Tipperary Raid

Relevant

I know it is mentioned in another thread but i feel it deserves a thread of its own.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0109/carrickonsuir.html

30 firearms stolen in Tipperary raid

Friday, 9 January 2009 10:33
A number of firearms have been stolen during an armed robbery at a gun dealership in Carrick-on-Suir, Co Tipperary.
The incident happened at around 1.30am this morning at a licensed firearms dealership in Cregg.
The owners of the premises were confronted by four men, at least one of whom was armed, when they returned from a night out.


They were taken into the house which had two other occupants.
An assortment of around 30 firearms were taken, including pistols and rifles.
The family's beige/champagne coloured Honda Civic Saloon - registration 03WX5048 - was also taken.
No shots were fired and no one was injured in the incident.
Anyone with information is asked to contact gardaí at Carrick on Suir on 051 642040, the Garda Confidential Line on 1800 666 111 or any Garda Station

What are peoples opinions of this?
30 firearms, including pistols stolen. Journalists and politicians have been saying that guns were being stolen and that pistols should be banned. The reply of the shooting community was that their guns were locked away safely and couldn't be stolen. Now that criminals are going to these lengths will the government clamp down even further on gun ownership?

rrpc

Relevant wrote: »

I know it is mentioned in another thread but i feel it deserves a thread of its own.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0109/carrickonsuir.html



What are peoples opinions of this?
30 firearms, including pistols stolen. Journalists and politicians have been saying that guns were being stolen and that pistols should be banned. The reply of the shooting community was that their guns were locked away safely and couldn't be stolen. Now that criminals are going to these lengths will the government clamp down even further on gun ownership?

I'm not sure why you think it is the fault of the dealer for possessing the firearms in the first place. Perhaps based on that logic, banks and post offices shouldn't have cash, people shouldn't have cars, TV's, DVD players or jewellry and if they get robbed, it's their own silly fault for having the stuff.

Or maybe it's a more narrow approach that anything used in the commission of a crime should not in the first place be available to criminals.

That list may be shorter and more palatable to the general public, because obviously it's their fault and crime wouldn't exist without these articles being available. So we'll remove cars, hammers, slash-hooks, knives, balaclavas, drugs, screwdrivers, etc. from public ownership and watch our crime rates go down.

Trojan911

A reply to your other post.

Nobody has a safe choice when a firearm is pointed at them and they have to protect themselves and their close ones. Your argument is a non starter in this case.

Vegeta

Relevant wrote: »

Now that criminals are going to these lengths will the government clamp down even further on gun ownership?

They very well may.

Will it do anything to prevent crimes involving firearms, probably not.

That's what I see as sad about this. Now 30 firearms being stolen is a big deal but lets say there are zero in private ownership in Ireland. Does that equate to zero gun crime or even a noticeable drop in firearms related crime. I highly doubt it.

So every legitimate decent firearms user could get shafted but crime rates will not really be effected. If criminals want guns they'll get them no matter what the laws.

For example, there are a lot of illegal drugs that no one in the country should have, heroin, cocaine etc etc, has that stopped people, dealers and users alike, from getting them when they want them?
Its the same with guns, you can make every single one of them illegal and criminals will still have them.

slavetothegrind

Absolutely Vegeta,

Time to think about where your vote goes, did it go to the cretin who feels the banning of legally held firearms will help him score political points?
He knows full well it will do nothing to thwart crime but it costs nothing and gives him publicity, nice bit of civic duty don't you think?

How about halving the number of councillors and TD's in the country, we are over represented here and to no better effect than any other democracy.
Limit their terms in office to two at the most, maybe then at least in the second term they may govern rather than engaging in electioneering the whole time.

And, by the way, what is the average sentance served for illegal posession of a firearm? Bet it's not much!

Take the control of prison terms back from the parole boards, let's spend the extra and keep them in for the full sentance, i'm willing to pay! There is no feasable realistic solution to rehabilitation so let's at least do incarceration properly so the majority of us are safe.

Rant....rant....but dammit it makes me mad:mad:

Sikamick

Relevant please read.

EMERGING THREAT KNIFE CULTURE IN IRELAND
In this section »
Pawns in an unwinnable warLondon gripped by fear of teen knife crimeWHEN LAST YEAR'S crime figures were released, one of the stand-out statistics was the doubling in stabbing killings, from 18 in 2006 to 36 last year, writes Conor Lally , Crime Correspondent

The then minister for justice, Brian Lenihan, moved quickly to give the impression he had a plan to respond to the problem, saying a publicity campaign aimed at young people would be rolled out.

"We have got to get the message across that carrying knives not only carries heavy penalties but can lead to disastrous consequences," he said. The awareness campaign has not yet commenced.

