Friends Relationship Problem! Walk Away?

Ginger83

Hi, a friend of mine is having a problem with her guy. She's 42, a single mother with one child and is going out with a guy who has two kids and had his marriage break up.
At the beginning everything went well, they seemed happy but I seen through him from the start and let her know but she didnt want to know.
She recently confided in me and asked what I thought she should do.
He owns a house where his wife and two kids live and he himself rents a house with my friend and her child. I knew before they had met his wife used to ride him and use the kids as a guilt trip to extract money from him.
He lost his jobs and my friend used to pay all their bill until she found out even after losing his job he was still handed his wife the same money as if he was working. He and my friend broke up but got back together and he got a job but become very mean not contributing anything to the bills.

My friend has found out he give his wife 210euro per week cash on top of paying the mortgage on the house he owns but they live in, she has her one parent book, get her FIS supplement and works about 15 hours per weeks (jesus she earns more than I do an I'm a trademan)

This man promised my friend a legal separation/divorce but keeps putting it on the long finger, I have noticed every time he brings the subject up with his wife she uses the kids to get out of the situation. He wants her to buy him out of his house but she uses terms like "I'm waiting for my father to pass away and then I'll buy you out" or "you wouldnt put your kids out on the street" or "I could not afford to buy you out" (the same woman paid 170euro for a taxi home last week,yes I kid you not) She knows if they get divorced she has to say goodbye to all the freebies.

What should my friend do? Put her foot down or walk away?
This man seems to be still in love with his wife even though I know it was her fault their marraige broke up. My friend gave up her rented house to move in with this man and tells me she is now not in a position to move to another property in her current financial situation.

Sorry for rabbiting on but I'm not sure what to say to her! In my eyes why would this mans wife want to go out and work fulltime when she has everything handed to her on a plate?
It seems to me with the way the irish social system works in this country a girl would be better off having a child and kicking her fella out and she would be far better off financially staying at home and not working

Thank you all

I know a guy very similar to the bloke you describe above.


What age are the kids? If they are still pretty young, then i could kind of understand wanting to remain around them, but if they're in their teens (even early teens) then they should be old enough to be able to see him if they want to.


A case that maybe the wife is using a "if you divorce me/have an argument/don't do as i say/etc, you won't see the kids again" kinda thing?


I don't understand why this guy would get with your friend in the first place, if this was the way he was living. I also don't understand what your friend sees in him, or how she can trust him.



I think the best thing to do here is just ignore it. If she asks you again for your advice, advise that they break up. He's too set in his ways and the chances of him making a radical change in his life is very unlikely (from what im gathering).

You don't buy a house and pay €210 per week so your wife (no matter how hostile the relationship is) can live in it, without having some feelings for her.

CDfm

The new relationship should be perfect for him.

He doesnt seem to be dealing with this correctly and his ex is dominating this and OP you are right to be concerned.

Its best not to get involved but he is being taken to the cleaners.

There are two voluntary groups that help people in his and your friends situation get things sorted legally and here are the links http://www.usfi.ie/ and www.parentalequality.ie

Its a bit of a mess but he should certainly take legal action.

The other point is that he can reduce maintainance if he becomes unemployed or whatever and apply to the courts himself. His ex can get benefit too.

barbiegirl

He's the kids dad, therefore no matter what money he has coming in he pays the same towards the kids, a good quality IMO. He cannot kick her out of the family home, until the children are over 18, then it has to be sold and split, unless the wife buys him out. This is regardless of seperation or divorce.
Your friend fell for a guy with a past and committments but then she has the same. His kids will always have a draw and an affect on their relationship and with that comes the ex.
In terms of what he should contribute to your friends coffers that's for them to sit down and talk out. If they can't be open about their finances it will not last.
All you can do is keep quiet, be there when she wants you, offer support and be a friend. That's it I'm afraid.

CDfm

barbiegirl wrote: »

He's the kids dad, therefore no matter what money he has coming in he pays the same towards the kids, a good quality IMO. He cannot kick her out of the family home, until the children are over 18, then it has to be sold and split, unless the wife buys him out. This is regardless of seperation or divorce.
Your friend fell for a guy with a past and committments but then she has the same. His kids will always have a draw and an affect on their relationship and with that comes the ex.
In terms of what he should contribute to your friends coffers that's for them to sit down and talk out. If they can't be open about their finances it will not last.
All you can do is keep quiet, be there when she wants you, offer support and be a friend. That's it I'm afraid.

