Dole Cut

fifomania

I've been unemployed for a year and have been getting my full dole. I got assessed in November and my stamps ran out at the start of this month and I found out when I started getting my money again this week that I've been cut by €70 because I'm living with my boyf! :mad: Apparently, we're treated as a married couple, even though we don't share finances, except halving bills. I was in shock and I've been trying not to be down-hearted about this. Can I go back to living at home and my full money will be restored or what else can I do?? Advice welcome, thanks

dolliemix

i think thats fair enough!

fifomania

Explain to me how that is "fair enough"!? we're two individuals, not married. my money is mine and his money is his.

dolliemix

you're sharing some of your outgoings with your boyfriend now. you said it yourself.

Tar.Aldarion

Just like you share your outgoings with anybody you live with? Nonsense cut.

fifomania

The only 'outgoings' I share with him are the ESB and Eircom every two months! Otherwise our finances are COMPLETELY separate. So just because i'm under someone elses' roof I have to get cut. That's bulls***! Why are the Department scrimping on stuff like this, instead of getting rid of half their employees who are on massive wage for very little!? If they went after Sean Fitzpatrick and Rody Molloy instead of the 'little people' as usual, it'd be time well spent!

Mr. Presentable

What do you get now?

You are being assessed as common law couple. Is there a reason why? Have they been told something - like is your partner working and taking assessment for tax as a couple?

Tar.Aldarion

Sounds like she gets 135, which is a pretty big cut.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

fifomania wrote: »

The only 'outgoings' I share with him are the ESB and Eircom every two months! Otherwise our finances are COMPLETELY separate. So just because i'm under someone elses' roof I have to get cut. That's bulls***! Why are the Department scrimping on stuff like this, instead of getting rid of half their employees who are on massive wage for very little!? If they went after Sean Fitzpatrick and Rody Molloy instead of the 'little people' as usual, it'd be time well spent!

It's a recession, you're going to have to make sacrifices. If the dole covers your food, water and shelter then it's doing its job.

Sleipnir

It is ridiculous that for social welfare payments, you can be treated as a married couple if you're living together but for income tax, inheritance and the whole other range of payments YOU make to the government, you're treated as "strangers" to each other.

I can't see how that's fair?

Mr. Presentable

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

Sounds like she gets 135, which is a pretty big cut.

Maybe, but she doesn't pay rent, for example. I think it's more than fair - there's no encouragement to go out and get a job if you're getting €200.00 plus into your hand for sitting at home watching telly.

cooperla

I know this is normal practice in many countries... once you're living with someone for 6 months you're considered common law.

As far as moving back home, logically you should get even less if you're living with the parents (I'm not from Ireland so am not sure how it works in this situation, sorry).

I think this must be expepted in the current climate.

Sleipnir

cooperla wrote: »

I know this is normal practice in many countries... once you're living with someone for 6 months you're considered common law.

Common law spouse only applies in the U.K. There is no law in Ireland for it.
If you can be "considered" common law husband and wife in a country which has no basis in law for it, again, how can that be fair?

What other foreign laws can I apply to myself? The right to bear arms?

Tar.Aldarion

nipplenuts wrote: »

Maybe, but she doesn't pay rent, for example. I think it's more than fair - there's no encouragement to go out and get a job if you're getting €200.00 plus into your hand for sitting at home watching telly.

Oh I thought she was paying rent. Anyway, my brother has no bills whatsoever and gets the full amount, no rent, no esb, no food etc.

fifomania

I'm now getting €135 a week.
And yes I do pay rent, I wouldn't sponge off anyone I was living with, boyfriend or not.
And as for "there's no encouragement to go out and get a job if you're getting €200.00 plus into your hand for sitting at home watching telly." This is not the case for everyone on the dole. I'm not out of work out of choice and in the past year I've been on fas.ie, irishjobs, monster and reading papers every day looking work and I've written down on 4 full foolscap pages every job I've applied for. Please don't generalise, not everyone is a lazy sod.

Ginger83

If you were to state you have moved home to try to collect your full 204euro the social welfare could possibly do a means test on your parents house. ie: the full income entering your parents property regardless whether you see ant of it or not.

Would this be off benefit to you? Or you take the risk of ending up with less!

cee_jay

Ginger83 wrote: »

If you were to state you have moved home to try to collect your full 204euro the social welfare could possibly do a means test on your parents house. ie: the full income entering your parents property regardless whether you see ant of it or not.

Would this be off benefit to you? Or you take the risk of ending up with less!

they only take her parents income into consideration if under 25.
But even still your means could be calculated as higher and you could end up with less.