Tackling Ireland's emerging knife culture by targeting young people presupposes it is young people who are at the centre of the problem. While more and more teenagers are carrying and using knives, sometimes with fatal consequences, most attacks involve adults and take place in the home or after excessive consumption of alcohol and drugs. This makes the problem much more complex and difficult to address.

And while the figures for fatal knife attacks last year were alarming, the frequency of such attacks so far this year has fallen back, to nine stabbing deaths.

But fatal attacks account for only a small portion of knife crime. More comprehensive data for non-fatal incidents reveals Ireland's knife culture is no worse now than at any time since 2003.

For example, in 2003 there were 1,088 homicide, assault and robbery crimes involving knives. In the following three years, that figure peaked at 1,232 in 2006 before falling back to 1,032 last year. In the first six months of this year, there were 647 incidents where knives were a factor in a crime.

The figures, which were supplied by the Central Statistics Office, do not include cases where people were investigated for possessing a knife as an offensive weapon.

The only category of knife crime that has increased significantly since 2003 is murder. The number of stabbing murders has increased every year from just four cases in 2003 to 36 last year.

Senior gardaí who spoke to The Irish Times believe more young people than ever are carrying knives or sharpened weapons. They point to the cases of two Polish men stabbed to death in Drimnagh in February, and Dubliner David Rooney, who was stabbed to death in Crumlin in July, as proof that the teenagers involved were either carrying weapons or had them hidden very close to where the random attacks occurred.

Dr Ian O'Donnell, the head of UCD's Institute of Criminology, says a more detailed breakdown of knife-crime statistics is needed to gauge the true extent of Ireland's knife culture. It is only when hot spots are identified that targeted policing and awareness-raising campaigns will be effective.

He believes a very large number of stabbing attacks take place in the home or after drinking sessions, and are carried out by people who did not set out to stab their victims.

"An initiative or awareness campaign on domestic violence might be just as useful as one targeted at young people carrying knives," he says.

A greater number of young people are now carrying knives, mostly because of fear of being attacked or because it has been normalised for them.

"Most of them don't realise that if you carry a knife you're more likely to be stabbed yourself," he says.

However, he adds that while there have been some shocking stabbing cases here involving teenagers, Ireland is still some way off the teenage gang problem in the US and the UK that has in large part created the knife culture in those countries.

"These gangs can be very formally organised on geographical or racial lines, with initiation rituals and so on. And it's when these gangs clash that you see the potential for a serious knife culture and serious violence. But it would be fair to say that we haven't seen those gangs here yet."

Bananaman

I think that the fact that every Tom, Dick & Harry - Politicians & Reporters and people on here have been rattling off how many firearms of what type are owned by whom in what counties and where these dealers live etc. has led to this.

Six months ago hardy anybody in the country knew that you could license a pistol - since then we have had TV, Papers, Talking Heads, Dail reports, boards, emails, letters telling anyone that will listen that there are so many of this in that county that there are ranges at these locations, that there are dealers at these locations.

People keep trying to outdo each other with snippets of information that is not for public consumption. If people want to know this information they should go ask the Gardai who will tell them.

Agreed this poor guy in Tipp had no choice but to give them up - it would be the same if was a car dealership. a bank, a security van, a garda station. These scumbags make no distinction.

The fact that he MAY have had a pistol in the place is in itself rare and would have been a fluke.

B'Man

Sikamick

Bananaman taking the ostrich position will not stop news and it wont do us any favours, papers, TV, Internet, news reporting will always go on.

For far to long the shooting community in this country have kept a low profile.

We are involved in a legitimate sport recognised world wide and have nothing to be embarrassed about. I am proud of my sport and will defend it at all times.

Sikamick

Bananaman wrote: »

I think that the fact that every Tom, Dick & Harry - Politicians & Reporters and people on here have been rattling off how many firearms of what type are owned by whom in what counties and where these dealers live etc. has led to this.

Six months ago hardy anybody in the country knew that you could license a pistol - since then we have had TV, Papers, Talking Heads, Dail reports, boards, emails, letters telling anyone that will listen that there are so many of this in that county that there are ranges at these locations, that there are dealers at these locations.

People keep trying to outdo each other with snippets of information that is not for public consumption. If people want to know this information they should go ask the Gardai who will tell them.

Agreed this poor guy in Tipp had no choice but to give them up - it would be the same if was a car dealership. a bank, a security van, a garda station. These scumbags make no distinction.

The fact that he MAY have had a pistol in the place is in itself rare and would have been a fluke.

B'Man

cavan shooter

When I heard what happened on the news I said "ah ROLLOX" thats all we need. Then my thoughts went to the RFD and thought about what he went through. My house has good security for my shotguns and a rifle, but when someone stands in front of you with a weapon, what use is all the security. Agrevated burgulary must be horrifying, hand them the keys and dont piss them off