Handicap Adjustments for Society Scores?

ShriekingSheet

Not overly sure on this one. And it's likely to come up for a few people in the summer so would be good to clarify for the general readership.

If in the summer, without placing, you shoot say 39 or 40 points in a society outing, are you cut on the spot as you would be if you shot the score in a home club comp?

If you are cut, is it based on Standard Scratch Score? Any societies I know don't calculate a Competition Scratch Score.

And if you shoot 26pts, do you assume an immediate .1 back? As you would in a home club comp?


I'm talking about your club handicap here rather than a society handicap. Obviously, all away scores are to be reported on your club's Away Score sheet. These days, where h'cap adustments apply, they are effective immediately and you have to apply them yourself. So if you don't know the above, and you do have a good score and fail to change your own handicap for a subsequent competition you're leaving yourself open to a DQ.

I know in the past you were cut on the spot according to SSS. But I don't think .1 back was ever given for a bad score. What I heard in recent years was something about the society scores being kept and reviewed later by the h'cap seceratary, rather than having an immediate cut.

Anyone know?

Paulusmaximus

As far as i'm aware, you will not be cut or receive a .1 for a society round unless a CSS is calculated. the round however will be noted as a significant score for a General Play reduction. (thats if you have had a good score!)

I am now going to research CONGU to get a correct answer!

Just to add, for handicap cuts or .1's the round must satisfy the conditions of a qualifying round, and there is quite a few conditions to be met for it to be a qualifying round.

ShriekingSheet

Paulusmaximus wrote: »

As far as i'm aware, you will not be cut or receive a .1 for a society round unless a CSS is calculated. the round however will be noted as a significant score for a General Play reduction. (thats if you have had a good score!)

I am now going to research CONGU to get a correct answer!

Just to add, for handicap cuts or .1's the round must satisfy the conditions of a qualifying round, and there is quite a few conditions to be met for it to be a qualifying round.

Cheers Paul. I've found the CONGU site not great for detail in the past, but if you manage to dig it up, cheers

Also a quick mail to the GUI would solve it but I thought I'd post it first because it's quite amazing how many of us aren't sure on what is a fairly important thing to know. A captain's prize was taken off a guy in a club in the south east one year because he had a good score in a society the week before and failed to cut himself. He was awarded the prize but the discovery was made later and he was stripped of it. I think adjustments to the rule have been made since though.

Hobart

As far as I know, from the start of last year society scores were not to be used when calculating your handicap. If you shot 39 - 40pts in an outing, you had to record it as an away score in your home club as usual. What changed is that all society scores were only taken into account at the end of the golfing year, and a decision was made on whether to adjust the handicap then, or not. So, as far as I know, you do not cut yourself after a good society score, but you do inform your club of the score.

ShriekingSheet

Hobart wrote: »

As far as I know, from the start of last year society scores were not to be used when calculating your handicap. If you shot 39 - 40pts in an outing, you had to record it as an away score in your home club as usual. What changed is that all society scores were only taken into account at the end of the golfing year, and a decision was made on whether to adjust the handicap then, or not. So, as far as I know, you do not cut yourself after a good society score, but you do inform your club of the score.

Cheers Hobart,

That's what I thought the new rule was alright. It's a shame really because it kind of downgrades society golf. In a way, it does make it less official. A lot of guys I know, like myself, are pleased to be cut after a good score.

Poker Face

Hobart is correct. Cant really understand why they did this. All it does is favour the guys who look after their handicap. You can have 45 points on a Saturday in your society off say 14 and go out again on Sunday in your club competition and still be off 14.

ShriekingSheet

Poker Face wrote: »

Hobart is correct. Cant really understand why they did this. All it does is favour the guys who look after their handicap. You can have 45 points on a Saturday in your society off say 14 and go out again on Sunday in your club competition and still be off 14.

Yes I agree with you for a few reasons including the above, it's a bit nuts.

The only reasonable explanation I can think of is the fact that societies often play off front tees and scores may be better than usual without a CSS change to reflect this.

Guys who want to win prizes while protecting their handicap can already go out in team events on corporate and charity days and pick up big prizes without it having any effect on their handicap. Technically they should report these wins but they don't and they get away with it. This will just give them more opportunity in a singles context.

stockdam

Societies often play off forward tees and also don't record a SSS for the day. It's up to your home club to decide on General Play.

stockdam

ShriekingSheet wrote: »

Guys who want to win prizes while protecting their handicap can already go out in team events on corporate and charity days and pick up big prizes without it having any effect on their handicap. Technically they should report these wins but they don't and they get away with it. This will just give them more opportunity in a singles context.