I think a bit differently.

You can show them how to deal with it competantly which that guy isnt doing. THe money thats being paid out to the ex has to come from somewhere and the state is there too when times are hard. The guys ex sounds hard and is probably claiming everything thats going.

If you have to drill it into him that he needs to address these issues you should. Its the responsible thing to do.

He can only pay maintainance within his means and there is a formula- and it looks to me that he is paying too much.

There is an open meeting at www.amen.ie in Navan every Tuesday that deals with court style stuff and where children are being used as a weapon - I suggest you get him along to it.

barbiegirl

Just to clarify on one thing. Kids should NEVER be used as a weapon, but they should always come first. Shame on the mum if she is using them as such.
I'm just suggesting that you are hearing one side of the story, as are we, the wife probably has another view point and the man in the middle a third. The reality lies somewhere in between.

CDfm

barbiegirl wrote: »

Just to clarify on one thing. Kids should NEVER be used as a weapon, but they should always come first. Shame on the mum if she is using them as such.
I'm just suggesting that you are hearing one side of the story, as are we, the wife probably has another view point and the man in the middle a third. The reality lies somewhere in between.

But OP has posted what he knows. It seems fairly typical that children are used as a weapon.So you cant just dismiss that what he says is not in good faith.

While legally children and maintainance are 2 seperate issues nonetheless they are used as bargaining chips.

When was the last time you heard of a woman being punished by a court for breaching an access order? Have you ever -no because it never happens.

The only right a father has is to keep going to court and asking the courts to enforce the order. 5, 10 or even 50 times so that the court will act.

barbiegirl

Hey believe me I'm not defending the mum, him or her friend. I am not in anyway saying that the OP isn't posting in good faith, I'm just saying the OP has one side of the story, there are others.
For the record the OP doesn't like the husband in this case. Nor is there any mention of not allowing the OP access, rather the main discussion in around the family home and the maintenance payments.
The OP doesn't think her friend should be in the situation she is in. That the husband/boyfriend is paying too much and the wife has too much in comparison. It's all monetarily based.
A legal seperation will determine the right maintenance amount etc. But ultimately the OP's friend has to sit down and come to an agreement on what the husband/boyfriend should contribute to their home. But access has not been brought up as an issue except by other posters.

CDfm

barbiegirl wrote: »

For the record the OP doesn't like the husband in this case. Nor is there any mention of not allowing the OP access, rather the main discussion in around the family home and the maintenance payments.
The OP doesn't think her friend should be in the situation she is in. That the husband/boyfriend is paying too much and the wife has too much in comparison. It's all monetarily based.

The OP is suspicious it being his friend and I am assuming it is not a love interest. However,given that she did ask for advice its only fair to point the OP in the right direction without speculating to b/fs motives. Lets face it -he could be out of his depth.

It is only right that the b/f can get proper advice on regulating access plus maintainance. Especially if he can end up unemployed and the ex is on benefit. So the really need to have a plan/structure in place to tackle this.

IMO- the best way to do that is to do that is to speak to one of the groups and get an idea what he is in for.Then when his cards are on the table they can deal with reality - which is what the OP wants his friend to do rather then the chaotic state of affairs that there is now. IM sure the exs dad wants to live another 20 years

Ginger83

Hi all,thanks v.much for replies. I'd like to clear a few things up, this guy is paying the FULL mortgage on his house that his wife and kids are living in ON TOP of handing her 210 euro cash per week. I know her distantly through a few friends of my own and yes she is claiming everything on the go. But when this man was out of work she still demanded the same money and my friend who is living with this man was being left to pay for everything on the other side, rent, food etc.

As far as I know if he got a divorce he would be entitled to his half of the house and they would have to sell or she buy him out but she will never do that. She wont want to give up a good thing, a guillable man (stupid in my eyes) whos being rode, bled for everything she has. She wants her good life and sod him so she can go down to our local thur, fir, sat and sun as always and drink. I've often heard of her saying "I will tell everyone you put your kids out on the street" and "I will never let your kids forget what you have done"

To me this sums her up! I am just concerned and looking out for my friend.

CDfm

Ginger83 wrote: »

To me this sums her up! I am just concerned and looking out for my friend.

