Storage Heating Problem

Stephen P

Not sure if this is the correct forum or not.
I'll try be a brief as possible...
I have storage heating in my apartment and I'm on the night-time tariff. I have 3 storage heaters. The element in 2 of the heaters are after going leaving us with 2 dead heaters :mad:. We're only in the apartment 1 & half yrs so they shouldn't go that soon. When we first moved in the heaters wouldn't come on at night so the builder called back to fix it. On the DEVI controller on the fuse board he left the day controller set to "const.". I got my own electrician out recently and he said because it was left at const. that's why the elements went. The heating doesn't come on if the controller is changed from const. We got back in touch with the builder and they said it should be left at const.
To explain further what I mean see this link, page 3 shows the controller and the setting I'm talking about. Can anyone advise me what the correct setting is? Should it be left at const.? And is it wired incorrectly at the moment?

Thank you.
SP

Victor

Moved from Accommodation & Property.

davelerave

the day button is inoperative for nsh (it doesn't do anything!-last time i checked anyway).to set the devireg for comfort you first set the nite button to midrange for a nite or two and then adjust it up or down slightly once again for more or less heat.thats assuming everything is working and wired correctly first .are there lites on the switches beside the heaters ?do they come on ?can you hear the contactor switching at nite?

Davy

Const. is a TEST SETTING ONLY

Stephen P

I contacted the company who make the DEVI Reg and this is what they said...

The day dial should be set to the midway point. The 710-2 is an energy saving device, it takes the temperature from outside (using the outdoor sensor), based on that temperature the 710-2 then decides how many hours the storage heaters should be on for. So for example lets say the temp outside was 10 degrees. The 710-2 calculates that to maintain optimum temperature inside the dwelling the storage heaters should be on 6 hours instead of 8. The 710-2 then turns the power on to the heaters, however it is the last 6 hours of the off peak not the first so it might not come on until 2 in the morning. When you set the day dial to const you override this process, the outdoor sensor is ignored and the heaters are switched on for the full 8 hours.

He also told me that having the day dial set to const. wasn't the reason the element went. So there's another reason...:mad:

davelerave

Stephen P wrote: »

I contacted the company who make the DEVI Reg and this is what they said...



He also told me that having the day dial set to const. wasn't the reason the element went. So there's another reason...:mad:

ya the devireg won't burn out an element and outputs at the end of the off-peak period.i'm surpised to hear that the setting on the day button affects the nsh(i will check this and stand corrected if so!)can you check the contactor and lights?

Stephen P

The heating is kicking in at 11pm every night as normal and the LED goes from green to red.
Could the contractor be faulty then?
The information I got was from the company who make the DEVI Reg, the company is actually called DEVI (www.devi.ie)
At present the day dial is at const., last night after 11pm when the red light came on I turned the dial to ^ and the red light went off. It might have come back on later in the night like I posted in the post above but I didn't want to chance it incase we had no heat today.

davelerave

stephen i clarified that with devi .its as davton said. the constant setting on the day button is to test the heating and can be left at midrange normally.the nite button regulates the storage heating and can be adjusted as i described.cant help further i dont recall how the lites work

Stephen P

Yea its just as I thought. I knew the day dial wasn't meant to be left at const. As the pdf says above its a test setting only. The electrican from the builders is calling Tuesday morning I'll see then what he has to say about it.

flyfree

The "devireg" is merely a temperature regulation device. The elements in your storage heaters are not "gone", there is no electricity reaching the elements, most likely caused by the built in over heat stat having tripped internally in the heater.

A very simple problem, very simply solved by a qualified and experienced electrician.

Stephen P

flyfree wrote: »

The "devireg" is merely a temperature regulation device. The elements in your storage heaters are not "gone", there is no electricity reaching the elements, most likely caused by the built in over heat stat having tripped internally in the heater.

A very simple problem, very simply solved by a qualified and experienced electrician.

My electrican opened up the storage heater and 2 of the 3 elements were corroded and one of the them snapped off in his hand. The 3rd one was perfect. Very strange. He thought because the DEVIReg was on const. that's why the elements corroded but the chap from DEVI said that wouldn't be the reason.

flyfree

Stephen P wrote: »

My electrican opened up the storage heater and 2 of the 3 elements were corroded and one of the them snapped off in his hand. The 3rd one was perfect. Very strange. He thought because the DEVIReg was on const. that's why the elements corroded but the chap from DEVI said that wouldn't be the reason.

The only reason for corroded elements is that the terminal connections of the elements inside the heater were not tightened, causing high current, high temperature arching. This was the installers fault for not insuring the tightness of all connections.

You are just lucky your apartment didn't burn down.