I play golf for fun - not to win prizes. My prize is getting out on a good course with good company. That's far more value to me than any pair of shoes or golf bags.

Deep Thought

Poker Face wrote: »

Hobart is correct. Cant really understand why they did this. All it does is favour the guys who look after their handicap. You can have 45 points on a Saturday in your society off say 14 and go out again on Sunday in your club competition and still be off 14.

As far as I am aware, if you play well and have a great score you are expected to cut yourself immediatley and play off that handicap and wait for your club to confirm the cut. this is supposed to prevent inscrupulous folks "Minding" their handicap

We had this in our club a couple of years ago. Bloke came in playing off 14 and won singles open. Two weeks later came in and played and won. We checked his handicap and it was still the same, no personal or club cuts, so he obviously didnt record it,and we DQ him as he should have cut himself. He complained and said he was going to GUI - We said fine, We would be delighted to have the GUI go into his club and see how they are managing the H/C. Never heard anything since

Paulusmaximus

I agree that it opens it up for "bandits" to have big scores and not get cut, but if you look at the different types of players who play in a society, i think the benefits of them being non counting are greater than the benefits of it being counting. Factors that are normally taken into account but may or are not taken into account in society golf are:

1. weather conditions/course conditions are not taken into place.

2. Forward Tees.

3. measured course? There is specific rules regarding the length of the course played compared to the measured course and the tees should be no more than ten yards(not sure of the actual distance) from the "stone"

4. size of the society. Can 4 guys who go out to play class themselves as a society and have their scores counting?

To say that they are getting away with having good scores is not entirely true as the scores should be noted as "significant scores" and after 2/3 significant scores a player is liable to a reduction. If they are not returning their scores they are breaking the rules as it is your responsibility to record away scores.

ShriekingSheet

Szondi wrote: »

As far as I am aware, if you play well and have a great score you are expected to cut yourself immediatley and play off that handicap and wait for your club to confirm the cut. this is supposed to prevent inscrupulous folks "Minding" their handicap

We had this in our club a couple of years ago. Bloke came in playing off 14 and won singles open. Two weeks later came in and played and won. We checked his handicap and it was still the same, no personal or club cuts, so he obviously didnt record it,and we DQ him as he should have cut himself. He complained and said he was going to GUI - We said fine, We would be delighted to have the GUI go into his club and see how they are managing the H/C. Never heard anything since

A singles open is a club competition and is treated differently to a society outing.

By the current rules, if the guy you describe won a society outing off 14 with 45 points and played a week later without cutting himself he would be within the rules.

ShriekingSheet

Paulusmaximus wrote: »

To say that they are getting away with having good scores is not entirely true as the scores should be noted as "significant scores" and after 2/3 significant scores a player is liable to a reduction. If they are not returning their scores they are breaking the rules as it is your responsibility to record away scores.

Agreed Paul - it's more a case of being open to abuse rather than saying all regular society players are now cheaters

1stuey1

ok im really slow when it somes to the rules of golf lol so if i have a gui, and play in a socitaty with the lads and i score well am i to cut my handicap straight away? i persoanlly have no clue how it works lol sorry im an idiot

Paulusmaximus

1stuey1 wrote: »

ok im really slow when it somes to the rules of golf lol so if i have a gui, and play in a socitaty with the lads and i score well am i to cut my handicap straight away? i persoanlly have no clue how it works lol sorry im an idiot

no, you don't cut yourself. You record your score on the away scores in your own club and they will decide whether to cut you or not.

The old way, you would have cut yourself based on the SSS on the scorecard but they have done away with this rule

1stuey1

so basically if i join a club and get a gui and play somewhere else, i gotta record my score and hand it in to be re-evaluated?

Paulusmaximus

if you play somewhere else in a society, you record your score in your home club. More than likely they won't cut you unless you have had 3/4 good scores.

This doesn't apply for casual golf or out with your mates. There should be a facility in your club to record the scores. In our club its a book. all you have to enter is the date, course, your score and the SSS of the course you played.

kingshankly

i cant see this ever happening. if a player hands in 5/6 bad society scores i cant see the club pushing him out