DIT students supporting fees.

InTranceWeTrust

I know that there are a lot of DIT students who are actually in support of the introduction of fees. I'm thinking we should all get together and march with the members of the dail against these pot smokin' hippys who are opposed to the idea of college fees.

What date is their march scheduled for? I can make banners and placards.

InTranceWeTrust

Also I have some fabulous slogans which I will keep secret until the day of the march to prevent them from being turned into anti-fees propaganda.

experiMental

I can make barricades.

Actually, I'm not going, I definitely don't want the introduction of fees but I just can't go. The best I can do is scream from Dundalk, and hope that someone will hear me in Dubland

JohnG18

I do not smoke "pot" nor have I ever. And I will be marching against the introduction of fees. The fact that you call students who don't want to shell out around 16 Grand for their education hippys I think that reflects more on you then anyone else?

InTranceWeTrust

JohnG18 wrote: »

I do not smoke "pot" nor have I ever. And I will be marching against the introduction of fees. The fact that you call students who don't want to shell out around 16 Grand for their education hippys I think that reflects more on you then anyone else?

More hippy dribble. Go hug a tree. What do we want? FEES! When do we want them? NOW!

disssco

Why are you supporting fees?

JohnG18

Cause he may have more money then sence?

sunnyjim

disssco wrote: »

Why are you supporting fees?

Because the country is in serious trouble. The money isn't there to pay for peoples education.

If anyone thinks twice about paying 18,000 euro for something which will give them twice as much per annum within about a decade*, they're mad. It's a worthy investment**.

*Except if you've chosen some shhhitty course.
** Unless you end up studying in Rathmines.

InTranceWeTrust

The introduction of fees would stop these god damn hippies getting into college so they can skip classes and goout every night to smoke pot and drink, and it might make the wasters actually appreciate their education.

disssco

Sir, as a member of the so called "waster" community I feel that we are being misrepresented and unfairly treated. I'm a university student and I neither go out nor drink. I never have the cash to do so as I spend it all on weed.

FreeOSCAR

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

The introduction of fees would stop these god damn hippies getting into college so they can skip classes and goout every night to smoke pot and drink, and it might make the wasters actually appreciate their education.

Stop the stereotyping!

InTranceWeTrust

FreeOSCAR wrote: »

Stop the stereotyping...

Yes, yes, yes.... Stop the stereotyping, Save the trees, Free the weed...

We've heard all of these hippie slogans before. Has anyone got a real argument against the introduction of fees?

FreeOSCAR

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

Yes, yes, yes.... Stop the stereotyping, Save the trees, Free the weed...

We've heard all of these hippie slogans before. Has anyone got a real argument against the introduction of fees?

Your obviously ripping the piss, and if your not, your coming across as a bit of a troll.

Also how could you afford to pay 18 grand?

smileyhappy

Right folks, here's a choice

you take out a loan and pay your fees (as people do elsewhere in the world) and your granny keeps her medical card and pension.

You get your fees paid and your granny loses her medical card and takes a cut in her measly small pension.


What's it going to be?

christophicus

You don't honestly think that banks are going to give out loans to students in the current economic climate do you ?

Also OP is clearly Trolling ignore him.

Caliden

If you were going to trinity I *might* be able take you a bit more seriously OP

mcerc

FEES YES PLEASE!

FreeOSCAR

smileyhappy wrote: »

Right folks, here's a choice

you take out a loan and pay your fees (as people do elsewhere in the world) and your granny keeps her medical card and pension.

You get your fees paid and your granny loses her medical card and takes a cut in her measly small pension.


What's it going to be?

Is that you Batt?

InTranceWeTrust

FreeOSCAR wrote: »

your coming across as a bit of a troll.

I am not a troll I'm a dwarf. We little people take offense to derogatory names like that.

But seriously folks. The money has to come from somewhere! It should come from pay cuts amongst ministers and government members but that isn't going to happen.

If you're going to protest against the introduction of fees at least have an alternative plan available for presentation. One which looks out for the interests of the state.

