Slight knocking sound when clutch depressed-thoughts?

DonalB

Hi,
this has been developing over the last week from the first time I heard it.
Irregularly happening but when it does it seems to be when starting/ slowing to stop, I hear/feel in my left foot a slight knocking sound.

It a 2005 A4 at 59900K miles due timing at 60k miles. Thanks to help on here last week I have it booked for a timing belt change this Wednesday. (I'll have to do about 150 miles more between now and getting it to the garage on wednesday for the timing bel)
So before I drive there and say "hey I've got another problem can you have a look, and charge me more" can anyone give me pointer? I'm actually driving to Cork from Waterford for the entire day to get it done to save €100 on the timing belt, as money is very, very tight, and I don't want to go in ignorant.
Any of you fine people able to give me an idea? I'm guessing obv. something to do with the clutch?
(I don't ride the clutch myself but I bought the car at 45K miles. I had a full service about 8 weeks ago, nothing mentioned).

Regards
Donal

crosstownk

Could be a release bearing or pressure plate problem. If the sound is more of click than a knock, it may be a master cylinder problem.

To be honest, the only way to correctly diagnose it is to simply pull it assunder and inspect and hope that the fault is evident at that point.

If it was my car, I'd be inclined to let the fault develop. The down side to this is that it may leave you stuck at the roadside...........

No harm to mention it during the timing belt change and at least get the garage's opinion on it without doing any major exploratory stuff.

DonalB

Thanks, I realise remote diagnosis is next to impossible. I definitely call it a knock rather than a click.
Should it be either of the 2 issues you mention, (understanding you can't say precisely), are they big jobs, more importantly, are they expensive?
Am I looking at causing anything major here if I allow it develop more?

crosstownk

Release bearing/pressure plate are 'gearbox out' jobs so, yes, they are labour intensive and therefore relatively expensive. If the car is still preforming well then I'd be inclined to let the fault manifest itself some more before further investigation.

As you say, remote diagnosis can be difficult, but you may simply have a problem with the pedal mechanism. Like I said, have the garage take a quick look. If they can't immediately diagnose it then let it develop. If they can diagnose it, get a quote before you authorise them to carry out the additional work.

DonalB

Hey all,
Well I got my timing belt done, and while dropping it in I tried to describe the problem.
The mechanic, whom I hadn't met before but was recommended to me) said there was a problem with the flywheel on Audi & VW Passat, that the "flywheel was two separate parts instead of a single whole" and he had experience with them going bad. But also that if so, it is an expensive job.

When collecting the car after the timing belt (and brake pads job, €50 over quote, but under Audi dealer) he said yes, that was the problem, that there was a vibration at all times, idling & moving. And that it would be better to get it done sooner rather than later.
Though he wasn't clear in explaining much further because someone else came in, about how much time I might have. Here the thing: he said there was no point changing the flywheel without doing the clutch and that whole job would run to about €1100.
This is a catastrophe for me, but I again need impartial advice.
Anyone have any more experience or knowledge about this? Is the clutch an essential part of this. What could happen if I keep driving? He didn't seem to say it was a complete panic/immediate job.

Any thoughts/advice?

Again, thanks in advance.

Saab Ed

If Im reading this correct then your problem is a dual mass flywheel which is now recognised as failed technology by the motor industry. Im not great at the tech end of things but I've seen somewhere before were replacement solid flywheels are being made aftermarket to match demand for the amount of knackered dual mass flywheels around. If you are going to do the job then I think this is the way to go rather than fit the same type of flywheel again. I know one of the UK parts makers ( Cant remember who) is now actually making a solid flywheel replacment kit for Ford so that's an admission there is a problem in its self. If its an older car not worth much then it might just be better to put up with the shudder until it finally blows.

voxpop

Clutch and flywheel jobs are expensive due to the labour times involved. over a grand still seems a bit expensive.
Is your car remapped - as 60k miles (to me) is pretty low mileage for a new clutch and flywheel.

Btw dont go looking for a single mass flywheel replacement - it will rattle your teeth out


Just a thought - if it was the flywheel would it not be knocking untill the clutch is pressed rather than the other way around ??

Saab Ed

voxpop wrote: »

Clutch and flywheel jobs are expensive due to the labour times involved. over a grand still seems a bit expensive.
Is your car remapped - as 60k miles (to me) is pretty low mileage for a new clutch and flywheel.