If you are not entirely happy with the decision made on your daily means and the amount you are now getting, you are entitled to appeal it and have your case reviewed again by a different person.

sassa

It's ridiculous the way they cut dole with no warning my boyfriend is on the dole and I am on maternity leave and we are now expected to run our household on €70 less per week with 2 kids to support. What will the situation be when I have to sign on too as I've been told that there may not be a position for me to return to. Why cant they bloody ask you to go in for a review of your case before cutting it down.

also if you move home you will end up with less as they will assume that you are not paying rent and cut your benefit again(have been told of this happening before) your best chance is to ask for your case to be reviewed.

Kristopherus

sassa wrote: »

It's ridiculous the way they cut dole with no warning my boyfriend is on the dole and I am on maternity leave and we are now expected to run our household on €70 less per week with 2 kids to support. What will the situation be when I have to sign on too as I've been told that there may not be a position for me to return to. Why cant they bloody ask you to go in for a review of your case before cutting it down.

also if you move home you will end up with less as they will assume that you are not paying rent and cut your benefit again(have been told of this happening before) your best chance is to ask for your case to be reviewed.

You are considered by DSFA to be cohabitting, which may or may not be the case. You will have to prove to them that it is not. Now if both of you are on a DSFA payment and are renting, you may be entitled to rent allowance. You can check this out with your local Community Welfare Officer.

Mrs OBumble

fifomania wrote: »

The only 'outgoings' I share with him are the ESB and Eircom every two months! Otherwise our finances are COMPLETELY separate.

You seriously expect us to believe that you have separate shelves in the pantry, separate rolls of toilet paper, separate boxes of laundry detergent, separate lease agreements (so the landlord could chuck you out for not paying your rent, but he could stay), etc?

If this really is the case, then ask the welfare for a review, and provide evidence of the above.

Tar.Aldarion

Again, how is this different from having a normal housemate?

dolliemix

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

Again, how is this different from having a normal housemate?

im not sure i know what you're asking.

if you're sharing accommodation your outgoings decrease. Social welfare recognise this obviously.

I moved from living with one person to living with two people. Initially my bills, rent etc were halfed - now I only have to pay a third of everything.

Social welfare take this into account

OP moves in with her boyfriend......

dlambirl

OP - did the social welfare find out themselves that you were living with your boyfriend or did you tell them??

speedy2007

dolliemix wrote: »

im not sure i know what you're asking.

if you're sharing accommodation your outgoings decrease. Social welfare recognise this obviously.

I moved from living with one person to living with two people. Initially my bills, rent etc were halfed - now I only have to pay a third of everything.

Social welfare take this into account

OP moves in with her boyfriend......

AFAIK social welfare wont reduce your dole if you are living with flatmates, whether it be 2, 3 ,4 etc..
But they will if they believe you are living with a boyf/girlf.
I live with my boyf and we half our bills and rent much like flatmates do. We also half the cost of things like toilet roll and detergent , again like flatmates. But its not like a husband and wife situation where if im not working, he would then take over some bills on my behalf, which i think is also the same with the OP.
But the welfare sees this differently...i believe that was the point.

Mr. Presentable

fifomania wrote: »

The only 'outgoings' I share with him are the ESB and Eircom every two months! Otherwise our finances are COMPLETELY separate. !

So are you saying you pay rent separately from your boyfriend, yet share the accomodation with him? In that case you could claim some relief. Actually, the rent must be miniscule if you can afford it from €135.00 per week.

Tar.Aldarion

dolliemix wrote: »

im not sure i know what you're asking.

if you're sharing accommodation your outgoings decrease. Social welfare recognise this obviously.

I moved from living with one person to living with two people. Initially my bills, rent etc were halfed - now I only have to pay a third of everything.

Social welfare take this into account

OP moves in with her boyfriend......

It's as speedy said, you could share expenses with loads of housemates as long as you say you are single, but if you say you are not it's an instant cut, even though you are likely to have more expensive living with one person or whatever. You can live at home and automatically get the full amount with no expenses.

nipplenuts wrote: »

So are you saying you pay rent separately from your boyfriend, yet share the accomodation with him?

Yes she is.

In that case you could claim some relief. Actually, the rent must be miniscule if you can afford it from €135.00 per week.

Well I doubt she can afford much now, it's just been cut.


I advise you apply for rent allowance if you are eligible, I would never mention living with partner but c'est la vie.

tomred1

This has been Social Welfare legalisaltion for donkey years,if you did any kind of research you would have known your payment would be reduced.

321654

Why not tell them you split up and see what happens.

thegame

im also living with my g/f and she gets 600 a week.i brought up her pay slip on friday,have to collect my money tomorrow.god only knows if its cut.my g/f does not provide me at all and she has her own loans and car loan..also i have loans if its cut heavy ill be in trouble.ill say to them ill have to move out and live on the street..its a joke the system is

c4cat

sassa wrote: »

It's ridiculous the way they cut dole with no warning my boyfriend is on the dole and I am on maternity leave and we are now expected to run our household on €70 less per week with 2 kids to support. What will the situation be when I have to sign on too as I've been told that there may not be a position for me to return to. Why cant they bloody ask you to go in for a review of your case before cutting it down.

also if you move home you will end up with less as they will assume that you are not paying rent and cut your benefit again(have been told of this happening before) your best chance is to ask for your case to be reviewed.