So tomorrow instead of shouting like:

NO FEES
FREE THE WEED
STOP THE STEREOTYPING

Try shouting one along the lines of

THE INTRODUCTION OF FEES WOULD BE VERY BAD FOR IRELAND'S ECONOMICAL FUTURE.
GOVERNMENT FUNDING MUST COME FROM ELSEWHERE.
RAISE TAXES ON ALCOHOL AND CIGARETTES.
PERHAPS HIGHLY PAID GOVERNMENT MINISTERS COULD TAKE A TEMPORARY PAY CUT.
TAKE MEDICAL CARDS AWAY FROM THE ELDERLY.

Not that it'll help!

Caliden

You forgot to add "WHEN DO WE WANT IT?"

PrettyInPunk

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

More hippy dribble. Go hug a tree. What do we want? FEES! When do we want them? NOW!

Yes i do agree fees are **** for people who find it hard to afford them but really the only option right now.They are being brought in for a good reason.

However i think you are <snip>and your posts makes me want to punch you in the face.

InTranceWeTrust

PrettyInPunk wrote: »

i think you are a stupid asshole and your posts makes me want to punch you in the face.

Bring it. Name the time and the place I'll be there.

Oh its on.

Edit: I just realised that I missed out on an excellent opportunity to scold you for not using capital "I"s. Ah well, maybe next time.

Oh and your grammar too! How did I miss that one?! "Your posts makes me want to punch you", please don't bes offended I only corrects you for yous own good.

InTranceWeTrust

Caliden wrote: »

You forgot to add "WHEN DO WE WANT IT?"

So the slogan to shout is now


THE INTRODUCTION OF FEES WOULD BE VERY BAD FOR IRELAND'S ECONOMICAL FUTURE.
GOVERNMENT FUNDING MUST COME FROM ELSEWHERE.
RAISE TAXES ON ALCOHOL AND CIGARETTES.
PERHAPS HIGHLY PAID GOVERNMENT MINISTERS COULD TAKE A TEMPORARY PAY CUT.
TAKE MEDICAL CARDS AWAY FROM THE ELDERLY.
WHEN DO WE WANT IT?
REALISTICALLY WITHIN THE NEXT FEW WEEKS!

sunnyjim

christophicus wrote: »

You don't honestly think that banks are going to give out loans to students in the current economic climate do you ?

Also OP is clearly Trolling ignore him.

Yeah, trolling. That's you answer when someone radically disagrees with you?

PrettyinPunk wrote:

However i think you are a stupid asshole and your posts makes me want to punch you in the face.

Hahaha, where's the mods!?

bohsfan

Investing in education is one of the only viable options we have to drag this country out of the mire it is rapidly finding itself stuck in.

The tax breaks available to industry is where we should be clawing back money, not taxing people who want to further their education. The foreign investment (Intel and the like) was always only going to last for a short time. Whenever it became more economically viable to ship out to India or China we could never stop them.

Student loans sound great in principle. But from firsthand experience from studying in England people often leave the country so they don't have to pay back the loans. There is no point educating people in order to ship them out elsewhere.

And it's not a case of 'if you want free education then your granny wont have a medical card'. That's just twaddle. Cutbacks should come from elsewhere... Foreign investment and equine industry taxbreaks anyone?

Our future will be lead by an educated workforce, capable of attracting high-end investment. Invest in education.

shoutman

While I think that the op is definately trolling, as a student I would still be in the bring back fees for those who can afford to pay camp, as the government is planning to do. I don't see why the likes of myself, who would be able to afford to pay fees, should get free education at the expense of the country as a whole. That said I'm not going to go donating 10k to government coffers, but in this time of economic uncertainty surely those who can afford to pay fee's should be told to do so, likewise those elderly who can afford to pay for medical expenses should do so etc.

There aren't that many students who are living on the breadline, and those who are would be certain of grants. Many of my friends are on grants at the moment, despite having plenty of disposable income. The test for means testing anything like this must be a model that can work. Perhaps if there is a model working abroad which could be implemented?

shoutman

Bohsfan, at present we supposedly have an educated workforce, as we have had free education for donkeys years. That said it isn't going to make us recession proof, as has already been shown.

Brain drain will occur in times of recession no matter what type of education system is in place. Yes tax breaks for certain industrys should be abolished, equine and musicians/cultural tax breaks for those earning above €50k a year for a start.

