community Safety".

"who would claim to be that, who was not?.."

Unfortunatly they seem to be used beyond what their job descriptions, and legislation, allow. i've seen them going out in plain clothes on vice operations and saw one doing a stop and search.

Terrontress

JonAnderton wrote: »

"who would claim to be that, who was not?.."

I know you'd need to be a bit desperate to claim to be one but there are so many law-abiding people who don't know where the powers of a constable start and those of the PCSO start.

You could dress up as one, go out and use the outfit in the course of committing crime and only the crime itself held against you and not the deceit!

It's taking advantage in peoples' trust in law and order.

metman

There is a specific offence of impersonating a PCSO.....the mind indeed boggles.