Cnlr Jim Long in Limerick Leader on migrants

han68

Quote from the limerick leader:

"Following the announcement last Thursday, Fine Gael Cllr Jim Long was critical of the Government in opening the floodgates to migrant workers. Cllr Long said the thousands of migrant workers in Limerick city have transferred hundreds of million of euro out of the country and believes "the vast majority of migrant workers have not contributed to the city."

I am one of Limerick's migrant workers (although not working at Dell), and I think the above (if it has been correctly interpreted by the Limerick Leader) is one of the most short sighted, stupidest things I have ever heard. Just like the migrant workers at Dell, I pay my taxes (and thus Mr Long's salary), do my shopping in Limerick etc etc.

Is this guy for real?

Mc Love

I have to say a lot of people think like that!

billy the squid

Most city and county councillors, when you think about it, are nothing more than housebroken muck savages. thick and ignorant.

han68

'Thick' might be an understatement here

At least I know now who NOT to vote for in the upcoming local elections, where migrant workers have a vote too :rolleyes:

billy the squid

The good people of Limerick didn't complain when the telegram came from America and England.

Mc Love

Citizens dont vote who end up on the council do we?

billy the squid

Yes we do, the election for local council is coming up in June of this year

What page of the paper is cllr longs statement.

The Saint

He should be ashamed. Ignorant twat.

Shan75

What a sad man he is.Who does he think would have done all these jobs if foreign workers hadn't come here over the last decade or so.As for transferring money out of the country I'm sure some money was sent home by people but we did the same years ago when we were emigrating and will probably do so again in the future.Does he not realise that all these people would have been paying rent for houses and buying food & clothes in the shops as well as, like the rest of us who pay taxes, paying his salary so he can spout nonsense like this.

The problem here though is that he may actually appeal to certain people who are looking for somebody to blame as things get a bit tighter.We will find out just who is thick come local election time.

billy the squid

Yeah well he can't even blame the dell workers for rising wages. While dell was represented twice through ibec and the american chamber of commerse at partnership talks, the workers, not being members of a trade union were not represented at all.

professore

Angela's Ashes anyone? Oh that's right "it was never like that". Thick f**er should be ashamed of himself.

Berty

I dont vote for city or council members so therefore they do not speak for me.

Working here, renting an apartment here, buying a car, filling up on petrol, buying groceries etc etc all contribute to the local economy.

I dont know any foreign nationals working and living legally in Ireland that do not contribute to the state. I know more lay about Irish people than any "foreigner".

han68

Billy:

It was posted here:

http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/Majority-of-Dells-Polish-workers.4865682.jp

Ardscoil Ris

Sticks and stones may break my bones,
but whips and chains excite me.

bazz26

What a complete and utter brainless moron.

If he wants to blame someone then he should look a bit closer to home. These people came over here and were willing to do the work that were simply not good enough for some of the lazy waste of space Irish who would prefer to spung off the state.

These kind of irresponsible comments could get someone seriously hurt or worse. I for one am ashamed to be of the same nationality as this muppet.

The Saint

I went looking for an email address so I could complain directly to him but it seems that he doesn't have one. Bah. Idiot.:mad:

Berty

The Saint wrote: »

I went looking for an email address so I could complain directly to him but it seems that he doesn't have one. Bah. Idiot.:mad:

Why dont you just call his mobile?

http://www.finegael.ie/representatives/councillors/index.cfm/type/person/pkkey/870/pkey/655/ikey/8

Hey Mod. This is public knowledge

Berty

The Saint wrote: »

I went looking for an email address so I could complain directly to him but it seems that he doesn't have one. Bah. Idiot.:mad:

AHAHAHAHA AHA here is something fun for you

jimlong@cllr.limerickcity.ie

trentf

Yup the politicans have started the old tricks again. Blaming immigrants. When they want the flack taken off them coz they know its coming because they did sfa to prevent the economic collapse and address our vunerability in the area of developing homebased industries during the boom years.

Expect more of this as they look to turn people against each other. Divide and conquer only this time i think people have copped onto this old ploy.

