Help with Installing a fireplace?

burly

Hi everyone,

Ive decided to switch from a gas fire in the living room to an open solid fuel fire. Ive had the gas disconnected by a professional, and whats left now is the original block-work opening. Ive installed a concrete base to the same level as the hearth (Im keeping the original hearth and mantle-piece). What i need now is a fire-back insert, and Im wondering should i go for a pre-cast or cast iron back.Which holds the heat better? Also in terms of the filling behind the fire-back, should i go for a dry sand/lime mix, or rockwool?

Appreciate any help!

fmcc

Burly not much differ between the cast iron and concrete backs but depending on your insert you may geta acast iron back with a closable damper to shut when theres no fire on which would be a help. Behind fill with sand lime cement mix 7:1:1 and be sure to slope up at an angle smilar to that of the concrete back if using one so there are no flat spots for soot ash to gather.
The insert you have between the surround and the wall is that filled? it should be and sealed to the wall.then the surround goes back over this.

burly

fmcc wrote: »

Burly not much differ between the cast iron and concrete backs but depending on your insert you may geta acast iron back with a closable damper to shut when theres no fire on which would be a help. Behind fill with sand lime cement mix 7:1:1 and be sure to slope up at an angle smilar to that of the concrete back if using one so there are no flat spots for soot ash to gather.
The insert you have between the surround and the wall is that filled? it should be and sealed to the wall.then the surround goes back over this.

Thanks for the reply fmcc,

Not sure what you mean by the insert between the surround and the wall? at the minute i have a fireplace, with an opening showing the exposed blockwork of the original chimney. I have a hearth outside, and between the hearth and the back of the chimney opening, i have placed a concrete base. Ive done no other filling otherwise.

fmcc

Hi Burly
The fireplace may be of a certain type when you look at it is it all one piece stone or lots of tiles making up the fireplace with a wood shelf. A lot of models have a seperate hearth a seperate insert and a seperate surround and its the insert thats hould be filled. if its all one piece your sound. When you look up in the hole can you see anything between the original wall of the chimney breast and the fireplace.
Its a difficult one to explain in words a picture tells a thousand so sorry if I hav't explained it very well.

MicktheMan

burly wrote: »

Hi everyone,

Ive decided to switch from a gas fire in the living room to an open solid fuel fire. Ive had the gas disconnected by a professional, and whats left now is the original block-work opening. Ive installed a concrete base to the same level as the hearth (Im keeping the original hearth and mantle-piece). What i need now is a fire-back insert, and Im wondering should i go for a pre-cast or cast iron back.Which holds the heat better? Also in terms of the filling behind the fire-back, should i go for a dry sand/lime mix, or rockwool?

Appreciate any help!

Would you not install a small solid fuel stove instead of an open fire. Much more efficient. Just a thought!

RKQ

Heatherview drew a great sketch in a recent thread.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055468252

Also check that your original chimney was built for a soild fire.
(Stove or insert is also worth considering)

burly

RKQ wrote: »

Heatherview drew a great sketch in a recent thread.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055468252

Also check that your original chimney was built for a soild fire.
(Stove or insert is also worth considering)

Good link to that sketch, thanks.

The fire surround is built with tiles, with a wooden mantle. I think il take some photos later and show you what im looking at! Thanks for the advice lads, please check this thread again later and il have some photos which might explain it better. Cheers

burly

burly wrote: »

Good link to that sketch, thanks.

The fire surround is built with tiles, with a wooden mantle. I think il take some photos later and show you what im looking at! Thanks for the advice lads, please check this thread again later and il have some photos which might explain it better. Cheers

Hi again,

well ive taken some photos, so you can see type of fireplace it is. There does soom to be a gap between the wall and the back of the insert, i assume a sand/fire cement mix will be ok for filling this, the flue gatherer and flue liners seem in good condition.
Also ive checked the hearth, and there are joints in it, i assume these are expansion joints and its ok, as ive read in another post that if it was one solid hearth with no expansion joints, it wouldnt do as it coud crack.

Appreciate any comments on the photos thanks.

Heatherview

Hi Burly
Is there room behind the ope to hide both faces of the fireback. I cannot see one in photo ? You will need the thickness of the face both sides for a flush fit.??
Heatherview

burly

Heatherview wrote: »

Hi Burly
Is there room behind the ope to hide both faces of the fireback. I cannot see one in photo ? You will need the thickness of the face both sides for a flush fit.??
Heatherview

Good point Heatherview, hadn't thought of that.