Btw dont go looking for a single mass flywheel replacement - it will rattle your teeth out

The jury is out on that one...

Darragh29

DonalB wrote: »

Hey all,
Well I got my timing belt done, and while dropping it in I tried to describe the problem.
The mechanic, whom I hadn't met before but was recommended to me) said there was a problem with the flywheel on Audi & VW Passat, that the "flywheel was two separate parts instead of a single whole" and he had experience with them going bad. But also that if so, it is an expensive job.

When collecting the car after the timing belt (and brake pads job, €50 over quote, but under Audi dealer) he said yes, that was the problem, that there was a vibration at all times, idling & moving. And that it would be better to get it done sooner rather than later.
Though he wasn't clear in explaining much further because someone else came in, about how much time I might have. Here the thing: he said there was no point changing the flywheel without doing the clutch and that whole job would run to about €1100.
This is a catastrophe for me, but I again need impartial advice.
Anyone have any more experience or knowledge about this? Is the clutch an essential part of this. What could happen if I keep driving? He didn't seem to say it was a complete panic/immediate job.

Any thoughts/advice?

Again, thanks in advance.

Sorry to hear you are having this problem OP. On the positive side, 1,100 Euro isn't a bad price for this. It looks to me like quote doesn't involve replacing the clutch pressure plate/cover assembly and clutch disc/driven plate. You can expect the invoice to jummp up another 250 odd Euro if they take out the gearbox and find that these parts needs to be replaced as well, "subject to inspection" as they would say. It could be the case that the 1,100 Euro price includes these parts but I doubt that it does to be honest, based on the price, but it is something you should check anyway...

What will happen if you keep driving is that eventually over the next few months, the problem will get worse and you won't be able to get gear, etc.

Darragh29

voxpop wrote: »

Clutch and flywheel jobs are expensive due to the labour times involved. over a grand still seems a bit expensive.
Is your car remapped - as 60k miles (to me) is pretty low mileage for a new clutch and flywheel.

Btw dont go looking for a single mass flywheel replacement - it will rattle your teeth out

All these DMF solutions have been rejected now as failed technology. If you use a single mass flywheel OEM replacement such as Valeo, you will not have any issue whatsoever with vibrations. This DMF technology is a typical example of someone f*cking around with the simple and the proven. Solid flywheels have worked fine since the internal combustion engine was invented, then some d*ck decides to reinvent the wheel and we've been paying 1,500 Euro for what used to be a 400-500 Euro clutch replacement task, ever since. The clutch disc has always been used for damping vibrations and this solution has served us well for years.

voxpop

Darragh - im not arguing whether is a good technology or not, just passing on the information Ive come across (for VW btw). Plenty of guys have replaced their DMF with a single version and had to revert due to vibration.
Now maybe this is just due to the TDI lump and other engines are fine, but I wouldnt suggest that someone change to a standard flywheel without the pointing out the possible vibration issues.

Changing to a single mass flywheel is really only for vans,taxi drivers and modders - not the normal joe soap

Darragh29

voxpop wrote: »

Darragh - im not arguing whether is a good technology or not, just passing on the information Ive come across (for VW btw). Plenty of guys have replaced their DMF with a single version and had to revert due to vibration.
Now maybe this is just due to the TDI lump and other engines are fine, but I wouldnt suggest that someone change to a standard flywheel without the pointing out the possible vibration issues.

Changing to a single mass flywheel is really only for vans,taxi drivers and modders - not the normal joe soap

I haven't heard of anyone having issues with vibration, actually I did only once and this was where the guy had welding the DMF into one lump and stuck back in a solid clutch disc. If you change to an OEM single mass flywheel, the clutch disc has an improved damper assembly that does the work that the DMF previously did. I've fitted loads of these and I've never heard or experienced a problem with vibrations after changing from DMF to conventional clutch set up. Once it is done right and you are fitting a Valeo conversion kit. The only time I've seen someone having an issue with vibrations is when they took a short cut and got into welding the DMF back togetether and when you get into this type of messing, sure you're asking for trouble!

Turbury

Saw a passat with this problem recently - it was let go too far, gearbox housing had been scored inside and so needed replacement also.

Fitted a solid flywheel to an avensis myself last week - cost 680 from motor factor, local garage guy helped me fit, charged 100 labour.