Aidric

He's entitled to his opinion. It's just a pity it's so ill informed and racist.

The Saint

Done. I suggest others do the same.

Dear Councillor Long,

I am writing in regard to disgraceful quotes attributed to you in The Limerick Leader on the 12th of January:

Following the announcement last Thursday, Fine Gael Cllr Jim Long was critical of the Government in opening the floodgates to migrant workers. Cllr Long said the thousands of migrant workers in Limerick city have transferred hundreds of million of euro out of the country and believes “the vast majority of migrant workers have not contributed to the city.”

“They have the opportunity to leave the country at will, but 60 per cent of the workers in Dell have mortgages and these are the people we have to protect,” said Cllr Long.

As I’m sure you understand being a Fine Gael Councillor that as a member state of the EU that all of these migrant workers are here perfectly legally as there is free movement of labour throughout the Union. I presume that you are not advocating the removal of Ireland from this clause and demand of all Irish citizens living in other EU states such as the UK.

Foreign workers who have contributed to the governments’ coffers for long enough for them to be entitled to social welfare should be allowed to avail of this benefit the same as any other person who has contributed regardless of where they came from. I would also assume that Irish émigré’s during recessionary times in the 1980’s should not have sent their remittances back to support their families from the UK, US and numerous other countries that the Irish sought refuge in during the hard times back home. I would also assume that you would not argue that Irish émigré’s contributed nothing to their host countries.

As for your assertion that these workers have not contributed to the city; these people have payed their taxes (and have therefore helped to pay your wages), they have paid rents, spent some of their wages in city businesses, set up businesses therefore paying city rates and corporation tax. Saying that these people have contributed nothing to the city is balderdash and disgraceful.

Your comments are disgraceful and dangerous. Seeking to scapegoat migrant workers might well lead to racist and bigoted attacks on foreign workers here. As a City Councillor you should be aware of the impact that comments from a politician can make. What you said is totally irresponsible and you should publically rescind and apologise for these comments before any harm comes to any foreign resident of this city.

Sincerely,

The Saint

gaf1983

han68 wrote: »

At least I know now who NOT to vote for in the upcoming local elections, where migrant workers have a vote too :rolleyes:

The thing is while you and other people on this forum probably won't vote for him, there are a lot of people who will be looking for an easy scapegoat to blame for the economic woes, and Cllr Long was no doubt cosying up to such voters with one eye on the upcoming local elections.

Very good letter The Saint, have to say I agree with every word of it, it will be interesting if you get a response, please keep us updated.

Aidric while I agree with your point that Cllr Long or any other councillor for that matter should be free to express any opinion, I don't think it is a racist opinion. Xenophobic yes.

The Saint

Hey, just to let ye know that the good Councillor replied to my email. I'm quite surprised actually. I'm not sure if it would be good manners/practise to post the email though. Can the mods maybe give me some advise? I've already replied to the reply though.

iguana

The Saint wrote: »

As I’m sure you understand being a Fine Gael Councillor that as a member state of the EU that all of these migrant workers are here perfectly legally as there is free movement of labour throughout the Union. I presume that you are not advocating the removal of Ireland from this clause and demand of all Irish citizens living in other EU states such as the UK.

Very few EU countries, just Ireland, Sweden and the UK, allowed total rights of labour movement to citizens of the 2004 accession countries. Just like we restricted movement to the 2007 accession states of Romania and Bulgaria. What I assume he was criticising was our government's decision to allow free movement in 2004 when we had the option to place controls for 7 years.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3513889.stm

Mc Love

The Saint wrote: »

Hey, just to let ye know that the good Councillor replied to my email. I'm quite surprised actually. I'm not sure if it would be good manners/practise to post the email though. Can the mods maybe give me some advise? I've already replied to the reply though.