Stephen P

flyfree wrote: »

The only reason for corroded elements is that the terminal connections of the elements inside the heater were not tightened, causing high current, high temperature arching. This was the installers fault for not insuring the tightness of all connections.

You are just lucky your apartment didn't burn down.

Jesus...is that the only possible way the elements could corrode? There was sparks coming out of the bottom of the heater the night it went, I turned it off immediately. When the electrican calls should he cop this or will I suggest it to him? Should they replace the elements? That's if they take responsibility...

flyfree

Unless he is a complete moron he will know all too well that the reason the elements went like this is because they were not connected properly, whether he will admit this is a totally different story.

Replace them??!! He should be kissin your feet that you don't sue him.

People on this forum need to realise how strict electrical safety standards are and why they are so strict. I mean you are a classic example of poor installation and the unspeakable consequences that could have been.....

Stephen P

flyfree wrote: »

Unless he is a complete moron he will know all too well that the reason the elements went like this is because they were not connected properly, whether he will admit this is a totally different story.

Replace them??!! He should be kissin your feet that you don't sue him.

People on this forum need to realise how strict electrical safety standards are and why they are so strict. I mean you are a classic example of poor installation and the unspeakable consequences that could have been.....

Thanks a million for your advice. Both elements are still there in place so he should see them. I'll see what he says first and then maybe say what you said. He better replace them or I'll take it further. Should I take it further anyway?

flyfree

Stephen P wrote: »

Thanks a million for your advice. Both elements are still there in place so he should see them. I'll see what he says first and then maybe say what you said. He better replace them or I'll take it further. Should I take it further anyway?

I have to say it is a very serious breach of standards, heaters are a high current load. The fact that it got to the stage that the elements corroded and that you saw sparks from the heaters I would be inclined to report him to RECI or ECCSA which ever he is registered with, they will have to respond to you, thats what they are there for.

Stoner

Stephen P wrote: »

He better replace them or I'll take it further. Should I take it further anyway?

A second opinion from a qualified company is typically the way to go in this case, someone would need to examine the work, I would not recommend taking something further without a qualified person actually looking at it and providing you with hands on advice.
Make sure you find out who he is certified with so you know who to contact if you need to take it further, get it checked out as soon as you can IMO.

Make sure the unit stays switched off at the double pole switch until you have been reassured by someone on site.

flyfree

A second opinion is not neccessary with electrical insatllations under any circumstances.

A second opinion on safety will only cost you twice as much and is not needed.

RECI and ECCSA along with ETCI are in place to ensure electrical standards and safety and they can be approched free of charge.

Stephen P

I'll see what they say Tuesday morning, if they try to fob me off I'll say I'm going to contact the above to get i checked further. I presume RECI etc would call out?

Stoner

You should call out the body that certifies his work, he might not be registered with RECI.

check their web site

http://www.reci.ie/ConsumerServices/Findanelectrician/tabid/57/Default.aspx

Or the ESSSA here

http://www.ecssa.ie/find_contractor.html

If he is not on eiother site you may have an issue.

(just to be safe, please don't post the name of the firm here, I know you wont but , just to be sure)

flyfree

Yes RECI will call out to inspect the work of any of their members installations, free of charge, regardless. So do not be put of by thinking like "oh its not that big a deal" or stuff like that.

Stephen P

flyfree wrote: »

Yes RECI will call out to inspect the work of any of their members installations, free of charge, regardless. So do not be put of by thinking like "oh its not that big a deal" or stuff like that.

I hope the electrican that installed it is a member of an organisation. the builders are well known so I'd reckon they would only use registered electricans

flyfree

ESB will not connect an installation that has not been certified.

Stephen P

I think I know the name of the company who the builder got, if I'm right they're registered with RECI so hopefully I'm right.

Thanks for all the help lads!!

davelerave

i wouldn't jump to conclusions .heating elements can fail in normal use .storage heaters are not a fire hazard in themselves that i'm aware of.reci would certainly take a look if the contractor is registered

flyfree

Of course elements can be faulty.... not two of three though....and completely corrode!

davelerave

i don't see that much of it.i've seen them broken inside heaters .bricks can be damp but i send them back wouldn't take a chance

RoundyMooney

Stephen P wrote: »

My electrican opened up the storage heater and 2 of the 3 elements were corroded and one of the them snapped off in his hand. The 3rd one was perfect. Very strange. He thought because the DEVIReg was on const. that's why the elements corroded but the chap from DEVI said that wouldn't be the reason.

Did you see the elements yourself? Do you still have the old ones?

Corrosion on the body shouldn't be a factor, but if the damage, lets call it, is confined to the ends of the elements, then we can say more or less with certainty that it's down to loose connections rather than a faulty batch (unlikely given that one was OK) or a damp environment.

Certainly something to refer on to a higher authority in any event.