Well he sounds like a good guy and there is loads of help in Meath. In real life the chance of getting anything from the house anytime soon is zippo. The chances of anyone believing her in the pub are slim too.

His ex sounds awful and would be really surprised if he got his sh1t together .Your friend and you sound the opposite and everyone deserves a chance at happiness.

the_syco

Ginger83 wrote: »

As far as I know if he got a divorce he would be entitled to his half of the house

When there are kids involved, and the house is the family home, things get muddied. There has been a few cases in England where the family kept the house, the man barred from it, and a court order saying that he must continue to pay for it. No case here yet, but from the english case, many people think it'll go the same way, as men have little rights when it comes to these things.

CDfm

the_syco wrote: »

When there are kids involved, and the house is the family home, things get muddied. There has been a few cases in England where the family kept the house, the man barred from it, and a court order saying that he must continue to pay for it. No case here yet, but from the english case, many people think it'll go the same way, as men have little rights when it comes to these things.

What rights he has he should fight for.England is different to Ireland and now has a fairly different system. It seems to me he hasnt attended to things and there is stuff like social housing etc that he may qualify for. By applying for joint custody he increases his ability to qualify for things.He needs to chip away at the system and not be afraid.

It seems to me that he gives his ex far to much credibility and she is a jade,

Ginger83

Hi, yes I agree he gives her too much.
But.. on the point of the case of the family staying in the home the the court ordering the man to continue to pay for it I can honestly say if I was in that situation I would refuse point blank to pay for it. No f-ing way. The first thing I would be doing is handing in my notice in work. Bad enough a marriage breakup after working hard to buy and pay for a house and to have someone say she can live in it and you pay for it I would give the two fingers to that, court or no court and consider moving abroad.

CDfm

Ginger - giving your notice is intentional impoverishment and can result in an award being made anyway. Going abroad doesnt work as orders are enforceable overseas.

Also- he may not want to go as he would loose access.

He is best going to one of the help groups to get an appraisal ofhis situation.

Ginger83

I do agree with you CDfm, he should really see about his financial issues, on the other note-the point I was only trying to make is if i was in that situation i would not work for love nor money to allow someone who broke up my marraige to have a carefree life in a house i am paying for. And dont get me wrong, the dole doesnt come into it, I'd rather do nothing. Its would not be spite, it would be a principal of what I had worked hard to achieve, I would not let someone have it for nothing!

CDfm

Ginger83 wrote: »

I do agree with you CDfm, he should really see about his financial issues, on the other note-the point I was only trying to make is if i was in that situation i would not work for love nor money to allow someone who broke up my marraige to have a carefree life in a house i am paying for. And dont get me wrong, the dole doesnt come into it, I'd rather do nothing. Its would not be spite, it would be a principal of what I had worked hard to achieve, I would not let someone have it for nothing!

I agree with you too and it is unfair. He can if he wants to go to a group like Amen on a Tuesday night in Navan and you and his girlfiend can go with him for support.

That way he has support to address it. The funny thing when he breaks the link with his ex -he will probably be a great guy.

Ginger83

I feel this man does not want to break the link with his ex wife. In my eyes he seems to believe that one day they might have a chance of getting back together.

I've heard my friend say he promised her he would get a legal separation or divorce and his only answer seems to be his ex wife reckons it would be too much upset for the kids, lets wait til they get older. How older?

I have thought about it and given her my advice which was give it 3 months, if things dont change and if he does not make any effort kick him out the door and send him back to the great ex he seems to want to be with.
I'll lend her the money meself to set up again if necessary just to get her away from that no-good leech.

CDfm

Ginger83 wrote: »

I feel this man does not want to break the link with his ex wife. In my eyes he seems to believe that one day they might have a chance of getting back together.

I've heard my friend say he promised her he would get a legal separation or divorce and his only answer seems to be his ex wife reckons it would be too much upset for the kids, lets wait til they get older. How older?

I have thought about it and given her my advice which was give it 3 months, if things dont change and if he does not make any effort kick him out the door and send him back to the great ex he seems to want to be with.
I'll lend her the money meself to set up again if necessary just to get her away from that no-good leech.

I do agree that he should take action.

He is seperated - how much more upsetting can it be for the kids.It amazes me he takes advice from the ex.

He should be making an effort and be putting his options on the table.

In my experience very few guys actually handle these things properly and while there is little help available for guys -it is there and its up to him to get it.