If anyone wants to see it, they could pm you?!:pac:

The Saint

iguana wrote: »

Very few EU countries, just Ireland, Sweden and the UK, allowed total rights of labour movement to citizens of the 2004 accession countries. Just like we restricted movement to the 2007 accession states of Romania and Bulgaria. What I assume he was criticising was our government's decision to allow free movement in 2004 when we had the option to place controls for 7 years.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3513889.stm

My bad. However more states have subsequently removed these restrictions on the 2004 accession members. Anyway, this doesn't negate my point that the workers here are perfectly legal since the government put no restrictions on them.

talkingclock

The Saint wrote: »

Hey, just to let ye know that the good Councillor replied to my email.

What did he say? How is he defending himself? Did the public just misunderstood what he said and he didn't meant it at all?

inforfun

The Saint wrote: »

Done. I suggest others do the same.

I might just send that muppet an email and ask my tax back i paid over the last 7 years i have spent and worked in this country.....
Problem is, i will probably not be able to stay polite....

gaf1983 wrote: »

The thing is while you and other people on this forum probably won't vote for him, there are a lot of people who will be looking for an easy scapegoat to blame for the economic woes, and Cllr Long was no doubt cosying up to such voters with one eye on the upcoming local elections.

Very good letter The Saint, have to say I agree with every word of it, it will be interesting if you get a response, please keep us updated.

Aidric while I agree with your point that Cllr Long or any other councillor for that matter should be free to express any opinion, I don't think it is a racist opinion. Xenophobic yes.

That is a good point. Knowing politicians a bit, he doesnt give a flying f*ck about those 60% 's mortgages but oh.. would he love them to vote for them so he can keep his comfortable seat in the council.

The Saint

OK. Here's the reply I recieved from our dear Councillor. If the Mods think that it shouldn't be here please delete or let me know and I'll remove it. Cheers.

Oh yeah, I've posted it as I recieved it, without paragraphs, so don't complain to me.:P

Hi The Saint, I gave more than a couple of lines to the reporter, as a matter of fact I have in the past defended Migrant workers in relation to exploitation, twelve months ago I addressed the Polish Ambassador in the company of hundred of Polish people this address was followed up with positive advise as to their working rights and others, I certainly am not inciting racist remarks and no intent was designed, the Government after having had the Neece Treaty passed opened the floodgates to migrant workers coming from a non working background knew little or nothing of the very high rate of pay cost's in Ireland, and as such the Irish Government by interducing the min wage was designed to bring the lower payed up to scale, but what happened was exploitation of Irish cizitens being forced to scale down the ladder to the min wage, thus creating the race to the bottom, I take your comments, but the facts are that a number of Western Union offices were opened in the past two years all over the City, (this only meant one thing in my opinion,) the facts are that Migration is by nature governed by Good and Plenty-full times, these times are gone, should the Government give unemployment assistance to any former employee/worker then it must be done on pariety with all, I know hundreds of local people who will NOT be able to exist or pay their bills, mortage, and have NO choice but to fore-go what they asspired to in life, I make no apology when calling on these people to be proctected by the state or otherwise, unlike Migrant workers they cant pull up and go, I note you made no address to these people in your email, you are right I am a public representive, I relay the people's issues and concerns that they intrust me to do, to date 127 people have contacted me for advise, help, and have expressed most of the above mentioned, please feel free to contact me on this or any issue. also you might look up the Boston London archives on Irish Migrants all those years ago and compare for yourself what the Irish had to endure just to stay ALIVE, you just might form a different opinion on them compared to your defence of your comments. Cllr Jim Long

The Saint

And my reply.....

Dear Councillor Long,

Thank you for your prompt reply to my mail. As I’m sure you are aware that since Nice was passed by referendum all workers from the new accession states within the EU are legally entitled to work here or in any other member state. This has been the law since the Maastricht Treaty was passed in 1991. This is a legal requirement and government could not have stopped these people from coming here. At the time there was also a shortfall in labour in Ireland and these workers were to full such positions. This led to increased tax takings and an increase in the national GDP. The exploitation was to do with employers and the government and had nothing to do with migrant workers. If anything many of these migrant workers have been exploited by Irish employers by illegally paying them less than the minimum wage. Perhaps you should have directed your attention towards these employers that have been exploiting both Irish and foreign workers rather than focusing on migrant workers who are not breaking any labour laws.