With kids You get more in benefits such as child benefit e166 x 2 kids, rent allowence and when you have your third child another E166 per month and as a coulple with kids on the Dole thats over 550 per week, with free medical card, and you complain of not being able to manage, cut out smoking and drinking from that kind of budget then one is living on easy street I say, subsidised by the single morons amongst us who get feck all benefits and just pay tax

c4cat

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

It's as speedy said, you could share expenses with loads of housemates as long as you say you are single, but if you say you are not it's an instant cut, even though you are likely to have more expensive living with one person or whatever. You can live at home and automatically get the full amount with no expenses.

nipplenuts wrote: »

So are you saying you pay rent separately from your boyfriend, yet share the accomodation with him?

Yes she is.

Well I doubt she can afford much now, it's just been cut.


I advise you apply for rent allowance if you are eligible, I would never mention living with partner but c'est la vie.

not mentioning a partner is fraud and obtaining benefits by deception and theft from the public purse, but its ok to do, is it?

c4cat

sassa wrote: »

It's ridiculous the way they cut dole with no warning my boyfriend is on the dole and I am on maternity leave and we are now expected to run our household on €70 less per week with 2 kids to support. What will the situation be when I have to sign on too as I've been told that there may not be a position for me to return to. Why cant they bloody ask you to go in for a review of your case before cutting it down.

also if you move home you will end up with less as they will assume that you are not paying rent and cut your benefit again(have been told of this happening before) your best chance is to ask for your case to be reviewed.

The rule is simple if you share the same bed and making children yr a couple not house mates

AntiRip

c4cat wrote: »

not mentioning a partner is fraud and obtaining benefits by deception and theft from the public purse, but its ok to do, is it?

God who in their right mind would do that?

Highsider

Jesus christ 135 euro a week. That's a disgrace :mad:. Even at 200 a week the dole is a joke. How in the name of jesus is anyone meant to survive on that.

Mr. Presentable

AntiRip wrote: »

God who in their right mind would do that?

Dude, don't use my name on that quote, please. It isn't mine.

thebman

c4cat wrote: »

The rule is simple if you share the same bed and making children yr a couple not house mates

What if he can show, she isn't putting out :P

Sorry couldn't help but point out how ridiculous that sounds. I don't mind the whole, your not married but your together thing but I imagine if he challenged them on it, they don't have any evidence and how can they withdraw payments without evidence?

And how is the OP suppose to show that they aren't getting busy with each other in the house if they live together anyway. They could just be house mates.

Seems like something that is impossible to enforce without 100% honesty in which case half the country is lying about it (least the half on the dole are/will be :P).

joeking

rent allowance scams are aboundant so the sw are cutting tight on everything mate.
i actualy can see where there coming from, and would have to say i agree with them.

ive had a few pals in the same boat.
ive even had a mate get his medical card restricted.
article in the paper last friday 1 billion euro is the speculation of what they want to save in 09.
however . without going in to too much here, i know of certain people creaming from every chance they get to get more payouts from all kinds of things like family income support clothing alowences etc im actualy thinking of reporting this person.
boasting in the pub last week got 200euro for a suit for an interveiw. and drank it in front of me ..

Tar.Aldarion

c4cat wrote: »

not mentioning a partner is fraud and obtaining benefits by deception and theft from the public purse, but its ok to do, is it?

I break laws I don't agree with.

shoegirl

Sleipnir wrote: »

Common law spouse only applies in the U.K. There is no law in Ireland for it.
If you can be "considered" common law husband and wife in a country which has no basis in law for it, again, how can that be fair?

What other foreign laws can I apply to myself? The right to bear arms?

As far as I understand the situation is the same definitely in the UK and probably for most other European countries. If you are living with a non-relative of the opposite sex, you are assumed to be living as a couple unless you can prove otherwise. And even though you have totally separate financial affairs, I am sure you pay rent, or make a meaningful contribution to a mortgage, share bills etc.

The issue most people have is that unmarried couples don't get the benefit of married tax breaks, but I suppose thats the price you pay for not making that particular committment.

The other piece of irony is that a gay couple would always currently be treated as two separate adults, but only because the state has no recognition whatsoever of gay relationships so they also lose out on tax breaks without having an option to tie the knot.

Moving out would restore your entitlement to full payment. Its a sad affair when the state assumes that as a "couple" your financial affairs are interlinked even though they may not be.

axel rose

c4cat wrote: »

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

not mentioning a partner is fraud and obtaining benefits by deception and theft from the public purse, but its ok to do, is it?

Ive brought this up on an earlier thread. I just cant understand why the mods of this forum are promoting fraud and theft in the social welfare system. Im still waiting for one of them to explain it to me.