There are way's to build up government coffers but I think implementing fees for those who can afford it will be of good assistance too.

experiMental

Let's get it over quick and sharp.

If the government will want to finance the economy through creation of new intellectual capital, they will have to have to invest into postgraduate research.

If colleges want to invest more into research, then they have to create more research places. Currently, there are very few and competition for them is fierce. So that might mean that out of a class of 40 people, only 1 person may go through to being a researcher, while the other 5 or so who want to get there will be tearing their hair out. If more research places will be created, more competition will be created. The reason for this, is that for the other 35 people in the class, prospects will be far worse, due to closing down of certain sectors and recession. So more people will want to go into research.

So the other 35 people will be paying at least 50% of their fees for the sake of a few lucky people.



So say NO to fees. If the college will want more fees, than it has to decrease college places slightly. I just think it will be cruel to let students to struggle to pay for 4 or 5 years of their education and then end up without any decent prospects in the end.

Say NO to fees.

shoutman

Sorry if i'm not getting this experimental, but what you are saying is that colleges don't have the funds for extra research places, and if fees are implemented and research places don't go up then it will be unfair because only a few will get research places?

To me that logically makes zero sense. The fee's are for your education! A piece of paper which can be deemed very important in certain industrys.

Introduction of fee's will mean that college's wont have as much financial burden as they have at the moment, i'd assume the vast majority of educational institutions are heavily in debt and I do not see why those who can afford to pay would not be willing to do so. If we are talking about fairness, surely it is only fair that they do so.

Also when it comes to a small amount of research places, that too is something I have no problem with. At present there are third level places for everyone in this country who is willing to put in the work to get there, you don't have to be bright or gifted just have to put the head down and do a decent leaving cert, and even if you don't there are so many backdoor routes it is ridiculous. It would be impossible to offer every third level student a research place, it would be impossible and not worthwhile in the slightest, the brightest of those who apply will get the reasearch place as is only right.

I don't think luck has much to do with it.

InTranceWeTrust

Furthermore the grant system in this country is a joke. I know several wealthy children who for one reason or another are given a hefty sum of money by the government each year. Said money is not invested in their education, rather it funds their drinking for the year.

Where is that girl who said she'd fight me?

keen

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

The introduction of fees would stop these god damn hippies getting into college so they can skip classes and goout every night to smoke pot and drink, and it might make the wasters actually appreciate their education.

Bit rich coming from an E head raver.

InTranceWeTrust

I have never touched an illicit substance in my life.

Anyway ecstasy isn't the problem here. Stimulant users like all recreational drug users are hedonistic and primarily concerned with their own satisfaction. At least they don't pretend they take drugs in order to benefit "mother earth" like those god damn pot smokin' hippies.

InTranceWeTrust

bohsfan wrote: »

people often leave the country so they don't have to pay back the loans.

Would this work? How long would you have to stay away until the banks forget about you? I'm thinking of emigrating anyway so this might be the perfect option for me!:)

The money shouldn't come from education I agree. It should come from elsewhere. Personally I think a hefty emergency tax on alcohol and cigarettes would do the trick. It would also help stop people from getting drunk out of their minds every weekend and starting fights.

I'm having a go because I'm sick of god damn hippies giving out about the government while not doing anything themselves to improve the situation. Its not easy being in politics, I sure wouldn't like to do it.

NO TO FEES!
What then? Whats your alternative strategy? The country is in dire economic crisis. The government don't want to tax education anymore than you don't want to pay fees. Come on its 2009, a simple NO TO FEES is a bit fcuking lame if you ask me.

shoutman

Stop calling them hippies!? It really isn't helping you at all as it just makes you come across as a bit of an eejit. Yes the grant system is a joke but it comes back to the point of why shouldn't people who are able to afford it pay fees?

tony 2 tone

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

I have never touched an illicit substance in my life.

Anyway ecstasy isn't the problem here. Stimulant users like all recreational drug users are hedonistic and primarily concerned with their own satisfaction. At least they don't pretend they take drugs in order to benefit "mother earth" like those god damn pot smokin' hippies.