I know what you mean, any ideas on how i could disguise it?? I was thinking maybe using a sand/fire cement mix to smoothen the edge on the fire back?

burly

Heatherview wrote: »

Hi Burly
Is there room behind the ope to hide both faces of the fire-back. I cannot see one in photo ? You will need the thickness of the face both sides for a flush fit.??
Heatherview

Good point heatherview, any ideas on how i might disguise that sharp edge?
Also can anyone advise what is the best filler to put behind the fire-back, sand/lime mix or rock-wool? if sand/lime what is the best proportion 7:1 say??

thanks

Heatherview

Hi Burly
Take a look at drawings ive done and see if you can understand where i am coming from. You cannot really doctor up front as f/back would be projecting about 35mm on each side. Attached a few sketches see what you think.Sorry attachment to big to send will send it in 2 stages later
Have you a fax No or PM me your E mail and i will send drawings
Heatherview

burly

Heatherview wrote: »

Hi Burly
Take a look at drawings ive done and see if you can understand where i am coming from. You cannot really doctor up front as f/back would be projecting about 35mm on each side. Attached a few sketches see what you think.Sorry attachment to big to send will send it in 2 stages later
Have you a fax No or PM me your E mail and i will send drawings
Heatherview

Yeh that would be great, you can fax it to 01-6335695, or email burly@campus.ie, thanks a million for your help.

burly

Hi everyone,

Just thought i'd share the photographs of the finished fireplace.
Thank fully the job was a success, thanks for all the advice.

Please refer any future threads on this subject to this thread.

Thanks

RKQ

Looks good, well done!:D

RKQ

Looks good, nice job, well done!

oxygen_old

Hey Burly. V impressed with your work, well done. Can I ask you, I have a gas fire as well in the sitting room. I was thinking of going the other way tho, it has a fireback but I was thinking of taking out the fireplace,mantle,fireback and having a gasbasket in a hollow fireplace instead. A fireback kinda like the first pictures you posted, without a fireback.
Whats your opinion? Too much heat loss in that?

burly

Hi Oxygen,

As you know, real fires are probably the least efficient of all the options, but i just loved the atmosphere so i changed from the gas. The fire-back is great at pushing most of the heat back into the room. But I have seen some fireplaces, where a solid fuel stove has been placed inside the original block-work hole in the wall, and the hole has been tiled with a black tile, it looks well. When you say a gas-basket, what exactly do you mean, im not familiar with that term.

Regards

oxygen wrote: »

Hey Burly. V impressed with your work, well done. Can I ask you, I have a gas fire as well in the sitting room. I was thinking of going the other way tho, it has a fireback but I was thinking of taking out the fireplace,mantle,fireback and having a gasbasket in a hollow fireplace instead. A fireback kinda like the first pictures you posted, without a fireback.
Whats your opinion? Too much heat loss in that?

oxygen_old

Hey Burly, did I say gasbasket, I meant a firebasket, from a gas supply, like this....
http://www.heritage-fireplace-shop.co.uk/sitedata/57/castella-magiglo-gas-fire-basket.jpg
Thats the kinof setup I want, without the fireplace, mantle or hearth

I have an office I want to install a solid fuel stove in, I just think in a sitting room, I would create the atmosphere of a fireplace. A friend and my sister both recommend getting a real fire, how much did you pay to remove the gas pipe?

burly

Hey oxygen,

I have a plumber who did it for 20euro!very small job, there should be a seperate valave for the gas fire located at the meter or just inside the house somewhere, whuch just needs to be switched off permanently. If you ring Bord Gais they'll recommend getting an approved installer who'l charge minimum 80 euro call out fee, but if you know a good plumber, i would go with that.
I ws ;eft with a rough base where the gas-fire used to be, so i just mixed some sand-cement and created a platorm level with the hearth.
The fire-basket your thinking off looks lovely, you could tile the back and sides of the hole as i said before.
Any other questions?

oxygen wrote: »

Hey Burly, did I say gasbasket, I meant a firebasket, from a gas supply, like this....
http://www.heritage-fireplace-shop.co.uk/sitedata/57/castella-magiglo-gas-fire-basket.jpg
Thats the kinof setup I want, without the fireplace, mantle or hearth

I have an office I want to install a solid fuel stove in, I just think in a sitting room, I would create the atmosphere of a fireplace. A friend and my sister both recommend getting a real fire, how much did you pay to remove the gas pipe?

oxygen_old

thanks for that Burly I think you've answered most my questions.

Heatherview

Hi burly
Great job, keep home fire burning. glad to be of assistance.
Heatherview

It's now illegal for anybody but a registered gas installer to work on gas installations, a bit extreme some would say, but it's all about safety, safety, safety, builders and plumbers tend not to have u gauges (or gasmans paranoia), which is the only real way to confirm even a simple job doesn't go bang in the night and as a gas fitter, i could not walk away from a simple job without putting a test on, Gary

burly

Hey again to everyone who helped me with this, thought I'd share this photo of my lovely cosy real fire in action.....definitely worth it!