Creatine and marathons

--amadeus--

The last time I went into the health shop and was chatting to the guy there about supplements he recommended that I try creatine. I know that it has proven benefits for weight lifters but he claimed that it is effectively a precursor to ATP so taking a supplement would allow me to train harder for longer. Basically the creatine itself won't do me any good but it will act as an enabler to improve performance.

Anyone have any experience or comments?

hunnymonster

You ask tough questions don't you! The short answer is no, I don;t think you need to be taking creatine. Creatine monohydrate (in conjunction with the other ATP bits and pieces e.g. ribose) is of most use in anaerobic situations like lifting and sprinting. It doesn't appear to do much in aerobic situations like marathon running. That said, when I went to the literature to check my facts, there has been some work done in creatine supplementation before and after long training sessions and endurance races and it appears that the creatine groups have lower levels of inflammatory markers (cytokines and PGE(2)) after the exercise which is a good thing so there is a case for it in this context. If I were you, I would be taking a good multivit (assume you keep an even on your iron and B vits?) and some BCAA. [note for other people reading this, Amadeus is a vegetarian]. I'm not an expert in this though so for real advice I would talk to g'em.

--amadeus--

I like to keep you on your toes

Thanks for a comprehensive reply (some of which I even understand!). I do take a generic multi-vit that includes all the B vits (esp B12). I also eat a fair bit of fruit - 4 satsumas and a plum last night for example - so I'm happy enough with my general nutrition, it was the creatine specifically I was wondering about because my understanding was also that it was better for short intense exercise. I bought it anyway on the basis that it can't do any harm...

Think I will cross post into Fitness anyway and see if G'em has any advice.

Thanks!

[edit] BCAA --> Branch Chain Amino Acids?

tunney

Creatine..........

I do take it but only for the months of December, Janurary and February, and only for the gym work I do which is bike specific.

If I was pure running then it would be counter-productive as you do put on weight (water mass) when taking it.

That being said it does help in small doses in recovery drinks and it does aid concentration.

However as hunnymonster said a good multi-vit and BCAAs. BCCAAs would be something I recommend highly. ZMA too........

hunnymonster

--amadeus-- wrote: »

[edit] BCAA --> Branch Chain Amino Acids?

yip!

--amadeus--

tunney wrote: »

However as hunnymonster said a good multi-vit and BCAAs. BCCAAs would be something I recommend highly. ZMA too........

BCAAs I know but BCCAAs I haven't come across. I'm assuming it's a sub set of BCAAs? What are the advantages of ZMA over a more general multi-vit, is it just the Magnesium or is it the specific combo?

tunney

--amadeus-- wrote: »

BCAAs I know but BCCAAs I haven't come across. I'm assuming it's a sub set of BCAAs? What are the advantages of ZMA over a more general multi-vit, is it just the Magnesium or is it the specific combo?

BCCAAs is a typo BCAAs is what I meant.

ZMA - helps me sleep alot better - better sleep == better recovery. Anecdotal evidence to suggest increased testosterone levels as well.

fizal

just thought i'd throw in a quick comment on this topic, you all seem to have come to similair conclusions, and you'd be correct, creatine supplementation is only really usefull for athletes or general exercisers who are taking part in weight training. The phospho-creatine system in the body essentially only provides atp production for 8 to 10 seconds of 'explosive' effort, after this, ATP is then generated using various energy pathways which are too complex to explain in a little box!!!, after around 5 mins nearly all the ATP is being produced aerobically (using a combination of glycogen and fat)

So in short, It's unlikely to aid your running but if you are including any weights based exercise it can be handy, no question!

One important note, Make sure you take on a minimum of 3.5 to 4 litres of water a day if taking creatine monohydrate, or you will suffer

depadz

is the bcaa recommendation a general one or specifically for vegetarians (am one too)?

fizal

BCAA's would be a good thing for vegetarians to take because generally speaking the most complete forms of protein are animal sources, vegetarian sources of protein don't contain a full amino acid profile so you would have to consume numerous different foods to hit all the amino acids

hunnymonster

BCAA's are also a good idea for exercising people who are trying trying to lose weight.

who007

tunney wrote: »

However as hunnymonster said a good multi-vit and BCAAs. BCCAAs would be something I recommend highly. ZMA too........

Where does one find these BCAA's? I am a pescaterian so am guessing these would benefit me too?

fizal

Good health stores, sports nutrition stores or countless websites are around that supply these, you could prob get them in holland and barrett but obviously the web can prove cheaper (try myprotein.co.uk) for an unbranded but equal quality product to things like maximuscle which are overpriced imo

Bambaata

thanks for the link fizal. Interesting topic.

Are ye all on something? If so, what and why? Cod liver oil is about all i'm on daily. But lately ive been pondering over this area as i dont eat much red meat and so may be lacking in certain areas.

who007

fizal wrote: »

Good health stores, sports nutrition stores or countless websites are around that supply these, you could prob get them in holland and barrett but obviously the web can prove cheaper (try myprotein.co.uk) for an unbranded but equal quality product to things like maximuscle which are overpriced imo

Thanks. And are they just called BCAAs or are there other terms/names for them?

fizal

yep, amino acids, bcaa's are a group of specific ones but if you can get an amino acid supplement that includes them all even better.

One thing i would say though is that generally speaking, most people would benefit from a well balanced diet which should include everything you need without the need for endless supplements, which can become expensive as their is a supplement to make up for just about every deficiency.

The natural sources of all these things is the best way to obtain them ie: diet but in this day and age it can be very difficult and time consuming making sure to maintain a 'perfect' diet.

people who are veggies are at a bit of a disadvantage re protein but thats about it really. You have to make up your own mind if you think supplements are for you or not.

tunney

fizal wrote: »

Good health stores, sports nutrition stores or countless websites are around that supply these, you could prob get them in holland and barrett but obviously the web can prove cheaper (try myprotein.co.uk) for an unbranded but equal quality product to things like maximuscle which are overpriced imo

If you are concerned with returning a positive dope test then they are not overpriced.

hunnymonster

BCAA = leucine, isoleucine & valine but you'll usually find them under "BCAA" if you look at any of the supplement's website. I've not taken them in a while but I should get back on them.

fizal

True, Never really considered it as i don't compete, their are a lot of lower cost alternative manufacturers out their though that certify their products doping free

shels4ever

fizal wrote: »

it can be very difficult and time consuming making sure to maintain a 'perfect' diet. .

+1
I agree there but the initial work might take some time but bad habbits once broken can be replaced with good ones.

If your putting 10+ hours a week into your training 1 hour planning your weekly diet isnt too much. I've really increased the focus on diet in the last few week as I dont want all my good work in the fields been wasted...