Result is - car driving good as new, absolutely no vibration.

OP's sounds like its in early stages of failure but be careful about letting it go too far!

Moanin

My 2006 VW Passat 2.0TDI is acting the same.It has 107,000 kms on the clock and I noticed this knocking noise recently. When I press the clutch or when the engine warms up it stops.
Wondering how long I can let this go before it does more damage to other engine parts?

Navan.Man

I had similar problems with a ford mondeo pre christmas. vibration in clutch (when releasing) - figured the clutch was on way out but then a week or so later the starting motor was causing problems (car still starting but awful grating sound). Brought to ford dealer expecting new starting motor but problem it seems is the flywheel was shedding metal filings which were going into starting motor (thereby needing replacement). They recognised problem immediately as it is apparently quite common.

Otions were a plenty - replace new starting motor only but flywheel problem would remain and problem would reoccur; they recommended replacing starter, flywheel, clutch and fluid cylinder (as theres about 100k miles on clock so likely to be necessary anyway in the not too distant future and then Id be back into big labour costs all over again!). All in all about 1750eur - dont know if its bad price but thats what it was and my options are limited - dont want the hassle of problems week in in week out [that said Im having unrelated problems with it now buts that for a new post!]

maidhc

Navan.Man wrote: »

I had similar problems with a ford mondeo pre christmas. vibration in clutch (when releasing) - figured the clutch was on way out but then a week or so later the starting motor was causing problems (car still starting but awful grating sound). Brought to ford dealer expecting new starting motor but problem it seems is the flywheel was shedding metal filings which were going into starting motor (thereby needing replacement). They recognised problem immediately as it is apparently quite common.

Otions were a plenty - replace new starting motor only but flywheel problem would remain and problem would reoccur; they recommended replacing starter, flywheel, clutch and fluid cylinder (as theres about 100k miles on clock so likely to be necessary anyway in the not too distant future and then Id be back into big labour costs all over again!). All in all about 1750eur - dont know if its bad price but thats what it was and my options are limited - dont want the hassle of problems week in in week out [that said Im having unrelated problems with it now buts that for a new post!]

I paid €1,300 or so for a DMF, slave, release bearing and clutch including fitting for a 2003 Focus TDCi. Car had 97k up.

Symptoms were the same as the above except for starter. there was no solid flywheel available either. Valeo were out of stock and would be for the forseeable future!

ninkynonk

My mondeo has a slight knocking/ vibration in the clutch. Is it anything to worry about or can i drive on this for long? 1000 big ones to fix it at the moment isnt really an option. so whats the worst that can happen?

Bobo78

Which cars do have DMF? Is it only diesels?

vectra

DonalB wrote: »

Hi,
this has been developing over the last week from the first time I heard it.
Irregularly happening but when it does it seems to be when starting/ slowing to stop, I hear/feel in my left foot a slight knocking sound.

I hear/Feel that especially in the damp weather in my Cordoba 1.4TDiS
I mentioed it to my main dealer when I brought it in for its first service ( 12 months - 9 thou kilometers.)

They took no notice of it saying something about it being electronic or something..!!
is there such thing ?
I dont want it to go out of warranty before it gives up on me and cost me a fortune

Toplink

My 08 Passat is giving this knocking sound the past few week and at least now I know why... press the clutch and the noise goes away.

I rang my local mechanic and he explained about the split flywheel alright. He is coming back to me on a price on replacement but he did mention that clutch would prob need to be done also.

One question... This car has 90K miles on it. I would have thought it was a bit soon for a problem like this to emerge?

Anyway. Seriously thinking of trading for a Honda Accord instead. My sister has a 2004 and has spent next to nothing on it since ye bought it new 9 years ago.

Alanstrainor

Toplink wrote: »

My 08 Passat is giving this knocking sound the past few week and at least now I know why... press the clutch and the noise goes away.

I rang my local mechanic and he explained about the split flywheel alright. He is coming back to me on a price on replacement but he did mention that clutch would prob need to be done also.

One question... This car has 90K miles on it. I would have thought it was a bit soon for a problem like this to emerge?

Anyway. Seriously thinking of trading for a Honda Accord instead. My sister has a 2004 and has spent next to nothing on it since ye bought it new 9 years ago.

3 year old thread man!