Then why were you looking for test kits to be availible in the SU shop? Or was that just more trolling?

projectmayhem

I'm all for open discussion on the matter but the number of reported posts here is ridiculous. Have a civilised discussion or have no discussion at all...

PrettyInPunk

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

Furthermore the grant system in this country is a joke. I know several wealthy children who for one reason or another are given a hefty sum of money by the government each year. Said money is not invested in their education, rather it funds their drinking for the year.

Where is that girl who said she'd fight me?

Why are you so retarded? Whats grants go to do with me?

I AGREE fees are the only option. However, i was merely pointing out the fact that your posts make me want to punch you in the face. End of.

projectmayhem

PrettyInPunk wrote: »

Why are you so retarded? Whats grants go to do with me?

Stop with the personal insults...

rockmongrel

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

I know that there are a lot of DIT students who are actually in support of the introduction of fees. I'm thinking we should all get together and march with the members of the dail against these pot smokin' hippys who are opposed to the idea of college fees.

What date is their march scheduled for? I can make banners and placards.

Although I am coming to the realisation that fees are probably necessary and may support them, its sh!t like this and generalising those who are against fees that is going to make it difficult defending their introduction. Get off your high horse.

I genuinely think that students should be supporting the lowering of fees as opposed to stopping them. There is a worldwide downturn and every aspect of Irish society is taking a beating. We need to accept this and need to each make a effort.

Invest in education yes, but I don't think paying for us to go is the way to go about it.

I'm a little annoyed at my posting of this because it means I'm agreeing with the intolerant so and so who made this thread..

InTranceWeTrust

tony 2 tone wrote: »

Then why were you looking for test kits to be availible in the SU shop? Or was that just more trolling?

Maybe its because I care about people and want to save lives. Did you ever think of that?

InTranceWeTrust

rockmongrel wrote: »

I'm agreeing with the tolerant so and so who made this thread..

Thank you, I appreciate the support. Its nice to know I have people on my side.

InTranceWeTrust

PrettyInPunk wrote: »

Whats grants go to do with me?

I believe you mean "What have grants got to do with me?"

The answer is nothing my dear. I am unaware as to whether or not you get a grant and quite frankly its none of my business. I was merely putting the point about grants out in public view as this thread is pretty much a vent for our frustrations at the system.

And we don't like to be called retarded, we're special.

rockmongrel

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

Thank you, I appreciate the support. Its nice to know I have people on my side.

Bah hahaha, the idea of it being your side shows your narcissism and idiocy.

Its clear you are just a troll and there is really no discussion here.

sunnyjim

I'm not trolling, so the discussion isn't quite over. At this stage, our economy is ****ed, and we need to pay fees.

sarahirl

do you know what really annoyed me about this whole 'debate'? that the students union of ireland or whichever students body decided upon themselves that there is only one answer and that's no no never no way.... most of us have brains, it's why we went to college (to expand on said brain capacity) and we are being force fed a simplistic one liner on what to think (no to fees) and what we should do (protest). registration fees are nearly €1000 and are only going to increase. no tax back can be claimed on registration fees. you can however claim tax back on college fees. this will probably affect parents of students more so than most students. so my idea on this whole thing is the reintroduction of college fees, but cap them to say €2000 a year or whatever, give the grant system a kick up the arse, get grants back from people who didn't attend the required time in college (they signed an agreement, it's their fault) and put that money back into the education system. the government go after benefit frauds and in my humble opinion students who get massive grants (i'm talking from experience here of a few people who started a course, got their grant and were never seen again) should also be followed up.

rip that apart if you will but it's only my humble opinion.

esharknz

InTranceWeTrust wrote: »

Would this work? How long would you have to stay away until the banks forget about you? I'm thinking of emigrating anyway so this might be the perfect option for me!:)

In New Zealand you borrow from the government rather than a bank and don't actually have to repay until your income reaches a certain amount. It's now interest free too for people working in NZ, down from 8% from day one.
People do leave the country (and they can now tell if a student loan holder has left) and are charged penalty interest if no payments are made. Could work if you never returned (or never came to the attention of the revenue department in NZ if you did!).