I have not suggested that foreign workers should be given any more government benefits than Irish workers. Those that have been working in the country for long enough and have contributed to the government coffers should be equally entitled to such benefits. This is a legal requirement under EU law. While many of these workers might well move away, as might many Irish people, many of these workers have laid down roots here, have started families and have bought property here just like Irish workers. These EU workers are also your constituents since they are entitled to vote in local elections. It might be a good idea from a political perspective not to alienate such a constituency. I state again that all unemployed people should be given what they are entitled to under the law be they Irish or EU citizens.

What I found most objectionable about your comments, and what you did not address, is that you stated that these people have not contributed to the city. I will not go through what I have stated in the previous mail as I think I have made my points clear. I would like for you to clarify these comments.

I am also perfectly aware of the fate of Irish migrants that have travelled throughout the world. I would have thought that their plight might resonate with people here when dealing with our own immigrant population in these hard times instead of scapegoating them for cheap political expediency.

Regards,

The Saint

I'm aware this contains the same error as before but I sent it before it being clarified.

talkingclock

The Saint wrote: »

Oh yeah, I've posted it as I recieved it, without paragraphs, so don't complain to me.:P

is his mail realy ONE single sentence???

The Saint

talkingclock wrote: »

is his mail realy ONE single sentence???

Yup. Copied and pasted it as is. The spelling isn't fantastic either.

inforfun

That guy is missing some points. Also on his keyboard.

han68

Thanks for posting the correspondence so far, The Saint. On the positive side: he is reading his email (well sort off...) and even answering it (again: sort off...). Bet he will blame the migrant workers for missing the . on his keyboard too
I have yet to receive an answer back from Fine Gael party office in Dublin.. will keep you posted ...

ninty9er

While it's a completely unacceptable attitude IMO, we got a lot of it, particularly from construction workers and developers, on the doorsteps before the general election. "they have the country ruined" etc.

I made my excuses and left after making the usual, "immigrants pay taxes too", "their kids are the new Irish" arguments.

He will probably gain more votes than he will lose over this Duke of Edinburgh style gaffe.

Many of the migrant workers that I have worked alongside are here for the long haul, or intend to go home and return in a number of years. For some reason, despite the crap that's slung at them, they like Ireland. The Eastern Europeans in particular make a MASSIVE effort to fit in and bring their friends who work in isolated jobs into the social circle which they become part of at work.

I suppose the attack would have nothing to do with the fact he will be facing Polish opposition from Fianna Fáil in June...but that's just the cynic in me thinking out loud.

On a side note, a primary school teacher would rip a 4th or 5th class kid apart for writing something like Cllr. Long's response. There are countless spelling and grammatical errors. Did he perhaps write it in a flurry? "Would you like fries with that"

ninty9er

han68 wrote: »

I have yet to receive an answer back from Fine Gael party office in Dublin.. will keep you posted ...

I imagine you will get a standard issue reply, putting the ball in Cllr. Long's court. We had a particular accuastion levelled at us in a student newspaper that party HQ were contacted about, they contacted us and told us to deal with it ourselves.

billy the squid

The Saint wrote: »

Done. I suggest others do the same.

Did you send this to the Leader, it appears that it is in their letters page, along with Councillor Long's response.

Jumpy

billy the squid wrote: »

Did you send this to the Leader, it appears that it is in their letters page, along with Councillor Long's response.

Did they edit it to be readable? Or did they leave it the same?

The Saint

billy the squid wrote: »

Did you send this to the Leader, it appears that it is in their letters page, along with Councillor Long's response.

Hey Squid,
Yeah, I sent a copy to the leader aswell. I see you've put it up on the Limerick Blogger site too. Cheers.

billy the squid

At this rate he will running for a seat in Sydney town council with all the digging he is doing.

In the city edition claiming that loads of people shook his hand in apublic house over what he said. if someone in a pub shook his hand he must be right, right?